Jumping through the hoops

Geo-TH,In

Well-known Member
What hoops have you had to jump through?
I wanted to build a pole barn, First hoop I had to get permission form area planning, then the board of health. I had to prove there was a permited septic on property. No plumbing was going in pole barn, but board of health wanted an approved septic on property. Good thing my sepitc that was permitted and inspected. Building permit, inspector had to approve blue prints, even had to see that poles were put in 4 ft holes.

Put on a rood addition. Same as pole barn, area planning, board of health, permit form building inspector, who had to be called out at different phases of construction. Then final inspection to see if place was fit to occupy. Even checked to see shelfs in walk-in were attached to wall.

I was going to buy a rental house that had a flat roof and old electrical service. My insurance company said I would have 60 days to put a gable roof and upgrade service. I passed on the house.

I know a man who bought a house and insurance company told him he has 60 days to remove the trees around the house.

My insurance company wants load centers with circuit breakers, no screw in fuses.

Another man wanted to buy a house. Bank told him he would get the money after the old mobile home on the property was removed. If your mobile home is older than a 1986, you can't get a permit to move it, you can't give it away. Only thing you can do is have it demolished, which you have to get a $50 permit to do.

Another man wanted to sell his 10 year old double wide manufactored house. No bank would loan him a dime. He was under water on the place. He found a person who bought place financing it through a high interest finance company.

My CPA told me I need to send out 1099's to contractor I paid over $600, by the middle of this month. Good thing I haven't hired anyone to do work for me this year.

It seems like I Jump through one hoop, then another hoop.

What are your pet hoops or hoops others have had to jump through?
geo
 
Seems that Indiana is coming down pretty hard on farmers. When I put up 2 pole buildings here in Virginia, one for equipment storage and other a stable, I went to zoning office. They told me that my farm exempted me from requirements for building permit.
 
That's one of the nice things where I live. County is pretty lax and my township even more so. For a pole building nothing is required. Not sure what all is needed for a house other than a septic permit.
Realtor told me once that our area is one of the better / cleaner ones even though they have a lot less rules.
 
George we all have too many hoops to jump through to do things in my opinion. All of this is a slow erosion of freedom. You have said you liked the results of the building zoning laws and such. You contend that it makes for a better looking neighborhood. The hoop you had to go through to build your pole barn are the results of these same zoning laws/rules.

I despise all of these type of rules. The reason being is that many of them make little to zero sense. An example of this would be the one you stated of needing an approved/inspected septic system to build a building that was NOT going to have anything hooked to said septic system.

An example of this on my farm is this. We put in a lagoon to catch the run off water out of the cattle yards. It only gets manure in it when we get BIG rains, the 4-5 inch type. IT holds 500,000 gallons. The drain out of the house septic system would have drained into this lagoon. This outlet is after the tank and leach field. Very little water and what water comes out is usually pretty clean. County raised cane about that draining into the lagoon. So we had to route a tile line around the lagoon so that the house septic runs into a grass water way that eventually runs into a small stream. This makes zero sense. The small amount of water out of the house septic would have be a drop in the total water volume in the lagoon. Also the run off out of the cattle yards is much dirtier than what comes out of the house septic system. To me it would have been better to catch this water in the lagoon and spread it back on the farm ground like the manure water.

Too many times the rules are made by people behind the scenes that have zero knowledge about what they are regulating. Plus many of them can never be found after they make the "rule" too. No one will own up to make the rule to start with. You will hear "that is how we do it" instead of a reason for the rule.

Like my Grand Father always said this stuff is all "creeping communism". The more urban the more communism.
 
Good lord sounds like Vigo county is the California of Indiana. When I built my house a few years back all I had to do was get a building permit ( $50 and prove I was out of city limits) and the septic had to be installed by a licensed installer. No stupid inspections by the county just had to install a light on a switch and some receptacles to get the REMC to inspect to get power one. Put in an in ground pool...nothing needed. some with outdoor stove.
 
Geo-Theo,you need a new ins co, mine has NEVER told me what to do and they come around once every two years.you dont 1099 a contractor, you have a recipt for what he has done, you need a new cpa. if I want a nother pole barn build it under ag use and no permit cost. your cost of living is to high where you are at, how do you make it on 3.50 corn??
 
I waited over 20 years to get my share of my Moms estate sold,,, her partner in the property really does not like me and thought he would out live me,,, sold in December 2016!! and got three times what I told him I would settle for Good things come to those who wait
cnt
 
Annoying hoops? Farm registration for off-road fuel tax exemption is only good for a year, date doesn't coincide with annual pesticide applicators license renewal or farm truck plate/trailer plates renewal so you need multiple trips to the darned office to wait in line 45 minutes each time.

Ag buildings not to bad here are we are in something called a local service district, i.e. next step down from a rural township model. Two unpaid elected officials covering millions of acres. Go to rural planning office, say I'm building a farm building. They say: whats the construction value we will add it to your tax bill, you must use engineered trusses, heres your permit have fun there is no inspection, please remember you are required to have an electrician wire it up.
 
Building my house in '79 and the two additions in early 80's and 90's required no permits. The new barn/shop in '05 did as the county got in cahoots with the power company and unless there was a green tag on the meter base, no meter.

Permit had a questionnaire. One question was septic. Answer no. Regardless, one day I see this guy roaming around the property and I challenge him. He was inspecting for the septic system for the house. I asked what has the house septic got to do with my new barn with ZERO plumbing (I added water only a couple months later). I asked him if he bothered to read my request for permit. He hadn't. I showed him where my house lateral lines were located and told him when he was through nosing around he could get back in his truck and get off my property. He left. I got my green tag and my meter.

The county has a legitimate gripe. Houston Black Clay doesn't percolate, especially in wet weather. Fields leak and that causes problems especially when you consider all the places where people live and how the systems are installed. Any new system has to be a water sprinkler system where your "effluent" is deposited on your yard every time the main storage tank gets full.......(my rendition of what a news media hype would look like) probably....gotta have that sensationalism...extra extra read all about it.

Actually the sprinklers, usually 2, are chemically treated, clear liquids from the system. Tank pumping of solids is still required, a cost you still have like older system field systems.

So here you have (some have) this half million castle or such and 100' from the thing is this twin spinner that "waters the lawn" when the system deems necessary. Add that to the fact that the system has to be serviced with chemicals by professional service agencies so you not only get that little nicety, you also get the huge cost of initial installation with all the added gadgetry plus the annual maintenance fees and chemicals you have to purcchase. I call that a necessary evil to buying/building a new house on this soil, which is deeded by a professional Civil Engr. who worked for our water system: "Unsuitable for dwellings and roadways." But the place is growing by leaps and bounds and that's just what it takes.
 
Just the 1099 regulations/forms alone are complicated enough and quite a burden. Here, many farmers had ignored the requirement to file a 1099 for rent paid. A few years back a campaign was put on to get every one up to speed. A friend/neighbor who rents several pieces of ground(and has had Farm Credit do his accounting/taxes!) got caught up in that, and was quite stressed about going around and gathering social security numbers!
 
Built my own house, electrical work, plumbing etc. No permits or inspections, no loans. All liscenes standing in the closet by the shotgun shells.
 
This will only get worse as groundwater and surface water problems are recognized. Minnesota has its "Buffer Law," initiated by Governor Dayton in 2015. This requires all public watercourses to have a 50 foot permanent vegetative (grass) buffer along side them. All judicial ditches must have at a minimum of a 16.5 foot buffer. Will these efforts improve surface water quality? Very minimally. With the population base of Minnesota being more predominantly "urban," this has been a legislative push. What I am concerned about is once the buffers are all in place in 2017 and 2018, there will be very little improvement in surface water quality. The uninformed public has been "brainwashed" into truly believing we will have fishable, swimmable, and drinkable water when the buffers are in place, which couldn't be further from being correct. I am also concerned about agricultural producers will be "thrown under the bus" because we will not have those fishable, swimmable, and drinkable waters once the buffers are in place.

With respect to some of the discussion on septic systems, mortgage companies and lending institutions are growing less and less interested in writing loans on properties without compliant septic systems. From their standpoint, a property that is defaulted on is less salable versus one that does have a compliant system. Not all mortgage companies follow that practice, but any mortgage that has public funding involved (First time homebuyer and FmHA loans, for example) the septic system and its compliance is part of the review process. If it is non-compliant, they will not write a mortgage. I am seeing the same thing with loans for cattle feeding facilities where the lending institution is through Farm Service Agency. My comments may not answer all the concerns raised, but maybe some of them.
 
VA years ago had many requirements, including permited septics. Previous owner got a VA loan or my place in country wouldn't have an approved septic. Glad they did.
 
(quoted from post at 07:35:48 01/10/17)
Begging forgiveness is cheaper and easier than asking permission, and you'll get a lot more done.

Not true everyplace. Here build something without a permit and they may well make you tear it down, then pay a fine then if you still want that building make you go through the permit process.

Rick
 
There are too many people educated beyond their abilities, and the only place they can find employment is at federal, state,county or municipal levels. Once there they do what ever they can to justify their existence, which is more and more bureaucracy (hoops to jump through). Practicality and common sense were "educated" out of them in college.
 
4520,
You think Vigo county is bad, go to lake county Leesburg, Fl. The building inspector, code enforcement, patrols more than the cops looking for any little violaton. My BIL got caught adding on to his boat dock. You think he committed a federal crime. It cost him a pant load and a lot of time jumping through all the hoops. He even had to hire an engineere to draw up plans, fines, permits, inspections.

He had a fire, that was another nightmare, septic too. Final straw was getting his pool screened in. 7 attempts to get it passed the inspector. He contracted all the work out too.

I saw on TV show where people buy a repos, remodel, then flip it. They find out if some part of the house was built and not permited, it has to be torn down.

I predict if you don't jump throught hoops, just wait, it's only a matter of when not if it will come back and bite you.
geo
 
Glade I built mine when I did. I went in told them what I was putting up and where. They checked the location I was putting it and handed me the permit and said go at it. Never saw a building inspector or questions asked about electric or anything else.
 
Its probably a few bad apples that spoiled it for the rest. My dad ran a drain line for the house down a nearby crack and we have karst rock in this area cheap and efficient but i pitied the guys down stream and changed it. In some areas around mega farms they have what is called brown water events you can even get straw out of your drinking water not a tasty thought. We recently had an Amish build a barn near a large sinkhole which was down hill from his barn they have what they call deep gutters about six foot deep the with of the barn alley way and the length of the barn with a support wall in the middle built out of cement block . i can't help but wonder what's going to happen when that starts to leak but because there taking short cuts eventually that will lead to more regulations.
 
I once went to do a startup on a generator. At a tower site in west Texas.Open the doors to the housing. Found out it was a soundproof housing. Ask the site tech leader why. He said it was a county requirement. I told him there is not even a bug within ten miles of this place. Didn't matter.
 
Rick, what you said is becoming a reality in more places. Get permits, jump
through hoops, or tear it down and pay a big fine.

I think Permits are another form of taxes to pay for government employees. Head
building inspector in my county was a county commisioner. When old building
inspector retired it was a done deal he got the job. Not sure he know a thing
about construction, but the people under him do.

Politics is everything and everything is politics.
geo
 
Beg for forgiveness all you want you'll get a fine that will cost you more than
jumping through the hoops. Not to menition you'll have to tear down what you
built.
 
I remembers a few years the press wanted to cut down on tax cheats. Too many were claiming to be subcontractor when in reality they were classified as employees. Those claiming to be subcontractors weren't paying their taxes. Employeers weren't paying into the Federal and State umemployment funds, and paying into SS, state, local and fed taxes.

So there was a clamp down on hiring anyone, paying them $600 or more.

I may not have all the facts right. I just know a few business that went out of business because the IRS stepped in, slapped them with a tax lein, told the employer claiming to have subcontractors, they owed all the back taxes the subs didn't pay.
geo
 
My annoyance is the zoning adjustment boards or BZA as they are known around here. They are GOD and bound by nothing other than their own whims and who they might owe a favor or not.
My Story, I had a shop in town for may years that was in a R-1 zoned area but grandfathered as it had existed prior to zoning, not only as a repair shop but the lot beside had been a small scale wrecking yard. It was on a street that all the high to do types traveled to get from the high rent district to the shopping center so they were constantly calling zoning to report me as violating code. Luckily the code enforcement guy knew his bounds and tried to get things done in a friendly manner. He said Butch why wont you clean up that lot? Your other properties are kept in A-1 shape?? I said because when I do that creates a new standard does it not? I clean it up and next thing I know I wont be able to parka trailer out there right?? He could not disagree thus the junk stayed. I finally tired of bantering with them all the time and drew up plans for a building that looked like all the other town barns in the immediate area and went to the BZA hoping for their blessing upon the project as I also said I would not store anything outside on the lot if they let me put up the building. I even had the blessing of the safety service director (the BXA peoples boss) and code enforcement but their answer ?? NOPE! you cannot modify the exterior appearance of a non-compliant but grandfathered usage! SO I told them all you would rather look at junk than a new building that meets your development standards??? Who are you protecting or serving? Not one of them would look me in the eye. We moved a couple years ago into a very rural township with minimal zoning and codes.
I agree with JDSeller's summery of these laws and those who run them. In the biggest of big pictures they serve VERY few except the people who depend on the government for a job, otherwise they would be standing in line to be the next burger flipper at McD yet they tell US what we can do on our own property, bound by few laws but their own opinions,,,it aint right.
 
G. Gordon Liddy wrote a book on this quite a while ago, "WHEN I WAS A YOUNG MAN THIS WAS A FREE COUNTRY. Yes there is a reason for all these rules and regulations, it's a real moneymaker for government.
 
In all cases it is about money and control as for the reason. It all starts with people that think they are smarter than the rest and now better what is best for everyone else.
 
"the price of freedom is eternal vigilance" We were on track to stop a lot of this nonsense back in the 1970's and early 80's but we let our guard down and those who are against freedom were waiting and acted. Let me walk you down memory lane Howard Jarvis and proposition 13, Massachusetts prop 2 1/2, Bob Tisch and the Tisch taxcut proposal, the Headlee amendment (a ruse that was placed on the ballot by the establishment to reduce the support for the aforementioned Tisch amendment). And more recent movements TABOR (TAxpayer's Bill Of Rights) and the TEA (Taxed Enough Already) and ACE (Americans for Constitutional Enforcement) political parties. These were all movements that attempted to limit government's size some were more successful than others, some were discredited by the media or even our political parties as radical factions that needed lip service and then silenced as they were to radical and would cost support and votes.

We gave away many of our freedoms when times were tight and government offered to "help", and in many cases they did, but now many of those state agencies chartered to help business are now doing their best to restrict business either as a political action to restrict competition to businesses that have political ties or to sacrifice business to the Gods on the alters of global warming or clean air and water.

I feel that the results of the recent presidential election are proof there's still time for us to reclaim our country if we get off our backsides and do so.

Challenge the status quo and keep the ballots filled with grassroots initiatives that will make the role of the bureaucrat very difficult. As many of the proposals listed above LIMIT you local government's and state government's levy ability. If nothing else you keep them busy fighting to keep the status quo and they might not have enough time to figure out new ways to get into your pocket, keep THEM jumping through the hoops. Add a twist that any increase in other fees will have to be offset in a reduction in levy. What do I mean? If their are additional fees imposed on say building permits for additional inspections that the amount of the fees will be removed from the county's ad valorem tax levy. An example upon implementation a county was collection $10,000 in fees for building inspections and new inspections were required and it would be estimated the cost of required inspections would increase by 20% or $12,000. This would require the county reduce their property tax levy by $2,000. If after a year the county's revenue was actually $15,000 the county would be required to reduce their levy an additional $3,000 (the amount they under budgeted). Work into your tax code that the cost of fees and compliance costs be subtracted from the value of land when accessing property tax. Meaning if you have a lot worth $10,000 dollars but it would require $5,000 worth of permitting and improvements before it can be built upon then the taxable basis would be reduced by $5,000. Make so our government will ONLY be able to grow when there's real growth in the economy and if the economy shrinks force government to do so.

Our current Federal government operates with out a specific budget. If you Google the annual federal budget you can't get a clear answer, that's really bad as it allows them to have no number they can be held accountable to good bad or indifferent. Pass constitutional amendments that prohibits elected officials and their staff from being paid anytime the government is operating without an annual budget or has spent more than budgeted and if congress and the senate close the session without a budget in place no sitting representative or senator would be eligible for re-election.

Hold your government to a percentage of the GDP, the events of 2008 would of been handled a lot differently had the government had to trim them selves in direct proportion to the reduction of GDP.
 
Anytime government is involved you will be required to jump through hoops, many nonsensical.

Dean
 
The government in Florida was forced to get involved after hurricanes forced insurance companies to leave the state following two major hurricanes. State formed Citizens insurance, and decided there was a need to enforce building codes. Too many structures were put up not to code, blew down, causing more damage as they crashed into neighbors property.

Many times it's the mistakes of the past determine codes of the future.
 
(quoted from post at 09:36:28 01/10/17) Seems that Indiana is coming down pretty hard on farmers. When I put up 2 pole buildings here in Virginia, one for equipment storage and other a stable, I went to zoning office. They told me that my farm exempted me from requirements for building permit.

In Michigan law, "agricultural buildings" are exempt from "building permit". However, my township said I needed a "zoning permit" which then leads to an "electrical permit". Also, no plumbing allowed. :roll: I guess they're afraid someone will live there. I told them the 6 stalls are for HORSES to live there and I need water/drains to care for them. :x I'm about ready to just build the barns (stable and equipment/hay storage) on my farm and say "sue me".
 
I sat through a zoning hearing once, it was in the aftermath of a massive road and water project that had the 4 lane main route through town closed or detoured for the better part of a year. One of the businessmen that was on the route wanted to pave his parking lot. It was so funny it was pathetic and was a prime example of governmental power gone wrong. There was a "discussion" that went on for 40 minutes where the restaurant owner was told repeatedly that they would approve his pavement if he planted some bushes in a specific area and moved his dumpster to another location. The problem, they wanted the dumpster moved to property that wasn't his and if he planted the bushes where they wanted him he wouldn't have enough room for handicap parking unless he encroached his neighbor's property. The problem was one of the zoning board members made up her mind what she wanted long before the meeting and wouldn't even allow a vote until she got what she wanted, but what she wanted would require the restaurant have a larger lot than they did. This is a case where the owner should of been able to walk away from the zoning/planning commission with their decision and used it to appeal his taxes under a diminished value as improvements or even changes required to meet ADA requirements would not be approved. The situation was finally resolved when one of the real estate brokers in town hired the one board member as an agent which forced her to resign due to possible conflict of interest.
 
Well I'm building a house on our place and everything went pretty smooth UNTIL I was almost done. About 3 years ago I noticed my real estate taxes jumped so I asked what that was about and the answer was that was for the new house. ME--it's not done and I don't have final inspection so it's not approved for living. COUNTY--common practice to start charging taxes. I went and looked in the place and your about 50%. ME--what law says you can start before final inspection? COUNTY--It's common practice.
I have decided not to get final inspection! If I get invited to visit with the court I don't think the County is going to like it.
 
75% of the rules and laws are counter productive, the inspectors and rule makes strive to perpetuate their exsistance. This snow balls to where God himself can not satisfy them.If we would have had even half of these silly rules back in the 40's our country would be a waste land now..with no one wanting to develop ideas or start new business. Soon the "Why Fight it" line of thought comes into play as we commit to defeat rather than make a stand for what we believe is right..
 
(quoted from post at 15:12:04 01/10/17).....The problem was one of the zoning board members made up her mind what she wanted long before the meeting and wouldn't even allow a vote until she got what she wanted, but what she wanted would require the restaurant have a larger lot than they did. .....

Had a similar thing when I went before our BZA to get my pole barn allowed before I built a house. The building inspector had said I needed a building permit. One old bitty on the board (the chairman, no less) had her mind made up that I wasn't going to build the barn. When my atty and I cited one section of the twp ordinance that basically said I could build it, she was stumped and finally said "well, we've been thinking about changing that." :roll: My atty explained (or tried to) that she had to follow the ordinance in effect and couldn't make up stuff. She basically ignored him, took a vote and said "Denied". It's all about "Control".
 
When I want to start a project, most of the 'hoops' I have to jump through are of my own making---I have to do a dozen other things first, in succession, before I can get to my actual project. But, having worked in local government, I know what you mean.

I have often wondered, what would happen if this country should find itself in an overnight, all-out war condition as we experienced in December 1941? By 1943 we had the ships, planes, tanks, ordnance and materiel in place and ready to aggressively go after the Germans and the Japanese in a two-front war. Dishes were broken and toes stepped on, but our leaders did what had to be done. Imagine doing those things in the current touchy-feely PC, overly-regulated environment. Two years after the fact, Congress would still be trying to decide how to award defense contracts under affirmative action restrictions, and how to provide gender/orientation-friendly accommodations for our troops in the barracks and on the battlefield.
 
Here is a story that fits perfectly here!

If Noah built the ark today!

The Lord spoke to Noah and said: "In six months I'm going to make it rain until the whole earth is covered with water and all the evil people are destroyed. But I want to save a few good people, and two of every kind of living thing on the planet. I am ordering you to build an Ark."

And in a flash of lightning he delivered the specifications for an Ark. "OK," said Noah, trembling in fear and fumbling with the blueprints.

"Six months, and it starts to rain," thundered the Lord. "You'd better have my Ark completed, or learn how to swim for a very long time."

And six months passed. The skies began to cloud up and rain began to fall.

The Lord saw that Noah was sitting in his front yard, weeping. And there was no Ark.

"Noah," shouted the Lord, "Were is my Ark?" A lightning bolt crashed into the ground next to Noah.

"Lord, please forgive me!" begged Noah. "I did my best. But there were big problems. First I had to get a building permit for the Ark construction project, and your plans didn't meet code. So I had to hire an engineer to redraw the plans. Then I got into a big fight over whether or not the Ark needed a fire sprinkler system. My neighbors objected, claiming I was violating zoning by building the Ark in my front yard, so I had to get a variance from the city planning commission.

Then I had a big problem getting enough wood for the Ark because there was a ban on cutting trees to save the Spotted Owl. I had to convince U.S. Fish and Wildlife that I needed the wood to save the owls. But they wouldn't let me catch any owls. So no owls. Then the carpenters formed a union and went out on strike. I had to negotiate a settlement with the National Labor Relations Board before anyone would pick up a saw or a hammer. Now we have 16 carpenters going on the boat, and still no owls.

Then I started gathering up animals, and got sued by an animal rights group. They objected to me taking only two of each kind. Just when I got the suit dismissed, EPA notified me that I couldn't complete the Ark without filing an environmental impact statement on your proposed flood. They didn't take kindly to the idea that they had no jurisdiction over the conduct of a Supreme Being. Then the Army Corps of Engineers wanted a map of the proposed new flood plain. I sent them a globe.

Right now I'm still trying to resolve a complaint from the Equal Employment opportunity Commission over how many minorities I'm supposed to hire, the IRS has seized all my assets claiming I'm trying to avoid paying taxes by leaving the country, and I just got a notice from the state about owing some kind of use tax. I really don't think I can finish your Ark for at least another five years," Noah wailed.

The sky began to clear. The sun began to shine. A rainbow arched across the sky. Noah looked up and smiled. "You mean you're not going to destroy the earth?" Noah asked, hopefully.

"No," said the Lord sadly. "Government already has!"
 
Take a look at the Japanese attack on the Philippines they were delayed by fog and the Philippines knew about pearl harbor but they were afraid to launch a strike against the Japanese because they weren't sure of the status of the Philippines. A missed chance.
 
Most permits come with an experation date. My last demolishion permit was for 21 days. If the job wasn't done on time, I would have ha to get another one. Don't complain too much, they might tell you to get another permit because you took so long to complete the remodel.
 
I would recommend that you do let them do a final inspection/walk thru. We have no bldg. inspection in our county. Only thing is complying with Clean Water Act. Septic tank and lateral fields. We have to buy a bldg. permit, but there is no inspector for bldg, Only for the septic is there inspection. Now there is a walk thru at the end, but that is only for assessment purposes. Assessments are supposed to be made on square footage, not the d?cor and interior design. I refused entry for a final walk thru, they had been here two previous times walked thru as it was being framed and after framing complete. They knew the square footage, number of bedrooms and baths. I truly believe my assessment was jacked up because of my refusal. Comparing to others in the area my assessment for taxes was substantially higher. Did I protest my assessment? No, to many stories from those who did. they'll knock a "little" off but not much. They want the tax money. Soo, do as you wish. They will never come in my home, I probably paid dearly for a few years because of my bullheadedness. gobble
 
JML755, if agricultural blgds are exempt, just build it. They tried that zoning crap on some one around here and he and his attorney showed them the statutes, and told them they had no zoning jurisdiction. gobble
 
Iowa has a new law that says if I build a pole barn with electric outlets, State inspector has to come to inspect my work before I can connect to the Grid. Why? If I screwed up which I won't, and burn my barn down how is that anyone's concern but mine? I understand that this includes Solar Panels also. When is Enough, Enough?
 
At least in Pennsylvania a permit is not needed for a building that meets the definition of "agricultural building".
 
Oh to live in an area which requires no building permits, inspections, etc. It would be hillbilly heaven!
 
Bureaucracies are designed to perform public business. But as soon as a bureaucracy is established, it develops an autonomous spiritual life and come to regard the public as its enemy. (Read this from a farm paper in Billings Montana)
 
Severed two 4 year terms on the county commission here in Tennessee. Big problem these folks move down here from up north and immediately find out they have moved in next door to a hog farmer. Here they come wanting to get zoning ordinances passed. Has been no zoning here in this county for years and so far the dollar works out. You don't like what I am building on my place you just buy it. We do have to get a septic permit before the electricity is turned on in a dwelling but no permits for farm buildings. I read some of you guys post and I sure am glad I live here. Low taxes and easy life.
 


Some of the things gov't does make no sense. When I was worked as a DOT cop I had the bad habit of asking "why?" in relation to new rules and whatnot. Sometimes I got a reasonable answer that I could pass on to the truckers who also asked "why?". Other times the answer was much harder to get to. Hours of service rules tended to be that way. I got a burr under my saddle on one change that really mystified a lot of people. I dug and dug and dug. I finally got a look at the minutes of the meeting where the rule was changed and it turned out it was changed because the trucking industry big wigs on the rules committee wanted it changed to what it was. Try explaining that to a trucker who works for the company that is run by the big wig!
 

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