Lift Pump on British 444 Diesel

HappyJack

Member
The continuing saga of "my tractor won't run for longer than 45 minutes...."

I have a 1977 British built 444 diesel. I bought it used early this summer. Since I have had it, it has been stalling after about 45 minutes of use. So far I have cleaned out the fuel tank (very dirty), changed out all the washers on the banjo bolts and flushed each line. I also changed the thermostat and coolant after a rad flush. I still need to get a new temperature gauge as the one on it isn't working.

It starts and runs well with lots of power, never skipping a beat, until about 45 minutes into running.

Yesterday it stalled again so I pulled the cover off of the lifter pump to find it packed with crud - filaments it seemed. I pulled the pump, cleaned it out and reassembled. By working the priming lever it pumped air so I reassembled it. When I put it back on the tractor and re-attached the fuel lines it wouldn't pump. I started to take it off. After a few twists of the bolts I tried the priming lever again and it worked. Tighten it up and it doesn't...... Loosen it and it pumps - I can hear air moving out of the fitting just before the fuel filters (loosened to prime).

I started the tractor with it loose. Ran like a top. I tightened the bolts and it stalled within 5 minutes. I don't know how long it would have ran with it loose as I believe it would have completely wrecked the pump with it loose.

Any thoughts? A neighbour thinks the pump is worn out. Everything seems tight to me when I had it off and in my hands. My simple, uneducated mind says I need to double or triple the gaskets between the pump and the block to get the arm out a bit......

Thanks in advance.

Scotty
 

I forgot to mention that I loosened the fuel line that comes from the pump to the fuel filter and cranked the engine. No fuel came out of the line.
 
Hi HappyJack, it has been about 40 years since I worked on the lift pump on the BD-154 engine.I remember a PITA eye on the lower
side of the diaphragm that had to be hooked on the actuator lever. Also actuator lever had to be on the correct side of the cam
lobe.

JimB
444 Lift Pump Diaphram
 
(quoted from post at 15:28:50 09/30/18) Hi HappyJack, it has been about 40 years since I worked on the lift pump on the BD-154 engine.I remember a PITA eye on the lower
side of the diaphragm that had to be hooked on the actuator lever. Also actuator lever had to be on the correct side of the cam
lobe.

JimB
444 Lift Pump Diaphram

Thanks Jim. I had the pump off and could work the priming arm. It seemed to work ok - air sucked in one hole and came out the other. Worked the same on the tractor as long as it was loose. As I pumped the lever I could hear air movement at the fuel filter. It just seems to be binding on something when I tighten it.

I read an old post on this forum about the cam wearing unevenly causing troubles. I'll investigate that next.

Scotty
 
I did away with the mechanical fuel pump and put on an electric pump. Wire it so it comes on when you turn on the ignition switch.
 
(quoted from post at 02:35:33 10/01/18) I did away with the mechanical fuel pump and put on an electric pump. Wire it so it comes on when you turn on the ignition switch.

Thanks for the advice Phil. That thought has been on my mind. Could you tell me what you bought for a pump?

Thanks

Scotty
 
I have an older model 444 diesel and having similar issues. However, mine has no fuel pump just gravity flow to injector pump. Raking in hay
or running with any load and it will just stop running after she gets good and hot. I haven't figured mine out yet either. After it sits awhile I can
bleed injectors and she will start right up. I had intended to drain tank this winter, probably still will, and check for debris but the comment about
the fuel cap vent has me thinking....
 
The prime lever may only be able to stroke the pump if the cam lobe that drives is is on the base
circle or not activating the fuel pump mechanism. So this would explain the why it would not
activate with the prime lever when bolted tight to the engines. When it is bolted tight and you
move the priming lever and you feel like it has no resistance bump the starter to get about a one
turn on the engine, then try the lever again it should now have resistance and activate the pump
diaphragm. This does not really explain why it did not pump when you had the line opened and
cranked the engine. Now I will ask a question that is almost insane but needs to ask anyway. I
presume you have replaced the fuel filter? It was never mentioned by you and one never knows
when folks might over look the obvious. Secondly, how did you clean the tank? Did you remove it?
I have never worked on that model tractor but most IH tractors have baffles in the tank and it is
very difficult to clean a tank in place. Ideally it is best to remove it and put something in it like small
nuts or washers that can get past the baffle and shake it or roll it around until you are tired and
then do it some more. Then dump that out and power wash it out or at least rinse it out with a
garden hose. Then get as much water out as you can with a rag on a wire. Then set it in the sun
or under a heat lamp to dry. Even after this more crud will come out of it to plug things up.
 
(quoted from post at 11:30:33 10/02/18) The prime lever may only be able to stroke the pump if the cam lobe that drives is is on the base
circle or not activating the fuel pump mechanism. So this would explain the why it would not
activate with the prime lever when bolted tight to the engines. When it is bolted tight and you
move the priming lever and you feel like it has no resistance bump the starter to get about a one
turn on the engine, then try the lever again it should now have resistance and activate the pump
diaphragm. This does not really explain why it did not pump when you had the line opened and
cranked the engine. Now I will ask a question that is almost insane but needs to ask anyway. I
presume you have replaced the fuel filter? It was never mentioned by you and one never knows
when folks might over look the obvious. Secondly, how did you clean the tank? Did you remove it?
I have never worked on that model tractor but most IH tractors have baffles in the tank and it is
very difficult to clean a tank in place. Ideally it is best to remove it and put something in it like small
nuts or washers that can get past the baffle and shake it or roll it around until you are tired and
then do it some more. Then dump that out and power wash it out or at least rinse it out with a
garden hose. Then get as much water out as you can with a rag on a wire. Then set it in the sun
or under a heat lamp to dry. Even after this more crud will come out of it to plug things up.

Good information on the priming lever. Thanks

The fuel filters are new.

I cleaned the tank by draining out as much of the old fuel as I could then I used a vacuum assembly to suck out the bottom of the tank. I then added clean fuel back and sucked it dry again. Did this several more times until it came out clear. I did this for both sides - there appears to be a small hump in the middle.

I agree that taking the tank out is the best solution, however, on this tractor it is quite involved to remove. I cleaned the tank on my Super A the way you described but it only had four bolts holding it in place, not the battery box and dash, etc.

I am thinking I need to investigate wear on either the cam lobe or the pump arm (side to side).

Thanks.

Scotty
 
(quoted from post at 15:43:45 10/02/18)
(quoted from post at 11:30:33 10/02/18) The prime lever may only be able to stroke the pump if the cam lobe that drives is is on the base
circle or not activating the fuel pump mechanism. So this would explain the why it would not
activate with the prime lever when bolted tight to the engines. When it is bolted tight and you
move the priming lever and you feel like it has no resistance bump the starter to get about a one
turn on the engine, then try the lever again it should now have resistance and activate the pump
diaphragm. This does not really explain why it did not pump when you had the line opened and
cranked the engine. Now I will ask a question that is almost insane but needs to ask anyway. I
presume you have replaced the fuel filter? It was never mentioned by you and one never knows
when folks might over look the obvious. Secondly, how did you clean the tank? Did you remove it?
I have never worked on that model tractor but most IH tractors have baffles in the tank and it is
very difficult to clean a tank in place. Ideally it is best to remove it and put something in it like small
nuts or washers that can get past the baffle and shake it or roll it around until you are tired and
then do it some more. Then dump that out and power wash it out or at least rinse it out with a
garden hose. Then get as much water out as you can with a rag on a wire. Then set it in the sun
or under a heat lamp to dry. Even after this more crud will come out of it to plug things up.

Good information on the priming lever. Thanks

The fuel filters are new.

I cleaned the tank by draining out as much of the old fuel as I could then I used a vacuum assembly to suck out the bottom of the tank. I then added clean fuel back and sucked it dry again. Did this several more times until it came out clear. I did this for both sides - there appears to be a small hump in the middle.

I agree that taking the tank out is the best solution, however, on this tractor it is quite involved to remove. I cleaned the tank on my Super A the way you described but it only had four bolts holding it in place, not the battery box and dash, etc.

I am thinking I need to investigate wear on either the cam lobe or the pump arm (side to side).

Thanks.

Scotty

So I finally managed to get time to tinker with the tractor again. I pulled the lift pump off again (any adivce on how to get to that thing? I'm still cramped from using the box end wrench and turning it 1/12 a turn at a time...) and checked for wear.

The rocker arm moves side to side about 3/16 of an inch. It also moves in and out about the same. I'm assuming this is too much wear.

The cam shaft lobe inside the engine did not appear to have any noticeable wear.

I'm off to my Case dealer today to price out a pump from them. If its too much I'll hit up the internet.

Scotty
 

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