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Allis Chalmers Discussion Forum
:

cca differance

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d. coleman

01-17-2010 03:32:32




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im new to Allis Chalmers, just traded for a CA and havent picked it up yet due to weather. i am in process of ordering manuals but would like to ask a few questions until there arrival. what is the differance between the C and the CA? the engine is locked, so i'll be pulling the head prior to any attempt to rotate crank. owner said it ran when parked 3 years prior and exhaust was covered. any spiecal areas of concern on engine disassembly? thanks, d. coleman

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BDT in Minnesota

01-18-2010 05:43:10




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 Re: Miss Information From Somewhere in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
[quote="BDT in Minnesota"](quoted from post at 06:27:01 01/18/10)
for clarification, here are a few part numbers from a CA dealers parts catalog (issue date August 1960:

Piston Assembly, 5.7:1 ratio, gasoline, used prior to Engine serial number CE 153962.

Piston Assembly, 6.25:1 ratio, gasoline, used on engine CE 153962 and up.

Piston Assembly, 5.2:1 ratio, low octane fuel.

Piston Assembly, 4.7:1 ratio, low octane fuel.

Now, the ONE cylinder sleeve that is listed is #208743.. So,all of these part numbers are for the standard 3 3/8" cylinder bore.... All four of the pistons listed are 3 3/8" diameter...




A ratio of 5.75:1 is also listed in the I&T shop Manual # AC-11...????????????????

Ok, these engines were produced in various horsepower ratings, as well as different fuel types: Distillate, gasoline
:twisted: Sorry no LPG listed :evil:
And yikes, I haven"t mentioned the various aftermarket overbore kits that have been around for decades.....[/quote]
Quoted Text:

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d. coleman

01-17-2010 11:49:16




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 Re: cca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
thanks for all responses, just got back from removing full cultavator assy. in prep for loading on trailer. the tractor must be a "C" due to 3 speed trans. and no apparant hand clutch. oh well, for the price i can't complane. if anyone in south al. area wants the cultivator, i'm willing to work up a trade for items they may have that i need(parts). thanks again for everyones responces. d. coleman

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R Aiken

01-17-2010 07:36:25




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 Re: cca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
The CA has a better seat and is a little easyer to get on and off. The later CA's with snap cupler made for easyer and quicker changes of attachments.



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Jeff Z.

01-17-2010 07:07:59




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 Re: cca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
When the CA came out it was really liked by farmers. Some say the CA stood for Cat"s A$$.
One really fine small tractor with power to spare.



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Jeff Z.

01-17-2010 07:04:56




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 Re: cca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
The CA engine also has higher compression.



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Dick L

01-17-2010 09:28:41




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 Miss Information From Somewhere in reply to Jeff Z., 01-17-2010 07:04:56  
Not to pick on anyone Don't know where you found the higher compression information but it is not so. The later B's, C's, and CA's were all 125 cubic inch displacment. They were all 3 3/8" diameter pistons. They all had a 3 1/2" stroke. The heads all had sand cast firing chambers with close to the same depth. In rebuilding all three models heads they were all very close to the same depth at the top of the valve. You can find some difference in the firing chamber depth at the deeper and shallower sides of the firing chambers. However you can find the shallower firing chambers on the earlier B's. Sand cast parts are not held to plus or minus .001

Not wanting to rely other peoples myths and rumors I cut up parts to see what I am actually dealing with.

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Brian Jasper co. Ia

01-17-2010 14:48:38




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 Re: Miss Information From Somewhere in reply to Dick L, 01-17-2010 09:28:41  
Dick, the compression ratio info is on page 81 of Norm Swinfords book. It jumped from 5.75-1 in the C to 6.25-1 in the CA.



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BDT in Minnesota

01-18-2010 05:27:01




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 Re: Miss Information From Somewhere in reply to Brian Jasper co. Ia, 01-17-2010 14:48:38  
for clarification, here are a few part numbers from a CA dealers parts catalog (issue date August 1960:

Piston Assembly, 5.7:1 ratio, gasoline, used prior to Engine serial number CE 153962.

Piston Assembly, 6.25:1 ratio, gasoline, used on engine CE 153962 and up.

Piston Assembly, 5.2:1 ratio, low octane fuel.

Piston Assembly, 4.7:1 ratio, low octane fuel.

Now, the ONE cylinder sleeve that is listed is #208743.. So,all of these part numbers are for the standard 3 3/8" cylinder bore.... All four of the pistons listed are 3 3/8" diameter...




A ratio of 5.75:1 is also listed in the I&T shop Manual # AC-11...????????????????

Ok, these engines were produced in various horsepower ratings, as well different fuel types: Distillate, gasoline,


And yikes, I haven"t mentioned the various aftermarket overbore kits that have been around for decades.....
This post was edited by BDT in Minnesota at 05:47:44 01/18/10.

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steve(ill)

01-17-2010 06:53:55




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 Re: c-ca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
AS mentioned, CA has a 4 speed. A hand cluth on one rear axle to let you use the hydrualics without forward movement of the tractor. Big think is the spin out rims on the rear that let you easily adjust the tractor width. Improved hydrualic pump, bigger than the C. Motor is basically the same, but governor has different springs for more RPM and more HP.



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Dick L

01-17-2010 06:38:55




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 Re: cca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  
No real difference in the engine internal parts. You can look thru the different albums at the link such as the installing SBC valves and stuck engine and find a lot of information that could be helpful.



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mlpankey

01-17-2010 11:09:47




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 Re: cca differance in reply to Dick L, 01-17-2010 06:38:55  
how much did you stroke the crankshaft.



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Jeff Z.

01-17-2010 05:44:25




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 Re: cca differance in reply to d. coleman, 01-17-2010 03:32:32  

To list some changes from the C:

Hydraulics
Engine has more HP
Live PTO - Hand Clutch
Wider
Hitch
4 Speed Transmission



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Gordon in IN

01-17-2010 20:44:53




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 Re: cca differance in reply to Jeff Z., 01-17-2010 05:44:25  
According to my service manual the CA has full pressure oil lubrication to the rod bearings through holes drilled in the crankshaft from the main bearing journals to the rod bearing journals. The B and C do not feed oil through the crankshaft, but have oil holes in the cam which "spray" oil onto the outside of the rods which have a hole for the oil to get to the rod bearings (a type of spray or splash oiling for the rod bearings).

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Dick L

01-18-2010 05:13:18




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 Re: cca differance in reply to Gordon in IN, 01-17-2010 20:44:53  
I know what it says but I have yet to find one. I thought I had one a few years back but when I pushed a wire into the hole it only went in a short distance. The rods had the holes for oiling the rod bearings and had the smaller oil pump. If anyone runs across one that is drilled please post pictures. When the D10 thru D15 came out they did have the rods oiled thru the main bearings. The oil pump relife valve was at the front of the cam shaft rather than in the oil pump stem. A quick and easy way to tell if it has a pressure oiling system for the rods is to look at the rods. The pressure oiling system will not have the holes.

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