Thermostat on Super C.... is it working???

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Problem: my temperature guage needle needs extreme temperatures and work load to budge.

Well, I asked about this in the past and had a couple responses. I will tell you what I found so far. Sorry if this topic has been covered in excess.

I removed the engine cover and the front radiator cover. I emptied the anti-freeze through the drain at under the front bolster (I think that is what it is called). I removed the clamps at the top radiator hose and slid it up. I found the gap too narrow to wiggle out the thermostat. I felt stuck at that point.

I needed to loosen the lower radiator bolts to rock the radiator forward and out of the way. But, my loader is in the way. So, I lifted the loader up and forward. I was able to remove the nuts and tilt the top of the radiator forward and remove the thermostat. It was the original style thermostat and it is rated at 165 to 195 degrees. The retainer was intact and sitting in the groove.

I put my NOS thermostat and the one I removed from the tractor in a kettle of water and heated it while monitoring it with a thermometer. They both opened roughly at 165 degrees and eventually went fully open by 195 degrees. My problem is likely not the thermostat.

As people said, it is likely because I rarely every load my tractor and it has built in over capacity for heat dissipation.

The parts manual shows two temp range temp gauges, I suppose
The temp gauge could be dis-functional? Or, everything is working fine.

Jim.ME · Jan 23, 2021

Its pretty easy to check the temperature with a temp gun and compare what you get for readings to the tractor's gauge.

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Continued....

Since I took the loader off, I was so far in there I decided to do preventive maintenance. I removed the radiator, remove the lower hose and removed the belts. Everything has been used for 30 years. My belts were worn and slipping and I had very little tension adjustment left. Off they came.

I ordered new belts. You have to pay attention to the tractor serial number when ordering one of the belts. I forget which one.

And, I ordered a water pump rebuild kit! Whoopy! I figured why not since I am in there and my tractor has served me so well for so long. I will update it! It is hard for me to work on stuff so I will get it done while I can.

And, I order a new upper and lower radiator hose clamp. I could get scolded for doing all this but my tractor has earned its keep. Like I said, I have to do this while I physically still can.

I will try to post some pictures soon. Terr

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

There are no numbers on the temp gauge, just colors if I recall correctly.

It will be a week before my parts start showing up. I might show pictures on rebuilding the water pump.

I don't own a temp gun but I could probably afford one.

Thanks for the comment. Terr

rustred · Jan 23, 2021

yes, handiest thing for that. and you can compare the top temperature to the bottom of rad temperature which will be cooler.

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Nice. I have had times when I wished I had one. If you start up a new engine that is fresh rebuild, I have always wished I had one. I would like to see how the engine is warming compared to the temp gauge.... ie car engine first time start up.

Janicholson · Jan 23, 2021

IHC made bypasses in the thermostat housing that were pretty massive. as a result the coolant stays below optimal temperature when not working it hard.Putting a
stainless steel thin metal plate in the haousing and 2 gaskets works. Where the bypass coolant path is located, I put a 1/4 inch hole. this doesn't cause
problems, and allows the thermostat to open within its working range. Soft stainless can be cut with tin snips from the gasket pattern. Jim

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Does a Farmall Super C have this by-pass built into it? I seem to recall it doesn't have this.

Is it possible the by-pass is internally located under the thermostat housing?

Thanks, Terr

Janicholson · Jan 23, 2021

As far as I know it does. It is not a hose, it is a port that parallels the thermostat. It (IIRC) is "D" shaped. There may be a circulation bypass that is a
hose. this one goes to the radiator. Jim

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Well, I will remove the therm housing and look inside. I will let you know what I find. Making a gasket for it should be easy and I can put some sealer on it. I am curious. If it has a by-pass, I will try shrinking it down with a stainless reducer. I think you said 1/4 inch is ideal? Terr

David G · Jan 23, 2021

I think 1/8 bypass is plenty.

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Hmmmmmmm..... we'er getting smaller :shock:

David G · Jan 23, 2021

It only needs to be big enough to let the air bleed out.

Jim Becker · Jan 23, 2021

The large bypass applies to the H and M. I don't think the Super C has an equivalent situation.

You might test your temperature gauge in a kettle of hot water.

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

Hmmmmmm, I think I am confused or there is no by-pass hole involved with the thermostat housing and cylinder head. Maybe there is one involved with the water pump. I will take that off tomorrow. I am going to try and post some pictures of my project. If anyone can think of anything else I can do it there while it is all apart like this, let me know. Today I cleaned a few parts and washed out the inside of the fan housing. I am amazed at how that thing survives. I am sure it is as it was original to the tractor and I detect no wear in it. I keep oil in it. Kinda neat how it works.

I am going to try and post pictures...

If you look at that 5th photo that shows the upper radiator/grill support bracket.... is that supposed to have that bend in it. I recall years ago that my front grill had a dent in it that was good size. Did it bend that bracket a bit?? I think it did.

Jim Becker · Jan 23, 2021

Looks like a bypass hole can be seen in the thermostat in your picture, slightly towards the camera from the center of the thermostat.

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

The little hole in the thermostat. I call that a burp hole. Allows air to come out of the cooling system as you fill the tractor with anti-freeze.

I thought the by-pass hole we were talking about was something larger that allowed the water to circulate inside the block when the thermostat was closed.
:roll:

Jim Becker · Jan 23, 2021

This system isn't that complicated. Look back at what David G said. You have the upper elbow off the head. See a second passage there?

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

I will look. Is it inside the head?

tfringo · Jan 23, 2021

I will look. Is it inside the head?

used red MN · Jan 24, 2021

So what is the real issue you just want the temp
gauge to move up so it looks like you are getting
something for the gas you are burning? Never worked
on a Super C more of an H or bigger guy. How loose
does that thermostat fit in the upper water outlet? If it
is kind of loose and it looks like coolant could get past
it here is what I would suggest if you really like to see
that temp needle waving around. Remove the
thermostat, get a wire brush or some sand paper and
clean up the ID of the outlet where the thermostat
seats. Now here is where some foo foo replies will
come back. Take some RTV and run a 1/8” or less
bead around the ID of the outlet where the Tstat will
set. Install the the thermostat with the bleed hole
towards the back of the tractor and put the snap ring
in. Put it all back together and use it like before. It will
run no different than before but it may let you see the
temp needle move at least just a little.

tfringo · Jan 24, 2021

I will try that. Thanks

caterpillar guy · Jan 24, 2021

If when done it will not get to the desired temperature put a bag over the radiator. We used to have a piece of carpet we put over our MD to help it keep temp in the winter. All it did was grind feed and run a feeding wagon so it never ran for all that long at a time. When it was on the drier all day and all night never shut off only to check the oil we didn't have it on then.

timcasbolt · Jan 24, 2021

(quoted from post at 18:12:26 01/23/21) There are no numbers on the temp gauge, just colors if I recall correctly.

It will be a week before my parts start showing up. I might show pictures on rebuilding the water pump.

[b:179b51715a]I don't own a temp gun but I could probably afford one. [/b:179b51715a]

Thanks for the comment. Terr

nder $10 on ebay. I have one. It works fine.

tfringo · Jan 24, 2021

I didnt realize they were so pricey. Ha! Might shop for a used one that has some quality to it. Thanks! Terr

Jim Becker · Jan 24, 2021

(quoted from post at 00:14:10 01/24/21) I will look. Is it inside the head?

hat was a rhetorical question. There isn't one.

tfringo · Jan 24, 2021

Yup. :shock:

gene bender · Jan 26, 2021

So what are you worrying about what is the temp with a thermometer when
engine runs and stop worrying about what the guage reads have you checked the
guage in a container of water with a thermometer

BarnyardEngineering · Jan 26, 2021

The burp hole is the bypass hole.

Thinking about it, the purpose of any thermostat bypass is to bypass the thermostat, so it would have to be AT the thermostat. Not in the head. Not in the water pump. Logically the bypass would have to be in the thermostat itself, or the thermostat housing. It can't be anywhere else or it would not be bypassing the thermostat. There's no other way for the water to get into the radiator.

What you're doing is a good learning experience, but wholly unnecessary. These engines don't get hot unless you're really working them hard or there is something wrong. An engine that won't heat up is a good sign.

Thermostat on Super C.... is it working???

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