Livestock waterer question

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

I've got one of those 4 hole energy free waterers. Has four large balls that float up in the holes to hold the heat from the water and from a 16 inch Styrofoam tube that sits vertically in the ground around the pipe.
A pipe started leaking underground,so I had to tear it all up and replace all the underground pipe. I'm getting ready to reinstall it and pour a new slab of concrete for it.

Here's the question. I have a 2 hole that I bought at an auction several years ago and was going to install somewhere else,but never got around to it. The 4 hole is 35 gallon,the two hole,I think is about 20. I'm thinking about using the 2 hole instead of the 4. Which one is likely to freeze quicker in real cold weather?

They recommend a minimum of 30 cows on the 4 hole. There's generally 35-40 on it in the winter. I don't know what the recommendation is on the 2 hole. Like I said,the 4 has never been a problem.

On one hand,the 4 holds more water so you'd think it would take longer to cool,but the smaller one would have a quicker exchange or water. I don't think they drink much overnight when it's real cold,so that's the only place I see a problem. I want to build a 3 sided shed over it this time to protect it from the weather,so they won't be able to reach the back holes on the 4 hole anyway. That's the only reason I'm thinking about going to the 2 hole.

Erik Ks farmer · Sep 26, 2017

I've got a four and a two, neither one has ever been a problem. The two I believe handles 75 head max and the four 150.

Tech 7 · Sep 26, 2017

I was talked out of an energy free waterer for sheep as they said the lower volume going through it would cause more freeze issues, that is to say the more going through keeps it from freezing. Hard to imagine freezing water when its close to 90F here today. But its a good time to get it addressed. Something else for the list.

Bobl1958 · Sep 26, 2017

I would go with the 2 holer. I've never had problems with any of mine freezing, and they in the wide open in KS. However, I did wire a light bulb up on the inside of the waterers. It comes on when I plug the heater in when it starts getting cold. You might think about that, if you have any concerns. The light bulb just stays on. There is a small hole that I can see the light on, when it is dark anyway.
I would think the more water to keep warm would be harder to maintain. No doubt you know livestock will drink more if the water is not borderline ice.

JMS/.MN · Sep 26, 2017

I wired a light bulb into my waterers as well. I replaced the bulb each Fall, and they would be burned out by Spring. Better stock up on some incandescents, since the LED bulbs don"t give off heat!

M Nut · Sep 26, 2017

We use a 2 hole for 50 stock cows. We also have a sinking stock tank heater with a safety cage that sits inside the unit. If below zero, we plug that in and never have freezing issues. Without the heater plugged in, 50% chance it will have frozen the pipe where the water goes through the valve. Easy enough to unthaw with boiling water, but still a hassle none the less. Have never had a pipe leak or break in the 25 years it has been in use.

Bobl1958 · Sep 26, 2017

What I switched to is the rough service bulbs like we used to use in the old trouble lights. I can get 2 or 3 years out of them. Bob

newhollandnut · Sep 26, 2017

This is going to sound rough but do none of thee above. Junk those waters and go buy "the jug". I've been through every waterer under the sun. Have 5 Ritchie's right now and one jug. I am already planning to take out the Ritchie's as money permits. The just is energy free but on all of ours we run 4" and 1" conduit to the edge of the concrete one for water one for power and wire in an outlet and plug a light in. That was you never have to touch the concrete. Just google the jug waterer and you can get to there website. Of all the things I've done or purchased in the last 5 years the jug is the best

newhollandnut · Sep 26, 2017

The Ritchie and the jug. Only thing I do to the jug is occasionally adjust the float which is done externally with a straight screwdriver. The cows are always drinking fresh water. It is truly a modern marvel

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

Not gonna happen. No electricity over there.

Bobl1958 · Sep 26, 2017

Sorry, I didn't pick up on the energy free. No experience there. Good luck - Bob

newhollandnut · Sep 26, 2017

You don't need electricity. There is a short video on the website that explains how it all works. If I knew how to post a link I would

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

Like I said,I've got no problem with these Sentrys. My only concern was with 20 gallons of water cooling faster than 35 when it's -15 degrees.

MARK ROBKE · Sep 26, 2017

Randy,one of mine started leaking in the ground,and it was the hose clamp at the bottom where it attached to the water line.The screw part of the clamp rusted out and the clamp lost its tension around the hose.This hose connects the water line to the fountain.I searched all over,but all stainless hose clamps have regular steel screw.Does yours use a hose? Mark

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

It was all galvanized. We've got a problem with our water eating up galvanized pipe. Seven years ago,we ran a new plastic line under the road and up to the fence. It was early December so we didn't go any farther. It wasn't leaking under the waterer at the time anyway. The galvanized just T-d at a frost proof hydrant,then there was another foot or so to an elbow,then galvanized up to the float. Nothing there now but a big hole in the ground and a curved piece of black plastic pipe with a faucet on the end and a hose hooked to it to a float in a stock tank.
I got all the new parts plumbed up today. I just have to hook the black plastic to it in the morning,put the Styrofoam tube over the pipe and backfill everything with clean sand. Then it's just setting concrete forms and pouring it. I can change my mind all the way up to when I pour the slab and put the bolts in the concrete to hold one or the other down. They'll just have to be closer together to use the 2 hole.

Bruce from Can. · Sep 26, 2017

I have a two hole water bowl like you . and had no cattle on it last winter , and it never froze. It is in a open front , south facing shelter.

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

The only time that 4 hole ever froze was during the polar vortex. There was about 3-4 mornings that I had to open it up and pour water on the valve. I had thought that was what the problem was this summer. The valve would stick a little now and then and I thought it was from being frozen a few times. I put a new valve in it and it only seemed to make it worse. It was a good thing I dug it up because so much water had come up that tube that it had filled it entirely full of sand.
I had a wall on two sides of this one. One to the south and one to the west. The south wall was to protect the hydrant and the west one as a wind break. Because of the configuration of the corral,it'll be open to the east. I think it was the north wind along with 15-18 below zero temps that let it freeze the few times that it did. If I can just keep the bulk of the wind off,I'm sure I'll be alright with the 2 hole.

As far as I can tell,the two inch thick,16 inch diameter tube is the secret to success with those. I know a few guys who put them in just using a large plastic drain tube. They all complained of them freezing in extreme cold. One guy told me he dug his back up and switched to the Styrofoam and never had a problem with it again.

K Effective · Sep 26, 2017

Mine is a Behlen, two sided with electric heater backup. I put mine where the old open stock tank was, right against the east wall of the barn- sheltered from the west wind, close enough to the south end to get sunlight most of the day. I remember that part of the freeze protection is a drain tile buried six or eight feet deep under the unit pointing up to bring warm air from down below the frost line, not sure if that really works or not, as my tube was full of water when I set the fountain on top. It will start collecting ice around the edges if the bowl heating mat loses power, but has never frozen the valve, and the most I have had was 22 cows on it at one time.

Sure beats the open tank filled by the windmill and deiced by me that I grew up with. Just a reminder, the electric fence will bite through a nylon snowmobile suit when pulled tight across one's backside even if standing on snowy ground.

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

This tube just lets warm air up from below the frost line. No water in it unless there's a leak. I've had one ball get rolled under the lid overnight in the winter and it didn't freeze the valve. That's on a "normal" winter night.

retired farmer · Sep 26, 2017

Get a small submersible heater that is safe for plastic tanks and put it in the bottom of tank and plug it in. Protect the cord so they can't chew on it. We did that with one and so far it has worked good.

tractorguy1951 · Sep 26, 2017

Worked at a 50000 head feedlot that had 3 to 5 hundred head in a pen.All pens had a six hole mirafount water. In the winter we would leave the southeast hole open . Had very little problems with them freezing in north central Nebraska.I would go with the two hole.

LarryH · Sep 26, 2017

we have installed various models and do better with the door type than any other ---spi mainly--cattle drink faster =-parts are easier to get and more reasonable the ball type are terrible and we sell both

JMS/.MN · Sep 26, 2017

I used double clamps on all the underground connections for the waterers.

rrlund · Sep 26, 2017

No electricity over there.

showcrop · Sep 27, 2017

From the advertising when those first came out it was my understanding that it wasn't the volume of water in it but the frequency that the balls were pushed to keep them from freezing up.

Livestock waterer question

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