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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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What Did/Do You....

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Bill VA

01-27-2017 16:48:05




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You got your Farmall C or H or M and you are tooling along, hit a bump and need to steady yourself - but with (IMHO) rear fenders few and far between, you got nothing to grab hold of!!!!!

Read all the time about narrow front tractor stability and rollovers, but I'm thinking just falling off the side of the seat could cost one their life!

Anyone had a near mis at the hands of a fenderless tractor, or is it just never a problem?

Just curious.

Bill

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WellWorn

01-31-2017 22:55:58




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see I find that cutting hay offers the most surprises, like scalping the top of the ground hornets nest, or scaring up Bambi.

My "go to" rake is a Case F170, vintage 1948 or so. On steel. Yup, it takes me all day to rake the several small fields we do. Biggest of them is about 6 acres. And we no longer have woodchucks - we have a .22 with a scope, and a good dog.

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rdandersom

01-31-2017 20:40:11




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I have slid forward and hugged the steering wheel for dear life on a couple of occasions.



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SadFarmall

01-31-2017 13:00:20




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Thank you 'Well Worn'. A brilliant safety message. A careful operator is the best protection from accidents by far. I will put some more of the IH safety and precautions cartoons up too.

SadFarmall



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BarnyardEngineering

01-31-2017 11:34:16




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Once in a great while you come across something unavoidable, such as a fresh woodchuck hole under the windrow you're raking. If you went slow enough that hitting that hole wouldn't surprise you, it would take you all day to rake the field.

But in that case what's wrong with grabbing the STEERING WHEEL? You've already got at least one hand on it, right?



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WellWorn

01-31-2017 08:01:11




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Bill, you brought up a lot of stuff in your post, and I'm sure it's been covered before, but just because there are new people coming here every week, and not everyone that reads here is a registered user, I'll belabor the points once again. To the choir, I apologize in advance for preaching.

Write this down and post it on your refrigerator door. Put a copy on the tractor shed wall for good measure:

Fenders are to keep sloppy stuff off the operator, not to keep a sloppy operator on the tractor.


Fenders are far more likely to pin you in a roll as protect you. If you have them, great. If you don't, no big deal. I'm getting a set for my H to put warning flashers on them, because too many other vehicle users are idiots. That is how they will increase safety.

The safe operation of any farm equipment, be that powered by hand, by horse, or by motor, is 150% the responsibility of the operator. Why so much? If it's used more than once, the first time and at least 50% of the time thereafter, the equipment has to be checked to make sure it is safe to use in the first place. If something is likely to come apart and break itself or you, FIX IT FIRST! The other 100% is when the equipment is actually being used.

The only thing more likely to flip a narrow than a wide, is while going much faster than is safe, performing one of those incredibly tight turns a narrow is capable of. Crank the wheel hard in your pick-up at 30mph and see if it doesn't want to flip. Try that in a Jeep CJ.

Loaders, on ANY tractor increase the risk of a tip over because as the center of gravity gets higher (lifted load), the force needed to tip it decreases (change of incline or change in direction). Anyone in a big hurry with a loader, is tempting fate on a hurried trip to a hospital.

And I can see why the A is easier to flip than others: not only is it narrow with a high center of gravity, but that center is well off "center". If I understand physics and psychology correctly, nearly all "A" flips are to the left.

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George 3

01-29-2017 15:39:14




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

________________________________________________

I always liked the cartoons IH put in the Operators Manuals back in the 1950's. It removed some of the dryness found in Op manuals and introduced a bit of levity about serious safety concerns. Another one is the guy thinking about his girlfriend while driving along the edge of a ditch. They are all very enjoyable and I would be most appreciative to see more of them posted here. Thanks in advance.

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notjustair

01-29-2017 05:59:22




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
This isn't funny, but it is. I have a little Farmall A. I drive it from fence charger to fence charger all winter long. It sits on one all day while I charge up the deep cycle battery and then move it on. I have 220 acres that I just bought to pasture that has draws and trees and mayhem. I've been working with the skid steer to clear it, so it is quite bumpy in places. A friend was helping me last night move the tractor and was following me. Every time I got into a real rough spot with that little tractor that nearly threw me off I would hang on and throw my left arm in the air. I was staying on for at least 8 seconds, man! My friend was still laughing when I parked the tractor at the next spot. Once a cowboy, always a cowboy. I guess in my case you could substitute in "idiot".

When I started farming I had NO money. My loader tractor was an old Farmall M with a Horndraulic loader. I moved round bales with it - I did it all. I loved a zero turn loader tractor. I still have that machine all of these years later without the loader and use it about once a week to grind feed. I've put my 100 horse loader tractors into much dicier conditions than that old M just because I felt secure. Danger is in the driver not the machine.

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Gary Mitchell

01-29-2017 09:07:40




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to notjustair, 01-29-2017 05:59:22  
Amen to that. gm



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D beatty

01-28-2017 17:57:56




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
We farmed with a Farmall M & B and a John deere A. The John Deere had the best seat. With its backrest and side bars on set it felt the safest on side hills or going up hill. On road and in field you slow down if it looks rough or could be rough. On the road we ran wide open and slow down if you come to a rough section of road.



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Mike1972chev

01-28-2017 11:42:09




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I liked it when I added the fenders to My Super M .They are on the extensions moving them outward to right with the edge of the axle grease zerks.(If in the stock mounting location,I felt "trapped" on the tractor. REALLY tight in there.) When working on SLIGHT hillsides,it is nice to brace against them with a hand or a knee for a bit more of stability.It MIGHT keep you from falling off in front of a rear tire and from going under the drawn implement you are running? (I have heard true,actual horror stories about disc,plows, Bush Hogs!!! :/ )

But to like many have already posted,careful operation of your machine is the first,best defense. Machinery by nature is an extremely dangerous business and can get you killed for any number of reasons. Treat it like a loaded gun or a live hand grenade.STAY ALERT AT ALL TIMES! ;)

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OldFarmall450

01-28-2017 11:21:19




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
The only tractor I used that had fenders was a huge ford I borrowed from a neighbor which had a ROPS and a smaller IH which the hand hold was handy for getting on/off. I usually tried to keep both hands on the wheel; something tough to do when using a hand clutch JD, and never used road gear unless on paved road. Tilled/farmed in some tough spots, just was always careful and never got hurt. I don't think a fender will save you from getting hurt.

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Leroy

01-30-2017 07:52:17




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to OldFarmall450, 01-28-2017 11:21:19  
They can possibly not keep you from getting hurt BUT they can keep you from getting KILLED. Old friend years ago said about whem plowing with his WC Allis that he hit a bump (and his place was rough) with the left wheel and it threw him over the right fender and tractor was setting there with the tire spinning under him laying on that fender. If not for that fender it would have pulled him under the spinning tire. But they were made with a flat cover over the tire. Not like the about usless clam type fenders put on some tractor like the Farmalls and some Deeres. I would never own a tractor without fenders, If I bought a tractor without that was the first thing I did was to get fenders.

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haas

01-28-2017 08:21:16




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Growing up, we had a super A, C and an MD in the hills of southern Missouri. The only one that ever rolled over was the super A. Dad tipped it over 3 times that I recall. Thankfully never was any serious injury. If you need something to hang onto, you are going too fast! Our M and C never had any fenders.



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The tractor vet

01-28-2017 08:18:54




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Myself i have had noting with a wide ft till like 1990 , my first tractor had a narrow ft and no fenders when i bought it and it was a Farmall 450 Diesel , But i did buy a pair for it for ten bucks and put them on mainly just to dress it up and a place to mount the S M V sign and a grease gun and two flasher lights as the state patrol was hot and heavy on farmers for the signs and flashers , it was a new law and they were like dogs with a new bone over it For a short time they were even writing tickets for being over the 20 MPH while going down the road and had no sense of humor when you had more then two items hooked behind you , They got me one day with the baler three wagons and the hay rake all hooked together and while he and i were discussing the fact here comes my buddy with two more wagons and the fifty foot elevator around us The look on his face was a KODAK moment .

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John M

01-28-2017 07:43:48




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Ive heard of more tractor accidents while loading or unloading at the tractor shows than I have of accidents on the farm related to rollovers. Having said that, the closest I ever came was on my M, knocking down some weeds near the house. I Was in 1st gear, thank God, and one of the pins that holds the clutch fingers to the pressure plate had come out, and I didn't know it until I had gotten back to the barn to put it up. I was going into the barn, and pushed in the clutch to creep in, but it didn't stop. Luckily I had enough wits to me to hit the switch and only damaged the grill slightly.

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Jim in Ma.

01-28-2017 06:57:05




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
A few things come to mind here. Think first and slow down if in dough Fenders make you feel safe but don't help on a roll over. If you are worried about falling off your tractor = Add a ROPS and seat belt.

I have rolled several loader tractors over the years (Mostly working in the woods) and will tell you a wide front will tip over just as quick as a narrow one.



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f20inmi

01-28-2017 06:30:15




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
My dad was cleaning an inclined feedlot with a 460 narrow front Farmall and loader. We're not sure exactly what happened but the tractor rolled onto it's top pinning him underneath. By the grace of god, he survived but that was the last narrow front tractor he ever owned with a loader. In that case, the fenders may have impeded his escape. Hard to say. Every tractor he owned since then had fenders installed. Personally speaking, I think they add to the appearance while protecting the driver.

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PretendFarmer

01-28-2017 05:44:15




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I would never operate the tractor in road gear on any kind of questionable terrain. And if I allowed someone else to operate it, they would be well trained in how to operate it or they wouldn't be operating it at all.



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SadFarmall

01-27-2017 21:58:00




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Not too sure about having other riders on the tractor…

SadFarmall third party image



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SadFarmall

01-27-2017 21:53:24




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
The answers are all absolutely correct. Drive it safely. I started driving our Farmall M when I was 12 and my Dad and Grandfather drove it for many years before that. Never been close to being thrown from the seat. The Farmall M and MV Owner's Manual has a good picture.

SadFarmall third party image

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tractorguy2

01-27-2017 21:33:25




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I grew up in Nebraska. I have never seen a Farmall H-450 that had fenders. A lot of the old tractors that came with fenders, Case,Oliver,or MM had the fenders removed.

I have never understood why people think narrow front wheels are dangerous. A tractor is only as dangerous as the driver.

Last fall a local guy flipped a Ford 8n while spring toothing a horse corral. How do you flip a 8n with a six foot 3pt spring tooth on flat ground? By being reckless?

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oleclint

01-27-2017 19:34:06




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
If I remember rite, The state of Wis. used to have a law that required all new farm tractors have fenders. That was in the 40 s or newer. But that does not say that the farmer could not take them off. Which they did. At one time if we were looking for antique tractor fenders , we traveled to southern Wi. It was 'good finding ' up there.Some were like new as they hung on the shed wall for years. clint

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AJB-830

01-27-2017 20:47:27




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to oleclint, 01-27-2017 19:34:06  
Yes, you are correct. Wisconsin required all new tractors to be sold with fenders. I think the law might even still be in effect. I have several IH farmalls, H, MD, 300, 350, 400, 450-D and all have fenders. Not sure I could or want to drive one without fenders. On the H I have, my dad put fender extensions on it so you could mount the cultivators without removing the fenders. And I have these fender extension on all my other Farmalls as it makes getting on and off much easier. Al

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300jk

01-27-2017 19:26:36




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
No fenders on my 300 and didn't have any on the h I got rid of a little while back. 300 is a wide front and h was narrow. Would like to eventually get a set for the 300. My grandpa bought a super c brand new in the 50's. Not sure on the year. In the early 60's he was cultivating corn and the seat snapped off. Not sure how as he was only about 160 pounds and the tractor was always inside so it wasnt rusted through. That tractor had fenders but he couldn't grab anything and he fell behind the tractor and was dragged to the end of the field by the cultivators. Tractor stopped when it hit a tree. He got real lucky!

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gab

01-27-2017 19:03:57




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
When I was a kid we had 2 Ms and a Super C, all had fenders which were seldom on, all had narrow fronts and we never rolled anything. We had some steep hill sides, some of which I was scared of but I did them anyway, had to keep up the tuff kid appearance.



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fbh44

01-27-2017 18:32:35




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I have fenders on my H. Very safe. Would never be without them. YOU may be as safe as possible, but other riders like teenagers or women will definitely need them DO IT! Makes a world of difference.



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rick in iowa

01-27-2017 18:19:45




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
what kind of front end doesn't matter.dumba__ on seat causes upset.i used H with narrow front with loader for years,no problem.guy down the road had wide front with loader and at least once a year it was on the side..nobody would loan or rent him anything cause they knew it would come back junk.by luck he didn't reproduce.



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David G

01-27-2017 18:11:48




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I have never been thrown off a seat, do not plan on it.



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gene bender

01-27-2017 18:06:48




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
No we just learned to drive safe i was 13 driving a new M discing running combine ect we were taught safety.



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tom dowling

01-27-2017 17:52:46




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
I would have to say most if not all narrow front rollovers are due to operator error.



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Janicholson

01-27-2017 17:05:56




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Bill VA, 01-27-2017 16:48:05  
Prudent operation is the best safety device ever. Hitting something so hard that one's grip is ripped from the wheel is due to failure to assess operating parameters. Fenders do add protection. But if they are close enough to grab, they make it hard to mount the tractor. Jim



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S2710

01-28-2017 17:07:57




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Janicholson, 01-27-2017 17:05:56  
Jim I have 5 Farmalls and all of them have fenders and I or anyone else have no problem getting on or off and I can drive down the road or out in the field and hang on to the fender with no problem. Please post a picture of what you mean. Thank You

Bob



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Janicholson

01-28-2017 17:29:53




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to S2710, 01-28-2017 17:07:57  
Fenders mounted to a C-H-M where the holes are in the axle, are so close to the seat that unless one is skinny, (and I was) it can be difficult getting on the tractor. Many fenders are mounted on 6 to 8 inch offset plates that can be grabbed, but, again not easily or handily. Jim



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S2710

01-28-2017 18:23:13




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 Re: What Did/Do You.... in reply to Janicholson, 01-28-2017 17:29:53  
OK all of mine have the extentions on them. In my area I have never seen one without the extentions.

bob



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