(800) 853-2651
SHOP NOW

Farmall H was running and suddenly quit, crank wont turn

B

Blazey

New User
My Farmall H has been sitting for a couple of years. Put a new battery in and changed the fluids. Tractor started right up and ran fine for an hour. The next day it started ok and I drove it out of the barn to pressure wash it. After washing started right up and ran for only a few seconds then quit. Starter won't turn it over. Engine appears to be seized or locked. Suspecting a broken connecting rod I dropped the oil pan. All rods look OK. Removed gstarter then tried to rock the tractor in fifth gear to see if the engine will turn. No luck. Any ideas what could be wrong?
 
(quoted from post at 18:14:09 07/21/19) Can you turn it with a hand crank?
Click to expand...

Won't turn with a hand crank. Before this happened I could turn it over slowly by turning the fan.
 
Starter stuck in flywheel. Loosen starter and when it makes a noise put back in.All will be good till next time. Common problem in IH tractors of that era.
 
(quoted from post at 18:36:06 07/21/19) Starter stuck in flywheel. Loosen starter and when it makes a noise put back in.All will be good till next time. Common problem in IH tractors of that era.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the idea, but I already removed the starter with no improvement.

Please keep those ideas coming.
 

I will pull the plugs in the morning, but I don't see how it could hydrolock while it was running. Am I missing something?

Something caused the engine to quit just as I advanced the throttle after running only a couple of seconds. Then it was locked up.
 
If you got water in the air cleaner oil cup, increasing the throttle could have drawn a slug of water into a cylinder. Jim
 
many fail to realize that when washing with a pressure washer you stay away from certain engine parts. plus after washing I have very rarely seen engine just start right up. usually the distributor gets wet and has to be dryed out first. did you fill it with new oil if you drained the old stuff? that has certainly happened, even though it sounds stupid. you will never turn that engine again without a tear down if this happened. you asked.
 
Well I hope you didn?t run a slug of water in a cylinder as Jim suggested but it is possible. Maybe
the ignition was wet and quit firing or water got in the carb bowl. I wonder if you may have just
gotten it locked in two gears while messing with it in the heat of battle. Have someone hold the
clutch down or block it down and then try to crank the engine.
 

All very good ideas. First off, when I pressure washed it I concentrated on the radiator forward. There had been a mouse nest and considerable grease buildup under the front grill and on the steering box. I did not get any water near the magneto or the breather intake (which I cleaned and refilled with oil the day before). I agree it would have never started after washing if the distributor cap had gotten wet.

Please keep the ideas coming, we are eliminating a lot of possible issues!
 
Thanks for your post. I agree that it would be possible to cause the engine to seize if I forgot to refill the oil after changing it but that's not the case here. The day before this happened I drained the oil and refilled with 6 quarts of 30W non-detergent oil. When I ran the tractor for an hour after changing the oil it had good oil pressure.

When the engine stopped today after running only a couple of seconds, I drained the oil and dropped the oil pan to look at the connecting rods. The oil looked fine and there was plenty of it.

Please keep the ideas coming.
 
Thanks for your post! The transmission seems fine. I can shift into any gear and rock it but the flywheel won't budge (I can clearly see the flywheel because I already removed the starter). I feel confident it is not locked in 2 gears because I can shift it into neutral and it rolls fine.

I don't want to go there until we exhaust all other possibilities, but my gut is starting to make me think I may have spun or seized a main bearing.

Please keep the ideas coming. Collectively you all have a lot of experience and we are bound to find the cause of the problem.
 
Pressure washing can do odd things. I washed my H real good, and filled up the oil cleaner cup with soapy water and rinse water. She ran, but it wasn't right until I drained all the water out. I'd sure check that. Could you have sucked a load of water in?
 
I have a 1945 H wtch did exactly the same thing, took the magneto off and the
impulse coupling had broke and jammed up. This is a wartime lease lend tractor with
no electrics but it useually starts on the first or the second crank of the handle.
MJ
 
I never got any water near the air cleaner. It's not a fuel, air, carburetor, or starter issue. The crankshaft won't turn.
 
One bit of advice I can give is, don't discount ANYTHING until you've actually looked, and you are sure of what you're looking at.

Pull the valve cover after pulling the plugs. It's a very quick and easy thing to do, just a couple of bolts and moving a wire out of the way. You can then see if maybe it dropped a valve.
 

I have not tried to pry the flywheel. I am a little concerned about chipping a tooth. It seems if rocking in fifth gear won't budge it something has it locked pretty hard.
 

MORNING UPDATE:

No success yet, but accomplished the following this morning:

Removed spark plugs, cylinders dry.

Checked oil bath air cleaner, just nice clean oil. No water.

Removed magneto. Impulse is intact and free.

Removed valve cover. No apparent valve issues.

I am going to look at the valves with a bore scope next.

Where do I go from here???
 
Have you tried to turn it over with the clutch pedal locked down?? Transmission could be if you have not tried it with the clutch pushed down
 
One issue not addressed is the timing gears. The H gears before mid 1950, are aluminum. they have a history of failure from hydraulic pumps being used between
the ignition system and front cover. They can also fail from wear over time and hours. A failed gear would sure show up as a stuck engine if it went down at
idle, A fiber optic module used with a cell phone could look through the oil fill hole, or a removed governor or distributor drive/pump hole. Jim
 
Hard to check, but eventually might have to pull
the front timing cover to see if something is in
the crank/ cam gear teeth.

Don't think the oil pump locking up would make
the crank tight as a drum, but would bear looking
into---drop the pump & see.

I'm assuming you have loosened the fan belt to
see if the water pump or gen is locked??
Jim
 

Thanks Jim,

Fan turns and the generator has been removed. Will bore scope the timing gears next.
 
quote="Blazey"](reply to post at 23:50:18 07/21/19) [/quote]

GOOD NEWS! We are making progress! The crankshaft is no longer "Stuck Hard". I put a block of wood inside the crankcase to pry the #4 rod cap with a small bar and broke the crankshaft loose. I can now turn the crank by pulling on a fan blade. By rotating a rear tire in fifth gear I can turn the crankshaft nearly 1 full revolution back and forth. Then it comes to a hard stop in either direction. All the valves appear to by moving as they should. There is no extra lash on any rocker arm like I would expect with a stuck valve. No extra pieces in any of the cylinders.

What should I try next?
 
I'd say pull the head off and make sure you do not have a badly scared cylinder wall in one of more cylinder due to a broken ring or some such thing
 
check the rod brg's on crank. should be able to move the rod to each side of the crank journal. this is just a quick check to make sure you don't have a turned brg. plus you would see the rod a blueish color from heat. so what did you do to get crank to turn. is the engine still in time?
 

I put a pry bar against a rod bearing cap and gently nudged the crankshaft. Once it broke free I can rotate the crankshaft 7/8 of a turn back and forth by rotating the rear wheel in fifth gear.

When the crankshaft makes a hard stop in either direction, pistons 2 & 3 are nearly top dead center. I would seem that there is something in the cylinder stopping the piston travel,although I cannot find anything through the sparkplug hole, either visually or with a bore scope.

I drained the cooling system tonight.I will pull the head off next.
 
Don't overlook external items, such as generator, water pump, distributor/magneto, or even governor. Since the starter is off, use a small pry bar or big screwdriver to see if you can turn engine backwards. If it will turn backwards a good ways, it may have a rocker arm or valve stuck.
 
Did you pull the plugs to see if
water shoots out of one of the
spark plug holes? First thing to
come to my mind is water got in
the air intake somewhere and it
took a few engine revolutions to
suck in a big gulp. Had that
happen with a Wisconsin engine
only it sucked in a mouthful of
powdered rust and broke the
Piston.
 
Thanks again for all of your great and helpful ideas. This morning I was able to rotate the crankshaft. I ran a magnet through all the spark plug holes and looked with a bore scope. No abnormalities seen. I blew out each cylinder through the spark plug hole and very little carbon came out. Then it would rotate. I reinstalled the starter and performed a compression test. The values weren't great but it should run. Ordered an oil pan gasket and should be able to start it in a few days.

Thanks to all!
 
I sure would not be content till I found out what is going on with it. I bought a w6 that was in running order. I said to the owner the engine is seized. he said he just had it running. but anyhow when the temperature would drop below freezing it would not turn over. was a bunch of dirt around flywheel that would freeze to it .
 
I bought a 706 ih diesel Tite at a auction many years ago and soaked it and pryed on flywheel teeth and runs like a dream. Bought a 51 M Tite . Loosened rod bolts and rocked it. Runs A1
 
(quoted from post at 16:22:47 07/23/19) Thanks again for all of your great and helpful ideas. This morning I was able to rotate the crankshaft. I ran a magnet through all the spark plug holes and looked with a bore scope. No abnormalities seen. I blew out each cylinder through the spark plug hole and very little carbon came out. Then it would rotate. I reinstalled the starter and performed a compression test. The values weren't great but it should run. Ordered an oil pan gasket and should be able to start it in a few days.

Thanks to all!
Click to expand...
Oil pan back on, runs great again. Never did find any debris in the cylinders. Thanks again for all of your ideas!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

3
Farmall H Carb
Replies
5
Views
264
Rich'sToys
R
G
Farmall H C152 piston ring help
Replies
11
Views
355
Highwayman
H
F
Solenoid connect Farmall H
Replies
9
Views
634
cleddy
C
M
Super H won't stay running and is rough
Replies
7
Views
776
Janicholson
Janicholson
T
YM SA424 SHUTS OFF
Replies
0
Views
705
winston-HT
W
Tractor Parts Tractor Manuals

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Copyright © 1997-2024 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters
Website Accessibility Policy

Back
Top