Inherited Farmall - H

Hind sight being 20/20....regretfully, I never took the time to watch how my Dad started his Farmall Super H.
I"m not totally unfimiliar with the IHC tractors. I had operated a Farmall-C, in my younger days.
Here"s the catch........there has been a "key" switch "jerry-rigged" in to the wiring of the ignition system...(for what purpose?)
This is obviously an "aftermarket" addition.
These tractors don't have "key ingnition" systems, if memory serves.
I have made sure that the battery is new and fully charged. But after about 9 months of putts'n around with it......I still have not been able to get her to "crank over".
The wiring seems pretty simple.......does any one have any suggetions?

Any sign of a spring loaded button that the battery cables connect to?
Maybe the key switch just replaces the pull out on and off switch.
I am not familiar with the location of the starter switch on the Super H, but you should be able to follow the battery cables to find it.

And there may be a small button on the light switch panel that you push to crank er over. The Super H may have a solenoid.


Randy

I'll try to add something even though I don't have a Super H nearby and haven't been close to that series in a number of years. I believe that all Super series had battery ignition, which means that the ignition switch, of whatever kind, turns ON the electricity. If I remember right, the original switches just pulled out for ON and were snapped in for OFF. Some people substituted key-switches for the push-pull type, I guess so they could control who started the thing (of course, with the open wires on the back of the switch, it would be about a 30-second job to run a wire with a couple of clips between them, or even just twist the wires together).NOTE: On early models of the letter-series tractors with MAGNETOS, pushing the switch in to OFF shorted out the magneto, while pulling it out to ON left the grounding circuit open. Different function from the way a battery-ignition circuit works.
These tractors are simplicity itself. The starting drill is simple, after you have checked
radiator, oil level and fuel. 1. Turn on fuel under tank if it is not already on. 2. Climb on. Look down over the beautiful hood and feel like the king of the world for a couple of minutes. I'm prejudiced. I think these tractors have the best lines of anything, ever. They have some minor drawbacks, but looks isn't one of them.3. If the motor is cold, pull the choke rod. It is "down there" on the left. It is easy to identify because the rod goes right to the carburetor choke valve 4. Pull governor lever back part way.5. Operate the starter (find the starter motor and trace back to the platform if the operating
rod isn't obvious).6. As soon as the engine starts to run, reduce the choke until you get a reasonably-smooth run. In a short while, push the choke all the way in. 7. In warm weather, you might need no choke, or just a little. Too much for too long will flood the carb. In that case, choke off, throttle open, operate starter until you get firing.
I don't mean to be patronizing. You may have already figured all this out. In any case, one tractor operates pretty much like another at any one particular period, and most at the time of the Super H were pretty simple.

Further details to questions...
The positive battery cable goes from the battery, to what is deemed the "ignition button", that is spring loaded.
There is an original wire tied in to this junction, that then goes to the "switch box".
(Switch Box = where you could turn on the lights, if needed)
An "original" wire then comes out of the box, and then is pig tailed to a newer wire that then goes to the "key" switch.
The wire on the other side of this switch then is attached to the "coil".
I've been guessing at the right combination of switch positions, with no avail.
When I push in the "ignition button", the only thing that I can hear, is a "clang" coming from the starter.
The one thing that I have not resorted to is the use of a volt meter, to deternime positive flow.

ok could be a couple of things. The easy one is to loosen the starter, the gear may be engaged in the flywheel and stuck in that position. If the starter gear is not stuck be sure that you can turn over the engine by hand to be sure the engine is not stuck.


Randy

Are you sure the engine isnt stuck?

Are you sure the engine isnt stuck?

Are you sure the engine isnt stuck?

Are you sure the engine isnt stuck?

Are you sure the engine isnt stuck?

Holy cow, sorry about that

I have no reason to believe the engine is stuck.
I was able to enjoy the last hay ride the Farmall provided Thankgiving '07.
It has been kept inside the machine shed ever since.
It never got heavy use.....but it did get used.

If you are hearin a the starter "clang"
it sounds like there is another problem. Chk and see of the engine will turn over by hand. Like stated before pull the starter to see of it's stuck. Then try to turn engine over by hand.
Keep us posted on what you find.
Good Luck

The rest of the guys are onto it.

So there's a key switch. It sounds as if if is taking the place of the old mushroom-head, out-to-run, in-to-stop type switch, and not doing anything except providing continuity to the coil. From your descriptions, it also sounds like there's a push-button starter switch.

Is that right?

yes......I believe there is the "starter button".
push in, to let the juice flow through to the starter......only thing.....it does not seem that the juice is flowing through.

one last thing......
If the "starter button" is what is used to start the engine......what is deemed as the "kill switch"?
Albeit....electrical problems always being the worse. I'm almost at the point of "rewiring" the whole ignition syastem.
That's the only way to find out how it works......take it apart.....right?

I do appreciate all the helpful info...
It helps to bounce ideas off of others.

I don't see it mentioned anywhere but have you checked the battery to make sure it's charged and also verified that the cable connections are clean and tight?

Okay. It seems like you can follow wires alright. And from your descriptions, it sounds like you're set up for negative ground which suggests you're running 12v on an alternator???

If you don't see a solenoid anyplace in the works, check out the diagrams on the link below. BobM, who is around here a lot, has very kindly worked up some clear wiring diagrams and makes them available at the link. Check out #3 to begin with. It shows a saddle-mounted starter switch, but Bob notes that there might be a separate loop that the schematic doesn't show that would accommodate a remote starter switch.

If that isn't just it look around the others to see if one is a better fit.
BobMs Very Excellent Wiring Diagrams

(quoted from post at 20:05:39 11/17/09) one last thing......
If the "starter button" is what is used to start the engine......what is deemed as the "kill switch"?
Albeit....electrical problems always being the worse. I'm almost at the point of "rewiring" the whole ignition syastem.
That's the only way to find out how it works......take it apart.....right?

I do appreciate all the helpful info...
It helps to bounce ideas off of others.

Click to expand...

If wired as you describe, the key switch (or 'ignition' switch) controls battery power to the coil (and the rest of the ignition thereafter). This key would be turned ON to allow the tractor to run, and OFF to stop the engine. That's your 'kill switch'.

When the ignition is ON with the key switch, the other electrical thing that has to happen is to energize the starter (with the spring-loaded button) to start the engine turning over so it can fire. This last part is where you seem to have a problem.

These old tractors would engage the starter whether or not the ignition was ON or OFF--two totally separate circuits, except for the battery. Bottom line, you need to get the motor to turn AND you need well-timed sparks at the plugs--two very separate things.

You need to use a volt meter to see if battery
voltage is getting to the starter while a helper pushes the starter button. You may want to start at the starter button to see if battery voltage is being fed to one side of the starter button. It may be fed off the ignition switch.
Bob M's wiring diagram should show how it may have been wired when new. You will also need to to see if battery voltage is reaching the coil when the ignition switch is in the on position. It will shutoff the engine when the switch is in the off position as it stops the flow of battery voltage. Hal

You said the engine wouldn't crank. That usually means the engine won't turn over. If it won't start means the engine is cranking over, but won't start. Either you're not getting fire to your plugs or no gas is reaching the engine if it won't start. Hal

Too my best guess.....I too believe that the "key" switch is the "kill" switch.
It was "splcied in line" of the curcuit.
I need to try to verify under which combination that the coil is getting juice.

I've just gotten flusterd.
Needed the helpful input to give me a renewed spark.....ha ha.

I've had several H's and one SH that I didn't keep very long.
So I will just throw some things out there and see what happens.
When you say it won't crank over do you mean the engine will not turn over or it wont fire?
Your starter may be hung up in the flywheel, loosen the starter bolts about a 1/4 inch should free it up.
Make sure all battery and wire connects are clean and secure.
Get yourself a couple good jumper wires and bypass whatever you think is a "switch".
IF your tractor has a solenoid on top of the starter you can use a screwdriver and short the starter battery cable to the solenoid terminal just to see if it will turn over.
IF your tractor does not have a solenoid you can jump the 'hot' (ungrounded) side of your battery to the starter terminal and it should turn over.
You could pull the tractor to see if the engine is stuck. (use high gear)
Good Luck,
Dell

Does the wire from your push button go straight to the starter? Or from push button to a solenoid,then to the starter?I had an M with a key switch and a solenoid,solenoids often go bad