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Allis Chalmers Discussion Forum
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Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B

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Ken Shuler

06-29-2008 00:44:28




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I'm looking at possibly purchasing an AC 1941 model B. It has the belt pulley and pto together in the rear. Since it didn't come with the optional hydraulic pump, can it still be adapted to accept one now. I see several hydraulic pumps that are available online for the AC models B & C, but how do I determine if they will fit my tractor (I have a serial no., does that help any to match up tractor and pump?). Any help or ideas for a solution will be appreciatted.

My goal is to pull a plow with a 3 point hitch (thus the need for the hydraulics).

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chalmersbob

06-29-2008 18:28:06




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 Re: Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B in reply to Ken Shuler, 06-29-2008 00:44:28  
You shouldn't have any problem mounting the pump if you have the bolt on plate. when you remove the plate look inside with a flashlight at the gasket that seals the pto unit to the rear end of the tractor. the gasket must have a "dam" at the bottom so that fluid is retained in the pto as the tractor goes up and down hills and imbankments. other wise the pump could not get any fluid under these conditions. Bob

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Clay in MI

06-29-2008 10:29:27




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 Re: Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B in reply to Ken Shuler, 06-29-2008 00:44:28  
If you have the block off plate and lobes on the driveshaft than any B or C pump will work (they're all the same - but a CA pump is different and won't work). If you don't have the opening or lobes than yes, you can swap out with a different casing that has the pump. It will bolt right on.

PS Thanks Rod for your website!



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Rod (NH)

06-29-2008 16:08:44




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 Re: Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B in reply to Clay in MI, 06-29-2008 10:29:27  
You're welcome Clay. I haven't added anything to it lately but it was fun putting the pages together and I learned a lot about doing that type of thing in the process. The mag timing and tractor color code pages seem to get the most hits - from all over the world.

Rod



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Rod (NH)

06-29-2008 04:33:26




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 Re: Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B in reply to Ken Shuler, 06-29-2008 00:44:28  
Hi Ken,

There are two basic things to check to see if a stock AC B/C hydraulic pump can be easily added to your tractor. First you must have a pto housing that has the capability to mount the pump. You can determine that by the presence of a rectangular blocking plate on the right hand side of the pto housing, looking from the rear of the tractor. The pate is attached by two bolts plus two studs. If you have that plate, then the pto housing has the provision for attaching the pump. If you don't have that plate, then forget it - you would need to replace the pto housing with a proper one in order to mount the stock pump. Secondly, you need to have a pto shaft that has the two cam lobes on it to drive the pump. If you have the rectangular blocking plate, it is likely you have the shaft with the lobes. However, to be sure, you can drain the housing, remove the blocking plate and verify that the shaft has the two lobes. I have a 1942 B that I added a hydraulic pump to a couple of years ago. I got the pump off ebay. Fortunately for me, my pto housing had the ability to mount the pump and the pto shaft had the cam lobes, although the tractor never had a hydraulic pump on it.

Your tractor serial number would be of no use in determining if you can mount a pump. The early pto housings did not have the ability to mount a pump and the easy interchange of parts over the years means you have to actually physically verify what you have in order to decide anything. If you do add a pump, be sure to drain the entire transmission, differential and pto combination - three places. If no pump was in place before, you most likely have heavy oil in the combination sump. You will need to use SAE 20 weight oil of the more modern trans/hyd fluid (SAE10) when adding a pump. You would also need to flush the system good before adding the light weight oil.

Rod

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Ken Shuler

06-29-2008 08:27:53




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 Re: Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B in reply to Rod (NH), 06-29-2008 04:33:26  
Follow-up question for Rod (NH). First thanks for your speedy response with good info. based on your own experiences. If "my tractor" doesn't have the proper pto housing, can a combination pto housing/belt pulley with hydraulic pump be mounted [like the $160 item at vintagetractors.com/acbctrans.html (rusty acres ranch)]?

If "my tractor" has the blocking plate and the lobes on the pto shaft so that it can accept the hydraulic pump, will any pump from an AC B or C work? Or were there different versions of the hydraulic pump over the 19 years of manufacturing that wouldn't work?

Thanks for all of your help.

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Rod (NH)

06-29-2008 16:02:50




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 Re: Hydraulic pump for AC 1941 model B in reply to Ken Shuler, 06-29-2008 08:27:53  
Agree with Clay. The pto assembly you reference should bolt right on. All the B/C ones should be interchageable as far as mounting to the tractor. The early ones had a 1-1/8 x 6 pto shaft and the later ones had the more modern 1-3/8 x 6 shaft. If you get that one, be sure to try and determine beforehand if the hyd pump is fully functional. Repair parts are brutally expensive and only available from an AGCO dealer that carries AC parts. Plus the "repair kit", expensive as it is, is woefully incomplete. Additional individual parts may be needed if the pump needs work. You'll also want the hyd pump actuating lever shown as an additional item. I find it a shame that needed parts are broken up like that - but that's the way it seems to be. I think there are some minor variations in B/C hyd pump internals over the years but nothing that would affect interchangeability - all the B/C ones should interchange. For some additional info on the B/C hyd pump, see this prior post of mine.

Rod

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