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Im sure you could figure it out

L

Lanse

Well-known Member
So i think i'll just ask you so i dont break something else. I still cant get a peice of file out of my oil passage. This is the picture, same as last time, escept i spent a few bucks on an easy out to remove the brass thingy, but the peice of the file is still in there.

The file is in about two inches. Ive tried a vacum, compressed air, a telescoping magnet (couldnt get one narrow enough) and some bent over wire. The wire couldnt be bent over enough to sneak past the file.

Im still stuck here, any help would be appriciated.

The good news is i got the alternater on there, i had to replace the bolt i lost. Atleast that one diddnt get broken out in an oil galley......
c1934.jpg
 
If it is loose enough to wiggle I would buy a retrieving magnet at Wal-Mart in the boat section. rated for an unbelievable amount (500#or such)
 
Lanse If this file piece is loose you should be able to get it out with almost any magnet that has decent pull. A magnet from a busted speaker would do fine. Get a nail about 3 inches long with a big flat head and file the pointed end flat. Attach the big head of the nail to the magnet and lower the filed flat end down the hole. It should attach itself to the file piece and you can lift it out.
 
I like the speaker magnet and nail idea.

I don't know how far down the engine is disassembled right now so the rest of this maay be impractical, but here goes. I can't tell from the photo where you are on the block and to be honest, have never been that far inside an AC motor to give you a solid clue as to where to try, but have thought since the beginnning of this part of your adventure to suggest seeing if you can snake a wire up from further down in the system. Instead of trying to pull it out the top, push it up from the bottom.

Use something that will stay together when it flexes like some insulated 14 or 16 gauge stranded wire and see if you can find the path to it from the other side.

Might be a washed up idea, but you've got to get it out of there and it seems like it might be worth a try.
 
If you can see the file--You might be able to get it with a special pair of "long thin jawed" needle nose pliers. I have two sets and have found them to be of great use. Most electrical and hobby suppliers have them.
 
Where this thing is:

On the outside of the head. You can see it when you look at the engine, which is back together except for unimportant things like the reaiator and magneto. That thing was an oil fitting. On one end is the filter base and on the other it-well, part of a file. I doubt i could poke it out.


Since theres no more good country music (or so i think) i could destroy a working radio, which is still dont want to do. I dont think i have a big magnet anywhere, i couldnt find one out in the shop.
 
Nope, it wont work.

The oil passage bends 90 degrees, and the file hunk was big enough not to fall down there, but is over the top of the drop off. I think a wire would just push it up. Thank you for the suggestion sir.
 
Well, here's another idea for what its worth. Can you put some J.B. Weld in a thin hollow metal tube that is a little larger than the file and slide the file up in it and let it set up?
 
Is there a car salvage yard nearby? Go there and spend $5 for an old speaker that they"ve taken out of the back seat of a car. You can take it apart for the magnet. It"s a cheap, strong magnet that you can add to your tool collection.
 
Lanse, could you get a drinking straw in the opening and over the end of the file? A decent plastic one might have enough tension when pushed over the end of the file to hold it during extraction. If not, fill the end of the straw with wheel bearing grease, it ought to be thick enough to allow removal of the file. I've used a bit of grease on the end of a small screwdriver to remove screws from recesses on engines before. It might be worth a shot.
 
Lanse, Since you started coming on here your grammar, syntax and spelling have made remarkable improvements. I'm not the verbal police, but since we have decided you are going to college..
Oil passages are "galleries" or a gallery. A Galley is a Navy kitchen.

Old bold Navy Pilot, Gordo
 
Do you have one of your tractors up for sale on ebay ??? I saw an orange one with gray primer for sale in Ohio and thought of you ? maybe it isn't ?
 
No, it diddnt work. I got a nail and ground the head down so it would fit in the passage, but it wouldnt come out. Thanks anyways Sir
 
What??? All i have is a wheelhorse lawnmower in grey primer. I woulda finished the job before selling something, even if i could part with one of my girls
 
I tried that. And left it overnight. Came back in the morning and found the nail on the floor, and then had to clean the "weld" out of the passage. Lucky me (for once) most of it stayed with the nail. Thank you anyway.
 
I tried that. And left it overnight. Came back in the morning and found the nail on the floor, and then had to clean the "weld" out of the passage. Lucky me (for once) most of it stayed with the nail. Thank you anyway.
 
the opening of the hole is about 1/4 inch , and the thing is back there a ways, so no, i dont think pliers would do. Crossed my mind however, but the auto parts store diddnt have any narrow.
 
I wish you could get less for more. At the local hardware store, a quart of paint seemed aweful light. So i got the one behind it. Same thing. Then i held a couple colors and they still seemed light. I got what i needed and came home. As compared to another unopened quart from a few weeks ago, the new one was lighter, and about 1/6 emptyer.

Same thing with hardware. Sorta. The lables are all wrong. I sent my mom to pick up 4 9/16 bolts and nuts on her way home the other day, so i could bolt down my bench grinder and drill press, and she came back with 3/4. OK, atleast she tried. So i had bolts with me, and looked back there. the entire 9/16 drawer was full of 3/4. Nice. Look around and see no one.

So i go ask the cashier whats going on. She said she diddnt know, and all she did was run the store alone for the last hour its open. Not sure i'd tell that to everyone who walks through the door, but whatever. She said they had been selling alot more hardware then normal in the past few weeks, however.

I ended up using a tape measure borrowed off the shelf to identify a bunch of 1/2 and 9/16 bolts i had lost and had to replace, but it goes to show how dishonest people are, that i was the first to say anything about this......
 
Aint got a magnet like that. And theres no car junkyard around here. That i know of.
 
Lanse
I think I have a solution to your problem. If I remember right this is a small AC tractor so just flip it over and shake the daylights out of it till the file drops out. Just kidding (LOL).

If there is a tube fastened to it from the bottom side, see if you can find you a small diameter long flexible spring. Here in the dry climate we have something like that we use to clean out the tubes for evaporative coolers. Push the spring in from the bottom and shove the file back out the top. Just a thought, hope you get it with one these suggestions on here.
 
I:

A) would have a very hard time getting to walmart
B) have no intention of buying anything from walmart.
C) dont think there is a boat section since the nearest lake is quite a ways away

Mabey this is something that could be had online???
 
lanse, heres two other things to try. if you have a shop vac, or even a house vac with a hose, put it over the hole and see if you can get the pice out that way, you may need to wrap a rag around the end of the hose to get a better seal. if the metal piece is loose in there, the vac should pull it out. (sidebar note, shop vacs are also great for unclogging a stopped up sink). other thing would be to get a dental pick (most hardware stores have them in the bargain bins) they come in a variety of pick configurations, you can probe in there and gently pull the piece of metal out. btw how did the file get in there?
 
That tube goes directially to the filter on here. I accually dont think turning the tractor on its side is a bad idea. Unless it would bend an axle or something....... It would with my luck....

But-before you say it: Its bound to happen sooner or later with my driving
 
Someone said to tap the end of a file in there and twist that. It broke. He later posted and said i'll break a few before i get the hang of it. I shoulda just bought the easy out which i ended up doing anyway.
 
If you have a Radio Shack somewhere close they might have some fine nosed needle nose or a pick.If you can find a pick somewhere that you use to take o rings out of grooves with maybe you can get that past it and pull it out.
 
Lanse, I asked you for a pic the other day so that we could see what you are working with but here goes.with a small screw driver try to wiggle the thing loose go from side to side putting pressure on it kinda like prying something off only apply slight pressure so that you don't break the screwdriver. it may take a while to loosen it and it may not even work but sometimes when something is wedged in as with the tapered end of a file all it takes to loosen it is side pressure.
 
Glennster is onto something that might break it loose enough for a magnet, vacuum or chewing gum to lift it out. A pick. I don't know how hard you were whangin' on it when you drove it down through, but it sounds like it's wedged in, bein held by a sharp broken edge. Dental picks are a good idea, and may work, but they're made for teeth and will bend pretty easily when applied to steel, so it may take something heavier. Lots of folks make them, but by way of bein' handy to acquire, Craftsman has a 4-piece set of heavy picks that are of different shapes (from straight scratch awl to hooks and compound curves), one of which might have enough meat to it to allow you to get it down in to pop it loose enough for one of the other methods to work for ya.
 
Lanse,

Have you tried to flush it out with oil or if the oil galley goes to the filter you might be able to put a pipe fitting on and a rig a pump to that to run some oil back through and push it out. Or maybe put some wadding in the port to build some pressure and try to blow it out with air.
 
If you are careful, I have had success with two other ways to do this job. If you have a stick welder, stick a small welding rod through the hole and make sure it touches the file. While doing this, have the welding ground disconnected and have the amps of the welder cut down. The object is to stick the rod to the file. When you are ready and you are touching the file, have a helper just TOUCH the welder ground to the tractor. Hopefully it will work. REMEMBER--disconect the battery cable ground before doing this! The other way, that you may want to try first, is to use a wooden dowel and small hammer to try and stick the file.
 
I read all the ideas that did not work, Dang.
Try this! Put a rubber tube in the opposite end of the hole (filter base). Put a grease fitting into the hose and clamp it in place. (some rubber fitting ideas might be needed) Then pump the line full of heavy grease. Out it comes! Good luck, Jim
 
Thin flat piece of metal and some J B Weld might work. Put an ample amount on the thin metal then work it down the hole and try and make face to face contact with the piece of the file. You can pull but also wiggle it some with the flat metal.
 
Is there vets office close by? A cattle magnet is pretty strong and I've had good luck with them. Maybe he'd (the vet)let you borrow one!!! Harold
 
Lanse,
If you're going to use the vacuum trick you need to seal the back side of the hole as well as side from which you're sucking. If you don't it just lets air go righ around your file and doesnt create a vacuum. If the other end of that "tube" ends at the filter as you say, you need to take the filter off and plug the tube.
 
I've wondered but am still not clear: how tight is the file in the hole? Can you see it? And does it plug the hole?

These guys are real creative. Me, I'd probably try to chock it all in a drill press and use a drill bit thats only 1/3 the size of your file to drill it out or break it up for easier removal.

Alternately I ask, where is this oil passage? If all it does is let oil out to the gage I'd consider leaving it until the oil blows it out.
 
Maybe I haven't followed this close enough, but if I understand that you TAPPED the file into the hole, then twisted it, and it broke by twisting it- -I think you have a serious problem. I doubt that any of the suggestions mentioned is going to remove it. Not if it's in there that tight, 'cause that sucker is STUCK! If this oil line simply feeds the oil pressure gage, there probably is adequate oil that gets past the file to reach the gage and register the pressure. In that case, just leave the file in there. But be sure to blow out any filings/grit/loose rust, etc.
 
Sounds like you twisted the file off inside the hole...which is the worst scenario I could think of. I also would find the person who suggested using A FILE as an EZ-Out...and frankly explain that files are not made to BEND.

1. Find a shop with an Machine Shop with EDM capability and have them remove the file tip. If its turned then the edges of the tool steel have ground into the passage walls. Your not pulling it out or sucking it out or blowing it out anytime soon.
2. Buy yourself an AC refrigeration recharge canister at the parts store and see if you cannot shoot some refrigerant into hte passage onto the file piece. The trick here is either to shrink the file material from the passage walls or to weaken it enough to smash it into smaller pieces.
3. Buy the narrowest neednose pliers you can find and then grind them down to just a thin set of jaws...yes they will be useless afterwards but right now it sounds like the engine is in the same situation.
3. Get a stopper or plug on the other end of that passage and fill the tube up with some sort of lubricant and try to get a thin screwdriver or piece of tool steel down to work the file chunk from side to side. The key here is to break the lock of the material sticking to the sides of the passage..once its actually loose I think you could then deploy the magnet, JBweld, Welding techniques described above.

Good luck...and if anything think of this as a lesson on using tools for the purpose intended.
 
Lanse:

I'd pull the head and take it to a Machine Shop that has the appropriate tools to replace the fitting and remove the file.

Jim
 
You would rather have a broken file in your engine than going to Walmart to get something that could remove the broken file? Walmart exists because of free enterprise that is allowed in North America. Walmart is the largest retailer in the world. They don't treat their employees the best and put a lot of smaller stores out of business but they make billions and billions of dollars. I think a lot of the people that dislike Walmart are perhaps a little jealous. Walmart does usually have the lowest price on most items.
 
Lanse, Im curious where this fitting goes to. If its just to your oil pressure gauge Id crank it up and see if any oil comes out, if you get any flow at all it should work fine, gauges dont need volume, ever notice how small the inside diameter is on the tubing that goes to a oil pressure gauge?
good luck OCG
 
Used files MANY times to remove broken brass fittings. Not all of us are quite as rambunctious as Lance and realize that finesse gets more done than force.
 
Hello Lanse.
How about weldimg the hole shut, redrill and tap to the size you need? Brazing may work also.
Guido.
 
As much as I am bored by this topic... several thoughts occur. First, having removed the brass part, I assume you can see your quarry. Have you tried grinding down a pair of cheap needle nosed pliers, and grabbing on and wiggling it out? Assuming that didn't work, my next step would be the nail trick, grind one side of an appropriately sized nail down, insert and rotate to hook the inner end. Attach a pair of vise grips to the nail, or better yet get a slide hammer that attaches to the vise grips, and 2 or 3 quick licks should solve the problem. Now I am bored and tired of typing.
 
Some file facts.Good files have soft tangs,the rest of file is hard.Junk files are glass hard clear thru.Files are not chisels or easy outs.Saw files are used to sharpen saws only.Good handles are a must unless you want a file tang thru your hand.On store hardware you can expect clerks and customers to mix sizes often.Thats why this old man has an old 10 foot tape measure in his pocket at all times.7/16 and 9/16 bolts and nuts are an uncommon size and not even stocked by many stores.buy extra bolts so you have some for the next time.You will find unthreaded nuts and bolts and wrong lengths in the same box.
 
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