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Discussion Forum

Is this a Super A or just an A?

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03-11-2001 08:31:16

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I have what I think is a super A. The main question is with the standard hydraulics. When they came out with the Super A in 1952, was there a point in which the carry over model 51 or early 52's come without standard hydraulics? I have had this tractor for 4 years and have pulled whatever available numbers off it to confirm it with the local case/ih dealer. They indeed told me it was a 1952 Super A. I purchased the manuals and noticed there were no hydraulics on the tractor as depicted in the pictures. It does however have an aftermarket hydraulic system and was converted to a 12 volt system. All original electronics do not appear as original as well. In addition it has the Super A sticker on it, but everyone knows you can slap a sticker on anything to confuse you. Another interesting piece of info on this was this past summer I replaced the Head gasket and noticed a patched up hood on the right side. You could not tell from the outside, but it had a round hole in it for which it had previously ran on distillate fuel. Many if not all parts seem to be interchangable with all years of A's and Super A's, so that seems to make it even more difficult to determine what year it is. It does not have a water pump as well. Where the original seriel numbers should be on the seat bracket is missing, so as to complicate identifying it as well. If there is any other data or thoughts on this, it would be most appreciated from everyone. Thanks,

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Jim Becker

03-14-2001 18:00:44

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 Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Ty, 03-11-2001 08:31:16  
In all this discussion, you still haven't hit on the right information to tell which model it is. All the numbers you posted, except for the H4--- number form the magneto are part numbers. The fact it has a magneto suggests something well prior to '52. I believe the block part number is for a Super A. Super A's were always available either with or without hydraulics.

Here are some items to check:

Bell housing: large flat top for the Touch Control to mount,
Final drives/drawbar: drawbar mounts on each side with 2 same-sized studs, not a large bolt plus a smaller capscrew,
Instument panel: covers whole area behind battery with steering shaft mount out the top of it, not a small box bolted to the steering support.

A Super A will have ALL these characteristics and an A will have none.

By the way, I have a very late B (215,000+ serial) and it does not have a Super A block.

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gene b

03-11-2001 20:54:57

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 Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Ty, 03-11-2001 08:31:16  
hole for pump is on the filter side in the area where the front steering assy bolts on there will be a plate over it these holes were cast in all of the blocks from mid 47 even late Bs hade this block also power units used on a bailer used this block replacement blocks had no serial no hope this helps some of the books we buy have some mistakes I can remember new Hs MS and Bs never saw a black seat like some say

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Guy Fay

03-12-2001 05:28:29

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 Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to gene b, 03-11-2001 20:54:57  
Yeah, but I've seen a few thousand photos in the archives with black seats, and Darst has taken apart a few hundred seats with the black fabric protected under the lip. Actually, the color did vary a little bit- I'd describe it more as a charcoal grey.

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Guy Fay

03-11-2001 10:23:49

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 Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Ty, 03-11-2001 08:31:16  
Someone's given you some bad information. Super As were introduced in 1947, and yes, they had live hydraulics at that point. Straight As were built from 1939-1947, and never had hydraulics of any sort from the factory. Someones confused the A with the M, which did go Super in 1952. Ms had transmission driven hydraulics from 1939, as did the early Super Ms. The "Stage II" SUper M got live hydraulics.

To answer your other question, I think a Super A could be ordered without hydraulics.

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03-11-2001 14:56:27

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 Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Guy Fay, 03-11-2001 10:23:49  

You were saying about someone giving miss-information about Super A's. I have a book by Pripps ("A Field Guide To Vintage Farm Tractors") and it says the Super A was built from 1952 to 1954. This fooled me for a while. "Ty" mentions that he has a book by two authors one of them is Pripps. Maybe the same mistake was made in his book.
Good luck.

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Guy Fay

03-11-2001 19:09:56

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 Re: Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Sam, 03-11-2001 14:56:27  
Good lord, that's even a fairly recent book! I'd guess that the information is the same in both books, and quite wrong.

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03-11-2001 12:31:01

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 Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Guy Fay, 03-11-2001 10:23:49  
I skimmed through my book on Farmalls (Farmall Tractors by Pripps and Morland) and you are 100% correct. The section on Super A's it says that the hydraulics were built in, and that's what was confusing to me, as mine apparently didn't have it. My owners manual does state that hydraulics were special equipment, so it seems it was optional equipment. Thank you for your help,

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Dave BN

03-11-2001 10:17:52

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 Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Ty, 03-11-2001 08:31:16  
I have seen many pieced together tractors over the years. A's and SA's seem to be very popular for that. Maybe because so many were made. I agree, get the engine serial number and that will tell you what year that was made. Does the engine have the cast opening for the lift all pump? Some 140's were make without hydraulics, maybe some SA's also. Dave BN.

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03-11-2001 12:24:27

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 Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Dave BN, 03-11-2001 10:17:52  
I checked the number on the engine and it is 251068r1. Hopefully that particular number will get the data I need. I am not quite sure what the cast opening may look like for sure, but it looks as if there is some threaded areas that could possibly be tapped into for placement of the hydraulics. I went through my manual again, and it has hydraulics listed as special equipment - to me signifying an upgraded or optional item. So that sounds correct for the 140's you were speaking of. Thanks,

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Bill B

03-11-2001 12:29:41

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 Re: Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Ty, 03-11-2001 12:24:27  
Your number translates to 1948 Super A.

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03-11-2001 12:37:17

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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Bill B, 03-11-2001 12:29:41  
The other numbers I have on that are:
trans: 8638dd
pto casing: 9091da
and right rear wheel assembly (attached to rear end): 6828db
Hopefully these can additionally confirm the 48' date, or tell me if I have a mutt tractor. Thanks for all the help!,

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03-11-2001 08:41:34

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 Re: Is this a Super A or just an A? in reply to Ty, 03-11-2001 08:31:16  
Look over the number one spark plug for a flat smooth place with a number on it, this should be the serial number. Any casting codes on the engine, transmission tube, rear end housing would be great to see as well. When you get all that post it here and someone should confirm what you think is right or wrong :o)

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