It would be in the best interest of all of us if a big company like VW or Ford would just thumb their noses at the EPA.
 
Law firm initiating it because its an ideal setup for a "class action" lawsuit. You know, where each litigant gets six dollars and eleven cents and the law firm gets $17 million. Law firm doesn't care a whit about the subject of the action, they just talk a good game so they can get enough participants to make it a gold mine for the firm.
 
You will get no argument from me, Rusty, but the heavy hand of government would crush them if they did.

Dean
 
WHAT SMOKE????
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Pretty sad world we live in when major manufactures have to "rig tests" just to stay competitive and thereby stay in business. Interesting I just seen today on Craigslist a "module" for Case-IH tractors that over rode the emissions and therefore by passed the DEF. I wonder the bigger picture. If the feds are eventualy going to crack down. Also what such a deal would do for the warranty. Though it does show very clearly the disconnect between the people building these new cars trucks and tractors and the people actualy buying and using them. Its interesting all the cars running around with the Cats removed but the dealers and shops and govt. telling us we "need" them. One more thought back in the days of cars and trucks with the round air filters it was common to flip the cover upside down to increase fuel mileage. Dont know if it was ever proven on the fuel mileage but I know some who actauly got fined for doing it. "Tampering with emissions" they called it. Heaven forbid someone modify the vehicle they bought and paid for.
 
I think VW should have when the goverment started in on them just pulled all remaining inventory, vehicals and parts and pulled out of the USA and said we are never comming back.
 
Truckers were having a lot of problems with the emission systems on their new trucks. So a LOT of them have been buying new glider trucks and putting in rebuilt pre emission engines. Now the EPA wants to make gliders illegal.
 
Cat said to heck with it, and pulled out of the truck market several years ago. The only problems with my 2010 Freighterliner have all been emissions related, and that has been several thousand dollars.
 
Probably the same lawyers that tried to sue Menards and Home Depot because a 2x4 board doesn't actually measure 2"x4".
 
I don't believe there's a disconnect between the vehicle manufacturers and the consumers. As an
example, the ag machine I'm responsible for the engineering on has a DEF system and all the other
jazz that goes along with it. Lots of cost and complexity added for no benefit to our customers.
There's nobody in our company that likes this but the fact remains that if we want to sell
machines in most of the developed world (the US emissions standards are the same as they are in
the European Union, Canada, and other places) we must abide by the law or exit the market. Since
we're in the ag equipment business the latter obviously isn't an option so we do the former,
whether we like it or not. And, when dealers and shops tell people that they need the emissions
equipment that their vehicles were made with they are just protecting themselves from potential
fines. Everyone knows they don't NEED it but nobody wants to be the one to say "yeah, go ahead
and remove that, it's OK".
 
Exactly how many cars and truck are running around without catalytic converters?
 
When I think back to the Boston Tea Party days when self sufficient folks had enough and stood up and did what needed to be done and to where we are now, it's embarrassing. It truly is.

Remember a couple of decades ago when Miller Lite Beer ran the commercials, "What if you crossed..."? Remember the one where they crossed calf roping with attorneys where they opened the gate and some attorney in a suit and carrying a brief case ran out of the gate for his life as a fella came racing up horse back to lasso him? And then a bunch of lawyers got together and threatened to sue Miller Brewing for making it unsafe to be an attorney? I thought it was a great commercial and should be rerun about now.

Mark
 
A guy I know was growling one day that a 16' plank was more than double the price of an 8' plank. Thought he should have gotten it cheaper because he was buying more. Guess he didn't spend much time in the woods.
 
The latest round of emissions laws are a joke. Tier 1 and 2 eliminated about 80% of targeted emissions, tier 3 eliminated about 5% more, tier 4 the most expensive and most burdensome in terms of maintenance and lost performance eliminates about 1% or less. Due to lost performance and the additional fuel needed Tier 4 probably adds to total emissions.
 
No argument from me, dhermesc.

Emissions regulations reached diminishing returns in the 1970s.

Of course, the job of ANY government agency is NEVER finished. If it was, there would be no need of the agency.

Dean
 
I don't know about increasing mileage, but I always "flipped the lid" on the air cleaner on my 72 Pontiac Bonneville that had a 455 4-barrel and dual exhausts. No way could that engine breathe with the tin air intake opening it had on the cleaner. Made a big difference on HP and sure sounded great too when you stepped on it and opened up the 4-barrel. Mike
 
(quoted from post at 02:26:34 01/11/18) Exactly how many cars and truck are running around without catalytic converters?

Of course those cat replacement pipes are just for testing, right? I had an old van (1989) that the mechanic I used at the time said had a plugged catalytic converter. He drained the pellets out of it (it has a convenient plug on the bottom to do that) and I was good to go until I traded it in many years later.
 

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