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Kubota M9000 - M8200 Clutch question

V

verifiable

New User
I asked - posted this on Today's Tractor
Try here and see if can get an answer.

Have gotten conflicting info as to what type of main-drive clutch is in the above tractors that are equipped with a hydraulic shuttle.

Does anyone here know positively whether it uses a dry clutch, or uses a wet hydraulic clutch.

I know the shuttle clutch is a wet(hyd) multi plate pack.

A Kubota mechanic states it uses a dry clutch, yet has no experience working on a M8200 or M9000 and is using a parts manual for reference.

Thanks for a definitive answer.
 
Don,t know why their would be any confusion. The Hydraulic shuttle is just like you said a hydraulic shuttle pack BEHIND just and ordinary dry cluch set up. The only problem we have ever had is sometimes the DRY clutch operating cabel will freze up and not allow for proper operation of the manual dry clutch. e mail me if more info needed. [email protected]
 
You would know better than me but the specs on the M9000 say multidisc wet main clutch for hydraulic reverser models.

"Multi wet disc (Common w/shuttle clutch)"
 
O.K. you are righ and I am wrong to some extent.
LOOK RIGHT BEHIND THE ENGINE FLYWHEEL AND TELL ME WHAT YOU SEE IN THE PARTS BREAKDOWN. BUT IN THE OPERATION OF TRANSFR OF POWER IT IS A MULTI DISK HYDRAULIC CLUTCH IN THE DRIVE TRAIN.
WHAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH THE UNIT AND MAYBE I CAN START YOU IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.
 
Thanks Jerry,

According to the Kubota News Release dated Mar 2005, re the M5700 + M6800 it states:

"A multiple plate wet disc clutch system replaces the dry type main clutch." ....etc.

Does that mean the M6800 has a wet main clutch? or as you say still uses a dry clutch in conjunction with the hyd shuttle clutches?

So, in inching applications, one needs to slip the dry clutch still?

And I know we were discussing the M9000.....however

From a M9000 spec: Main clutch type Multi wet disc (Common w/shuttle clutch)
 
Looking to buy a 9000 and wanted to verify it does not have a dry clutch.

The literature seems to say one thing but personnel another?

eg: Compared to conventional dry-type clutches, the "Hydraulic Wet Clutch" provides durable, long life operation.....hydraulic oil circulates through the "Hydraulic Wet Clutch" whenever it"s engaged to keep clutch discs and plates cool while reducing friction.
Together with the Hydraulic Shuttle Transmission clutch, the "Hydraulic Wet Clutch" system actually incorporates two independent clutch packs....etc.
 
gIVE ME A PHONE NUMBER AND i WILL CALL YOU AND TRY AND SOLVE YOUR PROBLEMS.. PROBLEM IS M 900 IF YOU ARE PURCHASING NEW IS A OLD LIKE NOT MADE IN 2 YEARS TRACTOR. NEW CURRENT MODEL IS M 9540
SEVERAL IMP IN THE AIR CONDITIONER AND OTHER AREAS.. GEIV ME A PHNE NU I,LL CALL YOU LATTER COVRED UP JUST NOW. JERRY
 
OK...I think I"m done here.

After calling 3-4 different Kubota shops....here"s what I found.
1. There are few to no M9000s in the USA
2. or..few to no M9000 have ever been in a repair shop, at least where the case was split.
3. The only way to discern what"s inside the M9000 is with a parts book and even then it"s coded in such a way that only those entrusted with the secret decryption ring can view it correctly.
 
The specs from kubota say the main clutch is a wet clutch with the hydaulic shuttle. Go to kubota.ca, in the search bar type in M9000, click on the correct search and download the specs and make sure for your self. The dry clutch paired up with a sync chuttle was a stupid combo and didn't last too long. Maybe 1000 hrs, a bit more when babied. I haven't heard anything bad about the hydraulic shuttle models.
 
I dunno... but I think you'll find that if it has a power reverser, it wet. Period.
There may be a dry disc ahead of that which simply acts as a slip clutch, but I wouldn't expect it to be of the type that could be disengaged...
What's the big deal anyway? I'd sooner an organic, sigle disc, dry clutch.

Rod
 
1. "I think"
2. "I wouldn"t expect"
3. "What"s the big deal anyway? I"d sooner an organic, sigle disc, dry clutch."

1. that really doesn"t qualify as a definitive.
2. see #1
3. that"s nice, sum"d also sooner plow with a mule (see Amish)

Not the best help but thanks for the attempt.
 
"The specs from kubota say the main clutch is a wet clutch with the hydaulic shuttle."

I agree, that was my argument, but the "mechanics" didn"t see it that way.
But...a couple admitted they never changed a clutch on a M9000 and the others referred to the parts book to support their theory.
Leads me to believe that the M9000 either doesn"t really exist or are so well built that they never need to be worked on.

"The dry clutch paired up with a sync chuttle was a stupid combo"

Again I agree, yes from first hand verifiable experience (not a M9000) of course, they never break.
 
"Methinks I sees clearly now why youse not gettin the best uf heelp"

OK...you"re just having fun...right....seriously.
You really aren"t inebriated, you"re just kiddin, yes?

You"ll have to forgive me, I"m kind of slow on picking up on that kind of humour.

Great sense of humour though. Thanks
 
I don't know why you'd destroy a button clutch in that application in 1000 hours unless your foot was glued to the pedal. I'm quite familiar with that transmission in one of my Fords, probably channeling about the same torque through an organic disc and we had no trouble getting 4000 hours from it. It might have been babied for 1/10th of an hour at some point in it's life... The dry clutch is the strongest part of the 8x8.

I agree on the spec sheet though. If it says it's wet with a power reverser, it's wet. That's what it looks like to me.
I'd say the guys looking in the parts book are probably mixing the two up as most parts books are seldom so clearly written that they would spell out an either/or scenario. Most things I've seen in Ford parts books are defined by components and you need to know what components you have... I doubt Kubota is any less confusing, and probably moreso.
You can only pack so much junk in that bellhousing, so I'd say you've either got wet OR dry, but not both.
Still, for the life of me I can't imagine what difference it would make.

Rod
 
Rod, thanks for the info.

The difference is the amount of life and abuse the clutch can take.
A dry clutch, as you know, can only take so much heat and slippage before it"s glazed or destroyed.

The clutch pedal on a tractor with a "wet" clutch does nothing more than operate a hydraulic control valve.

With care a wet clutch should last beyond the life of the tractor....excluding exceptions.

Just talked to a mech who replaced a clutch in a county owned M5700 and they managed to burn out the new clutch in less than 100 hours. He said the pressure plate and flywheel were a nice heat treat blue.

All depends on how you run it and the application in which it"s used.

If you prefer a dry clutch, then by all means you should have a dry clutch, after all this is America by George and that"s what it"s all about, freedom and liberty to chose the clutch of your choice.
 
I'd suggest that the monkey who destroys a dry clutch in 100 hours will destroy the wet one in about 200.
It is true that a wet clutch will outlast a dry plate most times under normal usem but I've got tractors around here with 7000+ hours and still strong on their original disc. Clutch life, from what I've observed over the years is 99% directly related to the operators habits, not the work that's being done. Sadly, bad habits are hard to break. That's why the rest of us have to suffer with wet clutches. Suffer is the word that comes to my mind when I think of a Deere Perma-clutch...

I'd also add that if you're looking at a tractor with the 8x8 transmission, make sure you keep the clutch properly adjsuted (wet or dry) and don't abuse that transmission by forcing the syncro's. They'll make you pay for it...
BT/DT, got the T-shirt.

Rod
 
Yeah, no argument there.

The county provided it for the county fair and let everyone use it that had livestock there.
Bad and expensive idea at tax payer"s expense.

A dry clutch will last forever, depending on the application and operator.

e.g. at dawn, push the clutch pedal in, select gear, engage clutch at idle, bring engine up to desired RPM, drag harrow all day (in same gear) stop at dusk. At the end of the day the wear on the clutch couldn"t be measured with a nano-micrometer.

vs. hired help plowing snow with an oversize bucket in parking lots all day.
 
Actually, going to have to confess.
I"m a paid plant for the "wet clutch industrial complex"

I"ll probably get fired for this but my conscience got the best of me.

Wet clutches were pushed on the unaware tractor consumers by a secret global organization to undermine the production of American farmers, thereby reducing America to becoming a third world producer of farm products.

Congratulations Rod for exposing this evil conspiracy and saving America.
 
There is no dry clutch in the hydraulic reverser equiped M9000. There are lots of M9000's in the US.

Behind the engine is a damper disc bolted to the flywheel. It has the springs in the centre like a clutch disc but it is bolted in place.

All clutch work is done in the wet pack. The hydraulics have an inching valve to try to get better clutch feel but it was improved a bunch in the latest revision to the M9540 series.

Rod probably like dry clutches for a few reasons, you can inch with them to hook up implements, you can replace them for a few hundred bucks easily, you can dianose and troubleshoot them easily. And with a good operator they last a long time.

Wet clutches are good in loader applications because even with a fairly good operator, a loader tractor clutch has about a 1000-2500 hour life. Thats fine in an open station but in a modern cab tractor it is not cheap to split the machine for a 300 $ clutch.

The dry clutches in that series of Kubota for whatever reason have a terrible reputation when a loader is attached. The wet clutches have a fantastic rep.
 

The diagram
v6168.jpg
 
Wow, Thanks Ken,

You are worth more money.

Yeah, I know there are lots of M9000s out there, just a little frustrated humour.
You are exactly right about ease of inching, etc.
Especially not much fun being in the bucket pruning with a chainsaw and the wife operating.
There are those downsides to the hyd clutch, but as you stated for loader work they are a pretty good deal.

I sorta came to the conclusion that the parts books they were looking at were just showing the DT models, and not the HD.

Funny though how the various shops didn"t have a hands on experience, maybe a good thing?

Thanks again for your research.
 

Drove an open station M9000 fwa with syncro shuttle, it had a few hours on it.

Did not like the cheapo shuttle lever on the dash, the example I drove was quite sloppy.

I had to road the tractor, pulled out on the road, shifted High range 1 2 3 4 in order..soon as I hit an upgrade...the dry clutch slipped bad. Obviously I have no way of knowing how many hours were on that clutch or what the work habits were of the operator, but the comment on the dry clutch and loader reminded me of the whole experience!
 
I'm not to sure what the problem is with those clutches. They just don't last in a 6800. Best I can tell the same clutch is in the 6030 and has over 3900 hours on it. It may go another 1000 hours yet. I think it has somthing to do with that sync shuttle and always slipping the clutch loading bales, etc.
 
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