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Case Tractors Discussion Forum
:

Power shift in Case Agri Kings.

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Cowboy2005

03-25-2020 21:34:22




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I have heard bad things about the power shift in case 1070 Agri king and other similar models.
So my question is are they as bad as they are cracked up to be?
And about how much does it cost to replace one?
I am looking into possibly getting a 1070 or 1370 so I'm very curious and also a bit concerned.

Thanks in advance.

-Garrett




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Cowboy2005

03-29-2020 21:27:14




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
Thank you everyone! I'm very grateful for all your help.

-Garrett



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mEl

03-27-2020 06:57:00




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
When the 70 series first came out they went through several design changes early, they were all subject to the occasional bolt failure issue. The pistons were updated to incorporate new seals with an O ring expander, much improved! Personally I update all rebuilds to the late pistons. I have found that using Loctite not just on the threads but enough to coat the outsides of the bolts seems to keep them together. Of course, new bolts and hardened washers
Most powershifts failed from lack of care in the oil/ filter department causing pilot spool sticking. many time the cold oil relief valve cartridges got thrown away with the old filters.
Ron has a valid point about the C2 clutch being being used as a master clutch in very high HP operations, In normal operation it serves well but for tractor pulling applications where boost must be built by loading the engine against the clutch it is just not durable due the inability to cool.
On most rebuilds C2 -C3 clutches can be reused, Plate wear in a properly maintained powershift is not a concern, but any bluing of the steel plates is a warning to look for warpage. One thing that is important is the clutch pedal spring and not riding the clutch, the C2 clutch pressure is controlled by the position of the clutch spool so tight clutch linkage, misadjusted clutch pedal linkage, improper pedal stop bolts on the clutch pedal,can cause low C2 pressure, another thing I have run into is customers replacing the clutch pedal return spring with a mechanical clutch spring and they are much weaker

We sold a 970, the customer installed a M&W Turbo kit and farmed many years with it here in Pa. then moved to Idaho and opened a large farming operation. That tractor had 7700 hours without even being updated to the steel expander wire type seal and was still working as new, that tractor is still working today, and has been since moving there however has been gone through by now I'm sure a couple times, I would not even try to guess hours by now but multiple thousands of hours is not out of the question.

I have been there since these tractors came out and before and the power shifts and the Case O Matics were my favorites, here again, there are many Case O Matics that have never been touched. I have heard it all about Case O Matics but anyone who can drive a automatic transmission car can drive a Case O matic.

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1370rod

03-26-2020 19:56:19




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
The CASE RPS34 is not perfect but when operated and serviced properly can give many years of trouble free service. Having worked on them for 47 years now, (I'm still lagging behind Mels years and a rookie yet so he is tops in my book) Anyway most of the repairs I have done over the years were the result of not servicing the oil and filters properly, the second reason would be the C-2, C-3 bolts breaking. Very seldom have I repaired one just to install new seals, that just got done because we had the unit out for some other reason. Other than those bolts failing there really was not a very weak area. The C-2 clutch pack used as the main clutch for starting and stopping the tractor has been a very good clutch, not perfect but darn good. I am not a IH mechanic but I have repaired many more IH dry clutches than I have repaired C-2 in a CASE. They stood a well in loader and snowblower applications, actually better than dry clutches in my trade area. These units are 40-50 years old now and one can expect some kind of repairs on any colored tractor. The RPS34 normally is not a mega dollar repair unless it is making a grinding noise, walk away if you encounter that condition. But I always thought the CASE PShift got a bad rap, I just have not seen that much trouble with them IF you kept the oil and filters changed. My family has used them for 40 years and have only had to replace the bolts in a 1070. They can be jerky and jumpy, that is a common complaint and most of that can be remedied with operator education. Perfect, nope they are not, but saying the PShift is trouble some would be a inaccurate description. There is other things I would be more concerned about if I was interested in buying a CASE PShift tractor. Just my 2 cents worth, Rod.

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RonSa

03-27-2020 05:22:49




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to 1370rod, 03-26-2020 19:56:19  
How difficult is it to remove the CONTROL VALVE from the 2470 PS transmission? I gather from the video posted, it might be removable without taking the tranny out of the tractor. Is that right?

Thanks. I always enjoy you posts and insights.



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1370rod

03-27-2020 05:56:44




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to RonSa, 03-27-2020 05:22:49  
Ron it is not a bad job at all on a 24, pull the floor panel off in the cab and it is right there. It is normally piled full of dirt, that and the surrounding area should be washed clean. Doing so makes removal simpler and easy to figure out. Have any question, I'm sure many here would be happy to help, Rod.



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RonSa

03-28-2020 06:57:03




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to 1370rod, 03-27-2020 05:56:44  
I just solved my retarding valve information problem about the RPS 34 control valve. DUHHHH!!! My old I&T shop manual for my 1170 also has info for the SMALLER 70 series with the RPS 34. I had always skipped over that section because the 1170 has a manual tranny. I knew I had no manuals for the larger 2470.

The fix may be as simple as one ball check valve malfunctioning.

Thanks again for your input. Stay away from the virus!!!

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RonSa

03-27-2020 07:52:21




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to 1370rod, 03-27-2020 05:56:44  
Thanks for the info about where the control valve on my friends 24 is located. Do you know of a service manual that does a good job of explaining how to clean and repair the control valve and especially the retarding valves?

If I look on E-bay for a manual, is there a manual number to look for?

A big problem with fixing the 24 is the grandson in charge of farm repairs has "green blood" and views the 24 as a piece of junk to not to spend time on . LOL He would let me tinker with the 24 so the service manual is for my curiosity. At my age, tinkering means doing something easy with no deadline to finish. hee haw

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1370rod

03-28-2020 06:36:10




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to RonSa, 03-27-2020 07:52:21  
A factory service manual would show you the most detail, I do not know if they even show a step by step for valve cleaning in the 24 book. A later 90 series book has more step by step stuff. To clean the valve would only cost you some time and a couple gaskets, so why not give it a try and change Hyd. filters. Good luck, Rod.



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RonSa

03-26-2020 16:55:21




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
Garrett,


POWERSHIFT TRANNYS IN GENERAL: Beginning in 64, my work at Cat for 30+ years, included becoming acquainted with the PS tranny Industry. I did a little design work on some of Cat’s PS trannys. Over many years, the PS industry went thru a lot of trial and error.

J I CASE PS: With the 70 series, Case tried their hand at designing a 3-speed PS for their larger tractors. In short, Case tried to COMBINE the functions of the range-clutches with the functions of the master-clutch. In other word, the range-clutches also served as the master-clutch. Doing this is a significant PS design flaw.

The 70 series Case range-clutches were not massive enough to adequately take typical master-clutch abuses. Human operators, with their foot clutch and throttle, often find it convenient to cause a lot of master-clutch slippage---- combined with high torque from a lot of throttle. This situation, in turn, causes a lot of heat to be generated. Therefore, the master-clutch must be massive enough to absorb a lot of heat from slippage and still keep the master-clutch disc temperatures down.

As John S alluded to below, the Case PS tranny is subject to being damaged if the operator is not correctly instructed. Many operators choose to not want any instructions. I have many sad stories about Cat operators. We had a saying that Cats needed to be “idiot proof”. BUYING A USED TRACTOR: I think that buying most USED tractors, having a PS with an unknown history, is a risky investment. If one is faced with repairing a PS, we all know the cost may be very extensive. Also, if the reason for SELLING the tractor is unknown, that is also a caution flag. For the J I Case PS, how many CaseIH dealers have the knowhow and parts availability to repair the 70 series PS tranny!!!

My very limited experience, with a Case PS, is a farmer friend of mine bought a used 2470. The PS tranny’s shift characteristics soon went bad. The tractor would completely stop and then “jump off the ground to start going”. The range clutch modulation completely went away. I knew it was a modulation problem but I was generally clueless about how much work was involved to turn the wrenches and fix the Case PS clutch modulation issues. Watching the video posted here, the problem was likely related to what Case calls the “retarding valve”. A range-clutch disengagement must overlap (be time retarded) the engagement of the next range clutch.

The friend’s 2470 has now sets for several years. It will likely be sold to a used parts company (like Worthington Ag) when the grandson, with green blood, takes over the farm in the near future.


BACK TO THE 70 SERIES IN YOUR POSTS: Here is why my next field tractor would likely be a used 2290 with a manual tranny and rated very conservatively at about 130 HP for the massive 504T. I checked and the horsepower range between the 1070 and 1370 is 112hp to 158hp. I think the only 70 series models, in that HP range, that offered a manual tranny, was the 1070, 1170 and 1175. I believe the 2290 was an upgrade of the 1175 and also the biggest J I Case model to offer an optional manual tranny.

IF you are buying a tractor mainly for draw bar work in the field ------ IF you have mechanical savvy and the discipline to NOT operate the tractor ABOVE ITS RATED HP (no offense intended)------ there is an easy way to adds the two main functions of a PS to a tractor with a manual transmission.

I consider the two main PS functions in the field are (1) to not need to stop-and-shift, when pulling a tillage implement across the field, and (2) to not need to over-lug the engine to get across the field. The way I added both of these functions, to my 1170 with a mechanical transmission was to turn up the horse power at the injection pump----- but only use the extra HP in temporary tough spots.

For a turbo engine, the boost pressure is proportional to HP. (for a fixed rpm.) Therefore, a simple pressure gage, installed in the cab and plumbed into the intake manifold is all the hardware needed to add the power shift’s two main functions to a tractor with a mechanical transmission. I set my 1170 from its rated 122 HP up to 150 HP on a dyno about 40 years ago.


A dyno is useful to first set the engine at rated HP and to learn its boost pressure at its rated HP and rated speed. Then use a Sharpie to make a line at rated HP pressure on the face of the pressure gage. Consider any boost pressure over rated HP as “the yellow zone”. We are familiar with our vehicle’s tac having a yellow zone.


With the tractor still on the dyno, adjust the “torque screw” (as my older brother with a 190XT called it) to a reasonable higher HP setting. Only recently has the clutch in my 1170 at 5000hrs begin to slip in the “yellow zone”.

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theljam

03-26-2020 09:56:11




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
I recently did an article in Old Abe's News, the quarterly magazine published by the JI Case Collectors' Assn. It was based on this filmstrip, which I posted online for people to watch. It may not answer all of your specific questions but should give you a good overview of how the RPS-34 works.

https://youtu.be/CVfvpI4cVi0



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John Saeli

03-26-2020 06:20:27




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
They had their "mis-givings" and you had to learn to use it properly or you could destroy it very quickly. Having said that, we have had an 870 here for 42 years, that all our 4 kids operated, as instructed, engine overhauled once, but the P/Shift has never been touched. We have several newer CASE tractors with P/Shift that have never been touched. But, an operator can tear one up. My advice, if you are unfamiliar with one, stay away from it.

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DKase

03-26-2020 05:41:47




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
I have gone through several 3 speed Case power shift transmissions. I do all the labor myself, they are not that complicated. Anyone can work on them if you have the tools, an original Case service manual and a place to split the machine. The ones I have worked on I did not have to get into any planitary gears. Seal kits and a few clutch packs, and some updated parts was all mine required. By using good used parts I have never spent more than $400 rebuilding one.

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karl h

03-26-2020 03:22:53




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 Re: Power shift in Case Agri Kings. in reply to Cowboy2005, 03-25-2020 21:34:22  
I had the dealer go through powershift in my 3594 last year. It has a couple burnt up clutch packs and needed a new carrier. They also fixed my three point, leaking front axle, out new hytran in her, and a few other things...i was like 8k for everything.....I didn’t think that was too bad. I farm exclusively with case powershift tractors. They have treated me well. Something that help the clutch plate last longer is to downshift back to 1 prior to pushing in the inching pedal.

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