Valve Adjustment?

Okidokee - I am sure I will get flamed for EVEN posting this question as it will ruffle some folks feathers, but here goes. 😀

Aside from overlap and when TDC or BDC, a cylinder is in either the power stroke, the compression stroke, the intake stroke or the exhaust stroke, right?

If the cam lobe opens only for the correlating stroke and the spring keeps it closed for the others - why can't we put the pistons in a half-stroke position, say #1 is halfway through labor stroke, thereby knowing #1 has both valves closed, #3 has both closed, #4 has exhaust closed and #2 has intake closed.

Then at one time, adjust 6 valves at once, turn one (or 1/2) revolution and finish the last 2.

???
 
Because it is not a sure thing. The valves in a properly designed engine don't open with a snap at the beginning of a stroke, or close at the end of a stroke. The computational fluid dynamics of best cylinder filling was seat of the pants and experience when these were made. Valve overlap, valve clearance ramp angle, duration, Lift height, and clearance ramp configurations are all involved. If you want to make an engine run horribly, regrind the cam to be having both valves closed on #1TDC. It is a Fail. Today the cams are being adjusted by hydraulic systems and computer control to make the real computational fluid dynamics done on mainframes that engineers know how to operate hooked to test engines in dyno rooms become operational in our cars. Do what we told you to do. They all work, and almost all other ways will not. Jim
 
Where I said it is a fail, I also intended to include the #4 cylinders valves closed, they are not. Jim
 
I was tought to adjust valves this way. When the intake valve is open you adjust the exhaust and when the exhaust valve is open you adjust the intake that way there is never a mistake as in where the cam it sitting and what the push rods are or not at
 
Hi Jim,

Adjustment is already done brother - this was a question on theory.

I totally get all the dynamics at play with potential overlap, delay, etc.

I was thinking we could be talking, 10, 20 percent max, not near/at or above 50% of the stroke - seems wildly inefficient if that is the case.

Honestly though, why all the "just do as we told attitude" by so many folks?

I definitely appreciate the "well it can be done but in theory there are variables at play which could cause a hiccup" response.

Where on earth you came up with regrinding the cam to have #1 closed on TDC? Who knows?

Anywho enjoy your Saturday
 
ya because you could not grasp the way mechanic's do it lol. i did it that way on a 1 cyl. iron horse engine when i was 9 years old. glad you got it though now you wont bug us and have time to make bread.
 
is this a 4 cylinder , gas engine, similar to farmall cub? if so dale shaw has a method. # 1 on tdc. adjust #1 valves, plus. others, turn engine , then adjust the rest. i will have to ask or look at my notes.
 
Hahaha, if I was asking specifically how to do something and the answer was turn here, then tighten there, I woukd agree with you.

But if someome asks, WHY do I turn here and tighten there? WHAT about tightening there and turning here?

And the "old guys" freak out and blow a gasket - then that is on the "old guys" - not me.
 
yes 4 cyl and we all know the procedures except this beer and bread man . just cant convince him the way mechanic's have been doing it all these years.
cvphoto52750.jpg
 
Wow, you were setting valves at age 9!

That's crazy.

When I was playing sports and making pies - all different concoctions - mixing strawberries with blueberries, cherries with apples - just wild stuff. All true by the way 😀
 
Hi Rusty,

I get how mechanics do it - just also like to think about potential different ways, better ways, worse ways and why it's worse etc.

Guess that's why you are you and me is me 😊

Interesting factoid - I actually don't drink, like rarely ever - it's just a handle. 😁
 
I see you say you already have the valves adjusted. It is all about making the clearance setting on the ...base circle... of the cam. Or in other words the parts that is not the lobe that raises the lifter. If you like messing around a lot and turning the crankshaft way more than is needed follow this procedure. Turn the engine watch number one exhaust valve, front valve on the head nearest the fan. When it opens turn the crank so the push rod has moved an eight inch to open the valve. Now adjust the number one intake valve. Then turn the crank until you see it move the number one intake push rod an eight inch then adjust the number one exhaust valve. Then continue this process with number 3 cylinder, then 4 and then 2. By the time your finished you should be plenty wore out. The movement of one valve assures the other valve for that cylinder is on its base circle. I try to generally use the double TDC method, much less monkeying around and proven to work. As for the ...I told you once this is how it is done or the my way or the highway crowd that is what you have here take it or leave it, it is up to you. If you stick it out there is a lot of good info here. By the way let’s see how close you read these replies. If you want a scanned electronic copy of a IH service manual for an M send me an email from Classic. Then maybe you will ask fewer questions here an stick to the champagne and beer. Have you ever told us what field of work you were in most of your life?
 
probably not old enough to drink, as by your emogy's everything is a joke, cant figure out the valve adjustment , and kept changing your story, and making no sense anymore and don't think you can bake bread either. come on here all high and mighty trying to be the farmall m king. the more you posted the more i could tell you were more interested in making posts than doing the actual job and making this a play game. i sure dont mind to help anybody but once they start playing games i can play also.
 
Hi used red mn,

Yeah, set them today - waiting on gaskets to come in and to get the pto back in, filled up with fluids and she should be done - very excited.

Regarding the crowd here, by and large I think the majority are awesome and have really learned a lot.

I do try to read all the replies - even have the button clicked where I am supposed to get an email when someone replies, but never do?

Haha, yeah, I bet with a service manual it would answer lots of questions - does it have the goofy cartoons like the owner's manual? 😁

As for my past life?

Well,

Education: engineering, biomed and material science

Work: biomed and materials development in the bay area, b2b consulting in LA, ran a couple groups: retail, tech/engineering sector, higher education, top 100 firms, legal etc - got hooked into commercial developments for these companies.

Did alright, grew up and realized the disgusting cesspool that is LA and Hollywood, retired and moved back to MI with my wife to take care of estate, got into farming, found YT and here I am 😀
 
Hahah, yes, I am old enough to drink, but did enough of that back in college to last a couple lifetimes 😀

Hehe, Farmall M King? I dunno about that, I think someone else has already that title. 😉

I dunno about the changing my story bit, think I have been pretty consistent. If you read into it differently, well, sorry?

As for the posts, yeah, I know there have been a lot - thankfully that is gonna decrease now that I got the electrical done, 12v upgraded, pto on standby, valves adjusted etc etc.

And yes, I actually go out and do the work after I get an acceptable response - just like when you mentioned the pistons - went straight outside and checked, remember? 😊

Bread? I am definitely not claiming to be a good bread maker. My wife is awesome at it though and yes, you do want to keep the salt and sugar away from the yeast 😀
 
figured I add to the arguments by posting as off topic a post as possible, at least it is about adjusting valves but how about it being about a four banger Cat diesel? Here is how cat says to adjust them in a 3304B:

mvphoto60023.jpg

[/img:f9d9d81b37]
 
Hey Jim,

Looking at the M here after the adjustments yesterday and wondering...

I can see how too tight or closed would be problematic (along with way too open adjustment) but what about the fine differences between say (.02 and .021, or .02 and .019)?

Considering we are working with a "feel" perception for setting the adjustment, are we only talking a lower performance if off a hair?

Thanks 😀
 
The cam profile is designed to have opening and closing ramps that do nothing but take up the clearance in the system. .017 warm, .020 cold. The ramps are designed to keep the valve train from making noise. They modest in length (degrees of turn) but are essential in mechanical (non hydraulic lifter) valve train. If set too tight, lets say .015, when hot, the valve gets lifted a smidge too soon, but only a tiny bit, which causes gasses to pas by the face of the valve when they should not (either in or out) this can cause poor running from an early opening intake, and burnt valves from the hot exhaust gasses if on the exhaust valve.
If adjusted too loose, performance again suffers because neither valve is open as long as it is intended by the engineer. It also allows the lift profile of the cam (opening) to slap against the lifter, making noise that can cause extra wear, and is annoying. Jim
 

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Back
Top