Chainsaws won't run

I have 2 Stihl chainsaws. Both ran like xxx today. Stalled out over and over until I gave up. I have been using premium gas, putting the stihl 2 cycle oil in plus Stabil. But it is from about mid July. I had them checked last winter and one needed a new fuel one about 3 years ago. What are the odds they both need new fuel lines? Bad ethanol from July? I really don't want to be burning $20 per gallon saw fuel, but saws that won't run are useless.
 
(quoted from post at 18:03:17 11/11/17) . I have been using premium gas, putting the stihl 2 cycle oil in plus Stabil. .

This is just a stab in the dark, but is it possible there is too much fuel stabilizer in your fuel. The reason I say this is that Stihl 2cycle oil has a stabilizer in it already. Wonder what too much stabilizer would do.
 

The fuel lines go bad but so do the rubber diaphragms in the carb. A few years ago I went on line to order a rebuild kit for my Husky, and it was going to be around $21.00. but a whole new carb was only $3.00 more
 
I would stop the Stabil and use some Seafoam! I don't use Stabil and I don't have any problems, I have at least 8 2-stroke engines and have no problems, some as old as 45 years. I use premium gas without ethanol and generic 2-stroke oil, anytime one starts to run less than perfect I use a little Seafoam. Are the carburetors adjustable? Some of the newer ones are, some aren't.
 
I don't use any fuel additives and I haven't had fuel line problems in years(20+). I did need to replace fuel lines once way back when. But the new ones have stood up to e10 ever since. Last time I replaced carb diaphragms was maybe 7 years ago.

I just don't see a need for the snake oil.

All my saws are Stihl's. 026, 041, 028, 044
 
I borrowed my neighbor's battery Stihl chainsaw. Worked great. I was impressed. I'm saving for one.
 
Do not use Stabil. I makes everything very hard to start and does not do well at all w/2 cycle mixes. The little bit of alcohol in the fuel makes no difference today. It's been there since the 70s. There are other, emission controlling chemicals in fuel that does that deterioration. I've fought that battle for a long time with the public. I taught automotive type stuff in a post high school vocational school in MN for over 30 years. Fuels, like lubricating oils, have changed tremendously over the years to help manufacturers meet tailpipe emission standards
 
Good ol corn squeezins I had to completely gut and rebuild the carb on my 4 wheeler now my chainsaw needs the same thing
 
Do these units have the fuel filter at the end of the pick-up hose ? If so, that might be an area to explore. HTH
 
Can't understand it. Mine sit here for months at a time, sometimes for close to a year and start every time. Echo saw -- started it last week ran the e10 out of it that had been in there close to or over a year. Now running with e15. Runs great. I have owned this saw close to 20 years and never had the spark plug out of it, never had the carb off it. Don't use anything else in it. I cut 1 cord of wood per year, usually white or red oak and red elm if I can find it.
 
If your read your manual it will tell you NOT to run gas that is more than 30 days old. I find well over 50% of the 2 cycle repairs I do are nothing more than BAD gas. Dump it out and put in "fresh mix" an they run like a top. Put the old gas in your car when you have at least a half a tank or more and it will burn it with ZERO issues.

The trouble the gas ALL has oxygenates added. The cheaper gas has ethanol for that use. Premium non ethanol gas has methanol oxygenates in it. All Oxygenated gas will NOT store very long without the octane being lowered due to evaporation of the oxygenates. The low octane gas does not burn very well in small engines.
 
I must be doing something wrong, then. I've used nothing but E10 for years in everything, and I've never had a single problem I could blame onto it. My chain saws and other small engines sometimes sit for 6 months or more and always start right up.

The only reference I can find to ethanol in the books for both of my Stihl chain saws is they caution you not to use gasoline with OVER 10% ethanol.
 
Goose I am glad your stuff is working with the fuel your using. I know too that your experience is not the norm. The trouble is that the ethanol raises the octane level very well. So they can blend it with a much cheaper base fuel. The blend does not store very well usually.

Between myself, my sons and my brother we repair over 100 small engines each year. This would be chains saws up to garden tractors. A very large percentage of the no run/start/surging problems we see are engines that will not start/run on the old gas in the tanks. Drain the gas and put fresh in "fixes" the majority of them. I am seeing way fewer fuel line issues as most newer fuel line is safe with reasonable levels of ethanol. Really do not get too many "varnish" issues either unless it is some thing stored for long periods of time. Fall to spring usually is not long enough.

The manuals I am taking about are the later ones. I started seeing them with the storage warnings in about 2015. Some of the 2017 manuals talk about warranty issues if older fuel is used. I know the JD warranty excludes fuel quality issues and age of fuel is one of the exclusions.
 
I stopped using Stabil about 5 years ago and went to Briggs & Stratton fuel stabilizer and use 89 octane ethanol gasoline with Opti 2. I have no problems with fuel since going to B&S stabilizer and leave gas in saws all the time.I also use the B&S stabilizer in lawn & garden, snowblower, generator, and farm tractors.
 
I bought a new Stihl saw this summer, and they doubled the warranty if I bought a six pack of Stihl 2 cycle oil (which I did, of course)- he also told me to dump out the gas when I was done with the saw, and start it empty to burn out the gas still in the fuel lines. He also recommended non-ethanol fuel.
 
Bought a new ms310 9 years ago,and have used nothing but the lowest grade of ethanol gas. I did use the Stihl oil for the first year but have used other brands since then. The saw sits in the garage most of the time. Haven't burned wood for a couple of years so I only take it out to clean up brush and saplings once in a while.
I have never had a problem starting it and have never had to replace anything on it.
I don't add anything like stabil or seafoam to the gas. 2 pulls and away it goes every time.
 
Last summer the neighbor and I were cutting wood, and his wifes son (around 24 yo) came over with his almost brand new Stihl saw, and could not get it started, the only time he had used it was last November to cut up a tree. He spent about an hour trying to start it, had the plug out many times, and nothing. I told him to dump his gas in a container I use for old gas, and put some of my new gas with 2 stroke mix in ( Amsoil Interceptor). His saw fired right up after about 3 pulls, and ran fine the rest of the day. I also buy non ethanol premium to use in all my small engines, I have had zero problems since I started doing this. I also use 1 oz of Marvel Mystery oil in q 2 gal can of fuel and oil mix, I read that it helps 2 stroke engines start easier, and I believe it! Works for me...
 
Per your comments awhile ago, back when I switched carbs on a BS V twin per your recommendation, I have been using such in my small engines and have realized improvements worth the extra cost.

I know that premium is designed for high compression engines, to prevent pre-ignition, but aren't they made up of more of the volatile compounds which are what makes for the price increase? With that said and considering you have a fuel with this percent and that percent of these additives, and fuel evaporates over time, and the volatile go first leaving the base product which is what gums up the works, wouldn't one think that premium would stay "good" longer in addition to starting and running benefits.
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On the BS additive, first of all you have to ask yourself: If there wasn't a bonafide fuel problem, why would BS come up with their own version? Second of all, since they are the engine mfgrs, seems they would know at least as good as anybody which mix of what makes for the best engine performance over time. Based on that I added it to my collection of "snake oils". So, my current fuel supply is premium fuel with some BS and some Sea Foam, and some StaBil Storage. Oh and per the comment one of the posters on the side mentioned, I installed shut off valves on all my engines that sit over the winter to drain the carbs when the season ends. We'll see how it goes.

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On hard starting, check the compression. Some of these little 2 strokers only have 1 piston ring and alum. cylinders, and others only 2 rings with alum cylinders. I reworked a couple last year with problems and checking the compression as a prelude to the repair I found I had about 90 psig on both engines. My Mercury 2 stroke OB service manual said that if I had less than 120 psig, expect problems. Well if my OB engine is of the same basic design as the little 2 strokers so what's good for the gander must also be good for the goose.

Check your compression!
 
(quoted from post at 19:57:03 11/11/17) I must be doing something wrong, then. I've used nothing but E10 for years in everything, and I've never had a single problem I could blame onto it. My chain saws and other small engines sometimes sit for 6 months or more and always start right up.

The only reference I can find to ethanol in the books for both of my Stihl chain saws is they caution you not to use gasoline with OVER 10% ethanol.

Same here. E10 in everything ever since about 1980.
 
I'm reading a lot of pro and con on the fuel used in the Stiehl saws. I bought a new one last year (a 170) and as usual didn't look at the operators manual. That thing would not start after I used it a few minutes. I was ready to take it back till I just happened to read the manual. You must start it as the manual says it will rev real high till you tap the throttle. It has a self adjusting carb on it and just won't start the old fashioned way. I blamed the gas and about every thing else, but the problem was all ME and I suspect most of the problem I'm reading about on here is the operator too (not pointing finger at anyone but me). Guys, if your saw was new in the last couple of years---READ THE MANUAL. Just my thoughts, Keith
 
I have over a dozen chainsaws. Some sit for a year without use. I use the cheapest reg. gas with "up to 10%" alcohol. NEVER had a problem. I have some saws that always start easy - even after sitting for a year. I have some others that always start hard. In weak moment once - I listened to some of the silly stories about the evils of cheap gas and tried some high priced pure high-test gas. Made absolutely NO difference. Good starters still started fine. Poor starters still started poorly.

I also have half-a-dozen gas generators and same goes with them. Some are miserable to start and some near always start on the 2nd or 3rd pull. Again, type of gas used made zero difference. Oddly, my newer Asian generators tend to be the hardest to start. My old USA stuff with 8-10 HP flathead Briggs & Stratton engines always fire right up. I just pulled one out that had not been run in three years (gas was E10 also three years old). Fired right up.
 
I had a bad experience with the "red" stabil a few years ago, it is NOT combatable with the ethanol used in gasoline. Creates little tiny balls like a gell which plugs things up.
 

I've seen the problems with ethanol and with Sta-bil. I believe it depends on the specific gas blends in your area as far as big problems go. I can say with 100% certainty that many older saws will absolutely have issues with my local ethanol fuels- gummy worm hoses, melted/hard as a rock fuel filters, fuel caps that need Channel Locks to remove them. That is FACT. In other parts of the nation you may well get away with using low grade exclusively.

Sta-Bil has been an utter disaster for me. Horrible stuff that resulted in jello in the tank. Never again!

For those saying they never have issues with ethanol in small engines, good for you! But those of us that have, we aren't making it up and we aren't so stupid that we can't figure out that changing fuels fixed the issue.
 
Jumping into the ethanol debate here, another factor is the quality of the gas when you bought it. Some stations sell gas fresh from the refinery, some buy it off the spot market where it's months old. It might already be contaminated with dirt or water when sold too. I avoid cut-rate gas stations.
 
Anytime anything about chainsaws is posted you'll get a wide variety of responses going in all kinds of directions. Conditions will also vary widely. When someone posts, "Well, I've never had a problem" doing this or that, it may not really apply to each and everyone else, there is no "control" on this, meaning all do the same thing with the same saw the same way, with the same fuel, in the same wood, each and every time. Does not mean anyone or anything is wrong.

I'll now make one of those posts LOL. I have had little time to do the things I like, the job takes up much of my time and energy. My saw, (a stihl MS 390)sat at least a year, might be a year and a half in reality. I've been getting back to working on gathering logs and working on firewood and needed the saw, over a month ago. I know with small engines that sit, you'll have to get fuel up to the carb with a few extra pulls. This saw after about 6 pulls, fired on full choke, and stayed running until I moved the lever. Often they stall, you move the lever, pull again and it starts and runs.

I use ethanol free premium in everything, vehicle too, local convenience store offered it after customers requested it or something along those lines, throughout their regional chain. I'll pinch pennies somewhere else and I don't really live any kind of extravagant lifestyle anyways. I use stihl 2 cycle oil and nothing else. I was using startron with ethanol gas, with good results, not sure why, but had no fuel related problems.

I used to use gasoline with ethanol, lowest cost at the pump whatever it was and nothing to treat it and rarely had any fuel related problems in anything that sat, just by running whatever it was periodically, not allowing things to sit. I do believe the fuel line that failed in the MS 390, some 5 or 6 years back was related to ethanol fuel. It was cracked, leaking, but the saw would still run. I replaced that fuel line myself, took an hour. I took this saw completely apart aside from the engine a few years later, and had been using that ethanol free gas. I replaced all the hoses again, and the fuel line was just fine, as were other rubber components. Not sure if it made a difference or not, but it seems that non ethanol fuel and stihl 2 cycle oil is a good combination from this perspective, I'm not a chemist or petro-engineer. I have been using moto-mix in my KM 130R Kombi, I don't use it a heck of a lot, and there is no trouble getting it to fire when it sits a year. I like that fuel as the exhaust fumes are not so noxious or irritating. The moto-mix is not a bad option for filling a saw that will sit awhile. 1 gallon can goes quite a ways anyways. I used to think who would pay for that, but having used it on a limited basis, it seemed worth it. I mix my own for the saw as I use that more.
 
(quoted from post at 06:56:28 11/12/17) Jumping into the ethanol debate here, another factor is the quality of the gas when you bought it. Some stations sell gas fresh from the refinery, some buy it off the spot market where it's months old. It might already be contaminated with dirt or water when sold too. I avoid cut-rate gas stations.

Nearly totally untrue. While it is true that many larger stations turn their stock over faster than many smaller ones, we are rarely talking over a week's difference. There is no such thing as tanks off behind a shopping plaza somewhere where a store owner comes in once a month with a bunch of 5 gal. buckets to refill the tank for his pump. Those smaller stores get their fuel delivered by the same trucks that deliver to the big high volume stations, and it usually comes from the same tanks at the same tank farm. Just ask any hauler. Spot market refers to the means of purchasing, by small quantities as opposed to long term contract. Not a place where you go to pick it up.
 

Gasoline and Ethanol are two different liquids when it comes to compounding a material for a fuel line. The problem is finding one compound that will stand up in a fuel line that may see gasoline/ethanol or gasoline. Some companies get it right and some don't. I believe that is why fuel line may deteriorate even though you have never used E-10 fuel.

Tell your dealer to install a fuel line made for today's fuels and stop the sermon on ethanol.
 

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