Cruelty to animals

john in la · Mar 18, 2017

I am having a hard time trying to decide where I come down on this and would like your input.

A local man (not known by me; heard it on the news) was arrested for 5 counts of cruelty to animals for shooting a litter of puppies with a 22.

While not wanting to join PETA I consider myself a animal person.
I hate to see a dog/horse locked in a 10x10 cage/stall
I hate zoo's
I do not want to see dogs running loose on the street but they should have a big yard to run and jump around.
Most city lots would not provide such a yard.

But on the other hand I believe a dog is just a dog. He is not my child.
While my wife does not agree; I believe if a vet bill gets over a few hundred dollars; put it to sleep; I will get another dog.
I believe in culling or lining dogs with problems.
I know of dogs shot for snapping at a owner or other unacceptable acts.
I know of old timers that used dogs for hunting (putting meat on the table not sport hunting) shooting half a litter of puppies so only the best dogs were raised to full size.

So I have a hard time calling cruelty to animals on this guy for shooting some dogs.
Would it have been any different had he took them to a vet and paid for them to be put to sleep?
Or have we become a society where shooting an animal with a gun is not humane?

Lazy WP · Mar 18, 2017

As long you pay BIG money, its ok. Look at "humans"as well. I absolutely love animals, but I would rather put them down then have them either run loose, or put them in a cage.

MarkB_MI · Mar 18, 2017

I would have to know the particular circumstances. If it was done in a humane fashion, then I have a hard time believing he could be convicted of cruelty in any court in the country, let alone in Louisiana.

I assume you're referring to <a href="http://ktla.com/2017/03/17/5-puppies-die-after-being-shot-in-the-head-on-side-of-louisiana-road-suspect-arrested-sheriffs-office/">this incident</a>. It seems he initially abandoned the animals on the side of the road, then changed his mind and decided to shoot them. Obviously if he had done everything in private nothing would have come of the incident. By abandoning the pups, he was already no doubt in violation of animal cruelty laws before he decided to shoot them.

tim s · Mar 18, 2017

Picking which animals that are considered "high level pets" and which animals that are a "Nuisance" or "unwanted liability" is very much like choosing which laws are upheld and which law breakers are prosecuted. A horse lover thinks that all horses should be treated like a person,,and a rat that gets into the horse feed should be killed in any way possible??? The Rat lover that has a pet rat killed by a horse tramping it thinks the horse should be put down??? A City person that loves animals and treats them like people would have an absolute fit if 10 hogs showed up and plowed their pretty lawn...We have became a culture of Sissy's...with a narrow minded view of the way we think every one should think and do..and I say this with no intention of hurting any one's Feelings..

Billy Shafer · Mar 18, 2017

My dad got into several fights with people that abused animals.He would allow a tap on the nose to train a dog. If he caught one of us kids hitting a dog we got the same hit. We had at one time twenty dogs around the place. Dad could control them all just by his voice.Except one female mutt dog. They fought each other all the time.Went every where together. She would guard the truck if he was in a store.Nice to people if dad was in the truck.If someone got out of line with dad. There would be a fight.

But he had one strict rule. If a dog killed live stock or attacked a person when they shouldn't. That dog was dead.

pinball · Mar 18, 2017

Article said he shot them and left them on the side of the road. I think they were right in charging him. All he had to do was dispose of them his self.

Donald Lehman · Mar 18, 2017

As crazy as the general public has become these days, SSS is the smartest policy. If he shot them and left them laying side of the road he was incredibly stupid. One of the reasons I gave up the dog control job years ago, was because some NY City peckerwood decided that dc officers had to dispose of dogs by using injections ($35 cost to the taxpayers) as opposed to shooting them ($.03).

connor9988 · Mar 18, 2017

This is something a little different, When I was in high school there were a couple of other students that would brag about the things they did to animals on the weekends. I don't remember many of them but one had to deal with crucifying a live cat to the side of the garage and doing many other nasty things to it before it died. Another one had to do with dragging around and beating a pig that couldn't walk properly until it was deceased. It could have been that they were just making it up and bragging in school because they thought for some reason it would make them cool. I hope that those things didn't really happen.

grandpa Love · Mar 18, 2017

In a society where kids go to bed hungry and abortion is legal it silly to waste money and time on most cases like this. There are times when animals are starving then step in and help. But if the vet bill to save em gets too high ,put em down. Too much money wasted on pets. Dog food at Petco 60 bucks a bag! Man was made in the image of God take care of people first

Steve@Advance · Mar 18, 2017

Sounds like a series of bad decisions were made.

He was probably admonished for dumping them, may have been told to shoot them would be more humane than letting them starve, so he returned to do the deed.

But why did he dump them in the first place instead of taking them to a shelter?

Why did the person that stopped and delivered food not take them to a shelter?

farmerwithmutt · Mar 18, 2017

I think you're on the right track it seems i read someplace that kids that are cruel to animals can later in life escalate to cruelty to humans. I know as a farmer things are done but where is the line between deliberate cruelty and say dehorning cattle.

gtractorfan · Mar 18, 2017

I know someone who owned 4 German Shepherds he let run loose. On more than one occasion they chased and killed deer, bringing home pieces of the deer. If those were mine I would have got rid of them. Which is more cruel, terminating the dogs that act like wolves or allowing them kill "for fun"? What's to keep them from attacking livestock? The height of cruelty to me is when a barn burns with livestock trapped inside.

JimS · Mar 18, 2017

How did anyone find out about this? No one really knows of any animal that I may put down.

The problem comes when people treat dogs like people and people like dogs. I used to work for people like this. I frequently see soft hearted animal people treating people as they would never treat an animal.

I have no problem with this assuming he wasn't gut shooting them. It is unclear why he did this. If he simply did not want puppies, the cure is to spay or neuter.

Funny thing is, if he tried to give them away, he would end up in trouble. I have a dog I am trying to give away and get all sorts of grief over this. Yes, there are people who take free dogs and do bad things but my sense is various agencies seek to monopolize and control everything the deem to be under their realm. Dangerous folks.

ohiojim · Mar 18, 2017

I think most places have laws against shooting your dog,...but ok to have vet give them the needle, just boils down to keeping your mouth shut

fixerupper · Mar 18, 2017

I sway on both sides. I don't believe in killing just for the sake of killing. Who are we to decide what healthy living being should live or die? However, putting these puppies to sleep painlessly to save them from neglect and starvation is humane treatment in the long run, but then again, who are we to decide their fate? I have known people to throw the puppies in a bucket of water and walk away until they are dead. This is cowardly and cruel in every way. But when you look at nature, cruelty is everywhere. A mother animal will carry off one of her offspring and desert it, leaving it to die because it's a little weaker than the rest of the litter. However, we humans are not wild animals, well, most of us aren't anyway. So in the end, I still can't come up with an answer one way or the other.

JimS · Mar 18, 2017

Animals are people too?
https://undark.org/article/animal-consciousness-personhood-apes/
People

kcm.MN · Mar 18, 2017

While I don't like shooting animals, sometimes it is necessary. This guy, however, made poor choices and should be punished. If he had to shoot the dogs, he should also have buried them. And they never should have left his property to begin with.

Also, "how" did he shoot the dogs -- so that they die quick and painless or did they lay there and suffer?

A .22 isn't a large caliber and, even though these were puppies, I've seen pups (and kittens) survive things that I never would have dreamed possible!

I'm "NOT" a PETA fan, but this guy needs to learn from his mistakes. ....Now it's just a matter of what is "appropriate". As was mentioned earlier, much money will be spent on this that could be much better used in other ways.

M-MAN · Mar 18, 2017

Just my opinion but I think the cruelty to animals laws have gotten out of hand by a wimpy society where common sense isn't so common. We have became a society where animals are protected more than people and that's just wrong. I do not believe in being cruel to any animal or person but my idea of cruel and modern society's are different. I consider cruelty to animals as intentionally causing them pain just for the fun of it. Somehow it's supposed to be more humane to use a vet and a needle instead of a bullet. Dead is dead so wheres the reasoning? Only difference is someone coulden't or woulden't pay a Professional to do the deed. They can and do charge you with animal cruelity if you fail to take your pet to the vet every year for their yearly shots or don't buy proper food for them. That's fine if you're a person but we can't have you doing the same for an animal. What sense does that make? When that fellow is facing more prison time for shooting those pups than he would be if it had been a person he shot it's just wrong. I can see citing him for being uncaring and stupid if he didn't bury them but that's about it. Course you could level the same charges against half the population on any given day.

ditchwitch · Mar 18, 2017

My 2 cents. I love my animals dogs cats horses. But when the time comes to have them put down. I would rather have a vet but that takes money .Some folks just don't have the spare money to do that. I want shame a man for doing whats has to be done to one of his pets. If it take a 22 so be it. If its just because the dog want hunt i say tuff dont kill it just because of that. It probably not the dogs fault anyways its the trainer. Or just because the dog had to many pups thats not a reason to kill one. Now if its just plain mean then something has to be done.

coshoo · Mar 18, 2017

Guy in my son's class in high school years ago got a prom date with one of the "cool" girls. On the way to town with her, he thought she'd be impressed if he swerved to run over a possum. She was "impressed" all right- she slugged him a couple of times, burst into hysteria, and demanded that he turn the car around and take her home, RIGHT NOW. He did, and she would never speak to him again. He may have altered his views of how to impress girls, too. Although it is said that you can't fix stupid.

farmerwithmutt · Mar 18, 2017

Maybe but the mutt was the closest i had to family she was there no matter what my human family was something to avoid. I spent a lot of money on her and was willing to do whatever i could to give her the best life i could give. You talk about God to me she was a gift something that was beside me every day she never lied cheated or stole from me. The only conditions to her love was a ride in the truck and her ears scratched. If god put us together for whatever reason i wasn't going to throw her away.

Dick2 · Mar 18, 2017

Good thing PETA wasn't around in my younger years when it was common thinking that if a dog was no good, you just shot it.

K Effective · Mar 18, 2017

We're struggling right now, as the head of the local Animal Control just retired, and the whiners in the papers all want a "more humane" replacement. Our Animal Control has one of the higher kill rates in the state, but we have several humane, adopt-first organizations to take those that get donated. We still need someone to control the other animals that get abandoned.

We have a group that takes feral cats and dogs in live traps, to a vet school and fixes them for $10 each. We trapped the most recent batch of dropped-off kittens and had them done. Some of the best cats we've had, great mousers, and a price I can live with.

Billy NY · Mar 18, 2017

.22 is plenty for a dog or a horse for that matter, though a .38 is recommended for an equine, a .22 placed properly is no less effective. I speak from experience unfortunately using both calibers for this purpose. An equine will drop where it stands with either caliber. A dog will die instantly with a .22 to the back of the head.

John B. · Mar 18, 2017

I think it gets down to the shooters attitude for the shooting. Attitude says a lot about a person.

Two Dogs · Mar 18, 2017

It's good they both found out about the other and saved a lot of future grief.TD

Cruelty to animals

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