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140 6 to 12 volt

W

WAYNE A JOHNSON

Member
I thought I knew what I was doing but I was wrong. All I did was set the 12 volt battery in the tractor. Hook up the negative to ground. the hot goes straight to the starter. discounted the small wire at the solenoid and touch the starter cable to the positive terminal and got sparks, lots of sparks. Nothing else has been touched. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?
 
If you have a generator, the voltage regulator may now have its cutout relay contacts welded closed. If was 12volt to begin with it was probably positive ground (even if it was 6 volt, it was positive ground) the VR closes instantly and is a short to ground when hooked up backwards. The VR and any melted wires are likely the only casualty.
If it has an alternator, it likely has a bad diode in the rectifier bridge. Alternators are mostly negative ground (the way you hooked it up)
so that was correct. Tell us more about what you have for a charging and ignition system. Jim
 
I brought a new alternator single pole. It was originally a 6 volt with a generator and regulator. And it was positive ground. what I don't get is I haven't wired any of that in yet. just put the 12 volt battery in. negative ground and positive to starter. i did put a resister before the coil but nothing is wired in yet, just wanted to see it turn over before I went any further.
 
There is a #10 wire that is usually attached to the starter relay (some call it a solenoid, it is not) terminal that is connected to the battery. Disconnect this wire such that there is no other connection on the terminal except the battery big wire. The smaller wire on the relay (S) terminal supplies voltage to the relay to spin the starter, Disconnect this as well.
Now try the battery connection. It should be free of sparks now.
With it in neutral, and wheels blocked, jump between the bat wire connection on the relay and the S terminal. It should spin the starter.
If the cable sparked when connected as above, the relay is bad. Jim
 
There was two wires connected to the relay, 1 right from the battery and a smaller wire. I did disconnect the smaller wire so the only connection was, battery negative to ground, and battery positive to starter. I cleaned the ground to tractor again to make sure I was getting a good ground and even connected a jumper cable to the negative terminal and grounded that to another part of the tractor.the wire I disconnected goes to the starter switch. Those are the only two wires i saw connected to the relay. Thanks for all your help.
 
"If was 12volt to begin with it was probably positive ground (even if it was 6 volt, it was positive ground) the VR closes instantly and is a short to ground when hooked up backwards."

I don't think thats true. Our '52 Super M got run with the 8v battery in backwards (negative ground) for YEARS and other than the fact it wouldn't charge it didn't seem to hurt anything. I finally realized the problem, turned the battery around and it suddenly started charging...
 
With nothing but the relay hooked to the battery, the relay must be bad, or the Positive cable is grounded to some frame member or the edge of the battery box. The relay is open when not energized from the S terminal, and the other wire (removed) supplied voltage to that, so it is not involved. Jim
 
Thanks for all the help Jim. I do believe the relay is the problem and will replace it. Do you know where I can get a 12 volt relay? All I've been able to fine are 6 volt.
 
Ford relays are cheap and have 4 terminals (marked as follows- Big input terminal from Battery Pos (with the connection to the ign switch). S terminal (from Starter switch) I terminal goeds to coil side of the ballast resistor (helps starting), and big terminal to starter. NAPA and every auto store will have them. Jim
 
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