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Nit-Pick this 14K trailer for me

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pburchett

Member
I currently have a Kubota MX 5200 HST 4x4 tractor with front end loader and implements. Total weight with loader and an implement on the rear is about 7000 lbs.

My neighbor is going to buy my 7000 lb car hauler and cattle racks so I am going to use that money to purchase a heavier trailer.

I have 2 options for trailers near me that look promising: One which is this North Shore trailer (2 hrs away). Could I get this trailer nit-picked by the YT-DOT or any other person with experience and keen eyes?

I’m going to call tomorrow and get some specs on the trailer. I imagine the tires are Chinese and the axles may be as well. At this price it may have the thinnest c-channel available but with the 8 inch tongue and what looks to be a 6 inch frame it may be suitable for my load.

mvphoto28138.jpg



The other trailer is this 12,000 lb for $2995 but it does not look as good. To my untrained eyes it appears to be made of 5 or 6 inch c-channel.

mvphoto28139.jpg


Thanks for the help!
 
That 14K looks similar to mine, though not exact.
I am much happier with the larger jack back near the
front of the trailer as opposed to out near the tongue.
It works very easily, can have a power drill hooked to
it and you can still open your tailgate on your pickup.
 
im more a gooseneck with deck over construction kind of fella . those fender would be in the way loading hay and such. but hey they both are nice looking trailer for sure I wouldn't be afraid of either of those.
 
They both look like the frames are
strong enough. The top one says
crossmembers at 16", so that is good.
The top one has a heavier jack, but the
jack on the lower one is a good jack.
The 14k trailer will have 8 bolt wheels
and the 12k will likely have 6 bolt,
but can have 8 bolt. The 14k gets
stronger magnets in the brakes for a
bit better braking. That's about all I
can see with the info you gave.
 
I don't think you can go wrong with the 14,000 one. Most have Dexter axles when that heavy. Can't get them at that price here in MI. Looks like spring loaded ramps too. That trailer is probably going to weigh in at 3500 empty so should be good but will be a load for any truck. Hope you have good heavy 3/4 or 1 ton. Yur gonna be around 11,000. That's a good price tho and looks to be a well built trailer.
 
Decent price for a small trailer.
You will discover how small when you put a car on it and can't open the door or it's too skinny to haul a truck on.
 
I like the tilt trailers for hauling tractors. I don?t like to mess with ramps. My cornpro 21 ft tilt trailer pulls
nice behind a 1/2 ton pickup. It?s a 14000 pound 83 inches between fenders.
 
Cross members are to far apart. You want them at 12 inches. When the floor gets older and some rot they will fall through and leave you with problems with the tires to deep in the cross members. You could plank it for that where the tires would run too.
Also if you happen to move a weight that is concentrated in a small area like a stack of weights it could become a problem with damage to the floor thus the reason for the 12 inch cross members. Most manufacturers will be at the spacing you are looking at. Would probably have to order a trailer to get the 12 inch setting. Will also be a bit heavier too.
So pay up front or pay later on that.
 
12" would be very close on a trailer like that and likely special order. The cheaper ones sometimes go to 24" which I think is too wide. But 16" is a very good spacing and will work fine for the loads he will haul.
 
i have a 20 ft. deckover, 16 ft. flat w/th 4 ft. dove tail, what i don't like about it is the torsion axles. might get ya lower but seems to fight the hitch when empty. might want to pull one if it has the torsion axles to see if you like it.
 

I have three trailers. The equipment carrier bumper pull replaced a car carrier type which was too narrow. I think that mine is a little longer than yours and I am still out over the front, and every now and then a little out over the rear. For the size of your tractor with loader then add a rear implement, these may be a little shorter than you want to be. I would tape some theoretical lengths and see how they will come out on these trailers.
 
I have a 18ft long 10K lb trailer with hydraulic tilt bed bought a few years ago new for $4400,steel deck too.I love the tilt bed would hate to go back to ramps.I've hauled some heavy loads on it.I guess trailers have gone up in price.
 
I have a hard time fitting wide tractors between the fenders so I got a deck over 102". Farmall Regular, F-20 and any 8' implements fit on deck over no problem.
 
My Suretrak 14k implement trailer has two 7k Dexter axles. I can grease
wheel bearings by using a grease gun. Brakes on both axles.

Only thing I didn't like was the knee under the ramps. Mine was too far
forward and the ramps wanted to come up. I had to modify knee and make sure
it was under the ramp, not in front.

I wish my trailer was lower. The ramps and dovetail are a bit too steep. Wood
dovetail is very slick with a little snow or wet. With dovetail wasn't wood.

When I'm pulling my trailer empty, it kicks the truck's butt. You may want to
see if you can pull the trailer empty before buying it.
 
So as to not have any problems with the
real DOT, you might want to have that
12,000 # trailer de-rated to 10,000 pounds.
In other words, make sure that VIN tag says
10,000# so that you don't need a CDL. No
one is ever going to weigh you, but they
will look at that tag.
 
Not sure that 10k applies in all states. In Indiana we have to go over 26K total to be under our states DOT. Check with your state to be sure.
 
(quoted from post at 10:13:45 12/17/18) So as to not have any problems with the
real DOT, you might want to have that
12,000 # trailer de-rated to 10,000 pounds.
In other words, make sure that VIN tag says
10,000# so that you don't need a CDL. No
one is ever going to weigh you, but they
will look at that tag.
Click to expand...

Not gonna work. It's the combined GVWR thats going to matter. You aren't going to get the truck and trailer under 10K CGVWR if you're going to haul a 7K tractor. The truck alone is going to have a GVWR of probably at least 7Km so that only eaves you with 3K for the trailer. Can't haul a 7k tractor on a trailer with a GVWR of 3k.

As far as Licensing, that's a state issue and in most states you can have a CGVWR up to 26K without needed a CDL B. If the truck has a GVWR over 26K and the trailer a GVWR over 10K then you are into CDL A territory, at least for interstate. Intrastate may have different rules in your specific state.
 

I would do a search on the maker of the trailer and pros and cons from actual owners. If the brand is a real dog, there will be people saying so online.
 
According to the regulations, a trailer over 10,000 gross requires a CDL and falls under DOT regulations. That is spelled out plainly in the rule book. While states may or may not enforce that to the letter or may allow different in-state regulations, the federal still is the authority as soon as you cross a state line.
 
In the state of Indiana there are cases where you don't need a CDL. For one farmers and family along with hired help don't need a CDL but can only haul their own product or equipment. Also any vehicle used for personal use or recreational vehicle used for personal use only needs no CDL.
 
I am like you Jon I have had trailers all my life and have three sitting here now. For a normal use trailer 12 inches is just toting too much dead weight. Have a 16 in center trailer out here that I know is 21 years old and no floor problems and skid-steers to concrete the weight more than tractors. People tend to buy too much trailer and their truck is loaded BEROE they get the load. I am the other way I want the lightest trailer I can get that will do the job.
 
After calling around I found out that the 12,000 lb trailer had a 5 inch frame and cross members on 24 inch centers. I think its a pass on this one.
mvphoto28175.png



The trailer from KnK (below) which is made by North Shore Manufacturing in Brownsville TN interest me except for the fact that the axles are from "Axle Plus" which is probably a Chinese company and the cross members are 2x3 angle iron on 16 inch centers. I could probably live with the Axle Plus axles as many companies I called are using them.

What I do not know about is the 2x3 angle iron cross members. I don't want the trailer to fold in half from the weight of the tractor on the angle iron. Since I have no experience with this matter what does the forum say about the angle iron cross members. Good, it will do, or stay away from this trailer.

mvphoto28176.jpg
 
Jimg: what rule book are you referring to? According to FMCSA rules and regulations ( the federal body in charge of CDL / CMV Operations), part 383.5 (a): CDL is required when combined gvwr is over 26,000# AND trailer is over 10,000. No stand alone trailer requirement exists. That allows the truck rental company to hook a 10k trailer to a 26k truck and let someone take off cross country with it that has never driven anything larger than a Datsun without a cdl or any training. If under 26001lb combined weight, trailer gvwr irrelevant
 
Yes and no

If for hire then you need a CDL endorsement when the trailer exceeds 10K that?s why you see a lot of 9999 trailers

If not for hire and you have a passenger car license then your ok as long as your combined weight is less than 26k

If not for hire but you have a CDL then CDL rules apply

At least in my state. Other states can be different

Trailer sales guy gave me a great example

They had a truck with a sleeper registered as a RV. Went with his wife to pick up and transport some trailers. Not for hire as they owned them

He had a CDL and had to fill out log books and stop at weight stations.

Wife had a passenger license and could pass the weight stations and wasn?t required to fill out a log book.

If they were paid for the trip even a tip then she would be in trouble

Go figure
 
How thick are they? If they are 1/4"
they should be ok at 16". 3/16" would
probly be ok, 1/8" run away. The good
news with angle is they don't rust
much. Not a fan of angle for that use
myself, but plenty of trailers out
there hauling stuff with them.
 
My motto has always been every pound in the trailer is a pound of frieght not ON the trailer. You want them strong enough, but only strong enough to do the job you want. And over all, floors are cheap. A new floor might cost a couple hundred, but it's always a big deal to folks for some reason.
 
Not necessarily. I know guys that pull and deliver the rv/travel trailers from north Indiana to points all over the country. They watch the shipping weights on the bill of sale to be sure to stay under 26k. They have no CDL. Trailer weights don't matter as long as under 26k. Neighbor uses a 3/4 ton ram. That would likely be 10kgvwr. Allowing him to pull a 16000lb trailer
 
(quoted from post at 22:52:57 12/17/18) Not necessarily. I know guys that pull and deliver the rv/travel trailers from north Indiana to points all over the country. They watch the shipping weights on the bill of sale to be sure to stay under 26k. They have no CDL. Trailer weights don't matter as long as under 26k. Neighbor uses a 3/4 ton ram. That would likely be 10kgvwr. Allowing him to pull a 16000lb trailer
Click to expand...

Holy crap. Look, this stuff isn't that hard. If these dudes you know delivering RVs are using shipping weights as justification for not having a CDL and the GVWR or CVGWR is over 26K then it's just a matter of time before they get nailed. The magic number is the Combined Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (CGVWR) but that's ONLY for licensing. And trailer weights DO matter as far as the FMSCR is concerned since the CGVWR can move a non-CMV into CMV status, eg- a landscapers 8K pickup isn't a CMV, but when he puts a trailer with a GVWR of 4K behind it then it becomes a CMV. Your pals can probably pull a 5th wheel camper anywhere on class D license, but they still are going to fall under the FMCSR. If they're one of the guys pulling a gooseneck car carrier loaded with 2 or 3 trailers and the GVWR on the gooseneck is 20K and they drag it with a 3/4 ton truck (unlikely) with a GVWR of 10K (also unlikely) then he needs a class A if he's interstate.

A lot of people here are confusing LICENSING which is a State issue, especially for intrastate use, with DOT regulations for Commercial Motor Vehicles, especially those in interstate use. It's 2 different things.
 
(quoted from post at 20:05:27 12/17/18) Yes and no

If for hire then you need a CDL endorsement when the trailer exceeds 10K that?s why you see a lot of 9999 trailers

If not for hire and you have a passenger car license then your ok as long as your combined weight is less than 26k

If not for hire but you have a CDL then CDL rules apply

At least in my state. Other states can be different

Trailer sales guy gave me a great example

They had a truck with a sleeper registered as a RV. Went with his wife to pick up and transport some trailers. Not for hire as they owned them

He had a CDL and had to fill out log books and stop at weight stations.

Wife had a passenger license and could pass the weight stations and wasn?t required to fill out a log book.

If they were paid for the trip even a tip then she would be in trouble

Go figure
Click to expand...

Not even close to legal for interstate travel. Either your friend is lying to you or he doesn't know what he's talking about. "For hire" has nothing to do with the issue. It's whether of not he's in commerce, eg- if he's a trailer salesman then he's in commerce! If he had a truck, and I assume you mean a tractor since you mentioned a sleeper, and he had it registered, somehow, as an RV and was using it in his business in INTERSTATE commerce, then he wasn't legal at all. His wife was either illegally driving or illegally not filling out the log, etc.

If you aren't in a CMV and have a CDL then "CDL rules", whatever you think they are, don't apply. IOW, when you have a CDL and you're in your 1/2 ton PU going to the grocery store you don't have to run a log etc.
 
(quoted from post at 07:07:16 12/18/18)
(quoted from post at 20:05:27 12/17/18) Yes and no

If for hire then you need a CDL endorsement when the trailer exceeds 10K that?s why you see a lot of 9999 trailers

If not for hire and you have a passenger car license then your ok as long as your combined weight is less than 26k

If not for hire but you have a CDL then CDL rules apply

At least in my state. Other states can be different

Trailer sales guy gave me a great example

They had a truck with a sleeper registered as a RV. Went with his wife to pick up and transport some trailers. Not for hire as they owned them

He had a CDL and had to fill out log books and stop at weight stations.

Wife had a passenger license and could pass the weight stations and wasn?t required to fill out a log book.

If they were paid for the trip even a tip then she would be in trouble

Go figure
Click to expand...

Not even close to legal for interstate travel. Either your friend is lying to you or he doesn't know what he's talking about. "For hire" has nothing to do with the issue. It's whether of not he's in commerce, eg- if he's a trailer salesman then he's in commerce! If he had a truck, and I assume you mean a tractor since you mentioned a sleeper, and he had it registered, somehow, as an RV and was using it in his business in INTERSTATE commerce, then he wasn't legal at all. His wife was either illegally driving or illegally not filling out the log, etc.

If you aren't in a CMV and have a CDL then "CDL rules", whatever you think they are, don't apply. IOW, when you have a CDL and you're in your 1/2 ton PU going to the grocery store you don't have to run a log etc.
Click to expand...

Brett, I think that you are missing the basic issue here. YTDOT laws are very clear that any time someone knows someone who has hauled a load or pulled a trailer in direct violation of FMCSA rules, but does not get caught, the supposed rules are then nullified.
 
(quoted from post at 11:23:20 12/18/18)
(quoted from post at 07:07:16 12/18/18)
(quoted from post at 20:05:27 12/17/18) Yes and no

If for hire then you need a CDL endorsement when the trailer exceeds 10K that?s why you see a lot of 9999 trailers

If not for hire and you have a passenger car license then your ok as long as your combined weight is less than 26k

If not for hire but you have a CDL then CDL rules apply

At least in my state. Other states can be different

Trailer sales guy gave me a great example

They had a truck with a sleeper registered as a RV. Went with his wife to pick up and transport some trailers. Not for hire as they owned them

He had a CDL and had to fill out log books and stop at weight stations.

Wife had a passenger license and could pass the weight stations and wasn?t required to fill out a log book.

If they were paid for the trip even a tip then she would be in trouble

Go figure
Click to expand...

Not even close to legal for interstate travel. Either your friend is lying to you or he doesn't know what he's talking about. "For hire" has nothing to do with the issue. It's whether of not he's in commerce, eg- if he's a trailer salesman then he's in commerce! If he had a truck, and I assume you mean a tractor since you mentioned a sleeper, and he had it registered, somehow, as an RV and was using it in his business in INTERSTATE commerce, then he wasn't legal at all. His wife was either illegally driving or illegally not filling out the log, etc.

If you aren't in a CMV and have a CDL then "CDL rules", whatever you think they are, don't apply. IOW, when you have a CDL and you're in your 1/2 ton PU going to the grocery store you don't have to run a log etc.
Click to expand...

Brett, I think that you are missing the basic issue here. YTDOT laws are very clear that any time someone knows someone who has hauled a load or pulled a trailer in direct violation of FMCSA rules, but does not get caught, the supposed rules are then nullified.
Click to expand...

:lol: Oh! Okay, my bad. :oops: I forget sometimes that the internet is an altered universe where the laws of man and physics don't apply. :shock: My shame may well be more than I can bear! :lol:
 
Well being here less than a 100 miles form the plant and selling 70+ Kubota package deals a year I am familiar with the North Star trailer. They private brand the trailers we sell and paint and welding is on par for the price. IF you get one here is what we add to the 7,000 trailer. We add a chain box, spare and holder and put kick out plates in front of and back of the fenders and add a bar to prevent tail light damage. I am a firm believer in slide out ramps. One those fold up one are always in the way if you want to hang over, second lots of time there is a small ditch or ramp and do not need ramps . North Stars slide in are pretty neat and heavy enough, and yes I know it does not support the rear of the trailer , so one just has to decide what is pest. Anyway I think the lighter trailer will do what you want and angel iron cross members have not given us any trouble. Photos attached.
cvphoto6325.jpg


cvphoto6326.jpg


cvphoto6327.jpg
 
I just called North Shore Manufacturing and talked with the owner of the trailer company (he answered the phone) . He said the cross members were 3/16 angle and he would upgrade to 3 inch c-channel for an extra $100. That was a no brainer. He even directed me to the closest dealer near me which was KnK trailers as they received a load every week so I could get my trailer faster. Total cost for a 22ft (20+2) 14k trailer and a spare was $4205.

Thanks to all who helped!
 
Hey jm I like the kick out plates and the light protector. I'll steal you design.

I ordered the stand up ramps. If I do not like them I'll weld up some slide in ones later.
 
You will like that trailer, and look close at how we mount the spare it is quick to remove if it is ever in the way.
 
Do you have more pictures of that spare tire mount jm.?
It looks like it has one bolt holding it on and then the tire
lays against the tongue rail so it doesn't swivel/pivot?
 
Royse Just saw the post. It is a long bolt with a flat clip on the trailer side. Slides up over the angel iron front and yes the tire rest on the front hitch. Made it where it can be removed if need to put something up on that front board. Also welded a tang on the nut so that you can remove the bolt without a wrench. Figuring we would not have a wrench when we needed the spare. LOL
 
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