Another Albert Einstein award?

Geo-TH,In

Well-known Member
Albert Einstein, Said that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

I drive past a house covered with tarps. The other day they were removing the metal roof one sheet at a time and installing a new roof. The rafters and perlins looked black like my friends pole barn where he keeps his horses, black from water damage. My friends pole barn has nothing under the metal. Frost in the winter forms on the metal. Sun comes out, better run, it rains and smell like horse pee.

They weren't putting anything under the new metal. I saw no gable vents, roof vents, eve vents. Wonder is this guy has mold in his insulation. Please vote, Should this guy get the Albert Einstein award for insanity?

Shouldn't all attics be properly vented regardless if they are shingles or metal? I don't see too many roof vents on metal roofs, why?

I'm a believer you can't have too many much ventilation. My roofs have roof vents 10-15 ft apart, eve vents, some gable vents, ridge vents and power vents, which cuts down on A/C load. Shingles will curl if you don't have proper ventilation. Will metal rust on the bottom side without proper ventilation? Won't this guy have condensation issues like my Friend's pole barn? I'm not worried about my boat rusting, it's aluminum.
geo.
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Yes you are correct that all roofs need ventilation. Steel roofs are vented at the ridge. They use a mesh that glues down to the steel and ends up under the ridge cap. It's hard to put roof vents in on steel cause it's not as easy to waterproof vents in the middle of a sheet on steel.

Did they happen to have gable vents? Otherwise if that roof does not have vents at the ridge then yes I agree you can award them.
 
I saw no vents of any kind on either roof. Really think ridge vents alone is enough to dry out a house? And if so, what is going to prevent condensation? My friend has his 3 doors open in his pole barn. It doesn't prevent frost on the inside of his roof.

In the winter I add gallons a day of moisture to my house. I was told that you never want to put plastic in ceilings of a house, because that moisture will go through the drywall in ceiling, go through the insulation and is vented in the attic.

My point is should this guy get the Einstein award for not putting something under the metal?
geo
 
This is steel put down over plywood roof sheeting. Yes there should be felt under the steel but it will not sweat cause of the sheeting acting as insulation. Vent is no different than your shingles with air coming in the soffit and out the ridge. I or you can't help it if they fail to read installation instructions. Menard's has a good guide for steel installation at their lumber desk.
 
George give us a break on your hatred of metal roofs!!!!! We get it that you hate metal roofs!!!! Drive around and you can find just as many or more shingle roofs that leak and are installed wrong.

On the roof in your pictures. Maybe there are gable vents??? Maybe there are ZERO vents??? The fact of the matter is that it is really none of your business unless you own the home in question. Maybe this is all the owners can afford??? I would take a non leaking roof that MAY sweat over one that is leaking.

As for the wood looking black. Many attics have black looking wood that has nothing to do with mold or lack of ventilation. The house I am living in right now has black looking roof rafters. It never has had metal roof on it. It had cedar shingles and then layer after layer of asphalt shingles on it. When we replaced the roof 15 years ago or so there were six layers of asphalt shingles laid over cedar shingles. That weight bowed all the rafters. The wood is black looking because of 150 years of dirt and dust. Maybe leaking chimneys too. I have also seen rafters black for house fires too.

If I lived around you I would be Thanking GOD that your not some type of building inspector as you would be a real PAIN to deal with on this subject !!!
 

All roof areas need thought on the required venting. I have seen frost on the wood sheeting under an asphalt roof, especially in buildings with animals breathing water into the air. Metal roofing is more likely to cause rain since it does not absorb the melting frost and release it during the day time warm up.

To me, eve vents are a must to prevent ice dams forming on the roof over hang and the resulting water damage.

Give him the award for no eve vents.
 
I have a house on the farm that's had the same metal roof for over 100 years,now show me your 100 year old shingle roof.Last metal roof we put on a rental house the cost of
getting rid of the shingles was more than the metal.Of course I have a contractor that knows how to put a roof on in the first place and have had no problems with the ones he
has put on for me.
 
Jd. I think you are not answering my question, you are attacking the messenger. Please answer the question, should there be something under the metal? GIVE ME A BREAK. I HAVE A THE SAME RIGHT TO POST HERE AS DO YOU. No one is requiring anyone to read my posts. Just annser my question PLEASE. Geo
 
Honest Abe roofing is advertising 100 year metal shingles, which cost 5 times more than regular. Again, how is a house any different than a pole barn? Shouldn't there be something under the metal? The guy obviously had a problem. Traps is a dead give away. What else could be wrong? Geo
 
My house in over a hundred years never had attic vents with no problem and never will. 30 some years ago built addition to Dads house and put in those vents, first year they filled the attic with snow that I had to try to dig out. Out came those vents and never a problem after. I would NOT install if I was building now.
 
Agree all roofs need proper ventilation.
Condensation can form on wood and metal.
With proper ventialtion wood won't turn
black. The black is mold.

Here is one example of my idea ov
ventilation. Not THE first of my decking
turning black.
Barn, eve, ridge and power. House, eve ,
gable, roof and, power
Geo
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So you are blaming the material for failing when it was installed incorrectly. The preponderance of the evidence is quite clear that metal roofs offer many advantages over asphalt shingles but you continue to tilt at that windmill like a middle school kid with a bathroom fixation.

Weird.
 
And knowing Einstein's definition of insanity you keep posting the same opinion over and over and over , and he guess what? You keep getting the same type of responses over and over and over.

So it begs the question of who is insane, you for repeatedly posting information to back up your opinion, or the people who keep responding to your posts?

In a barn with animals there is a lot of humidity that can and will cause condensation. Ideally a residential attic should not have any higher humidity than the surrounding air thereby reducing the amount of condensation. However when people vent bath fans, for example, into the attic it really adds to the humidity. Many older houses were not sealed up well enough to require roof vents but newer houses and the inferior lumber used in them need airflow.

It looks to me like they need more vents, but I don't know enough for sure.
 
Geo we have way to many people like you in this world if you would keep your mouth shut and mind your own businesses it would be a much better place
 
Not sure about the roof but to answer your question on the other board, some people are just mean and like to bully people.
And some people get bullied because they just can't leave a topic alone.
They go around making snide remarks about their favorite tools or how they hate metal roofs and how everyone who disagrees with them is a bully. Till you want to just slap them.
Of course if you do you're a bully and the dolt who can't leave well enough alone is the victim.
 
No, metal is put over nothing, just rafters and purlins. Open under roof. You can see black water stains on purlins. Would someone say this guy is making the same insulation again.
 
Hard to see from here but the bottom photo looks like a continuous peak vent to me. I could be wrong, but if it is, that's the way to go. Vents in the soffits for cool in, continuous peak vent for heat out. Chimney effect.

That being said though, the guy laying in the weeds taking pictures of my house, wife, and children is in big, big, big trouble if I see and catch him.

Mark
 
After reading all your replies on metal roofs, I finally decided to check into what I have just completed. First I called my insurance company. I told them I replaced my shingles with a metal roof. They said that was a substantial upgrade. When I explained that Geo-Th,In said this was wrong, they said they would change their policy and recommend I contact a contractor. So I did. After first inspection, he said it was a great looking job and would be good for 50+ years. When I explained that Geo-TH,In said metal was no good, he said, "in that case, all the roofs better be replaced". On Monday, they are sending a crew out to start replacing everything. Thanks for all the valuable advise!
 
You figure the square foot area of those cans compared to a 4" contiguous ridge vent and tell me what you come up with (if you can do math). You couldn't give me can vents no mater what material you put on the roof!
 
I'm with JD, You didn't ask a question!!! you just keep reiterating your opinion over and over. There are people on this forum that have far more up to date knowledge than you.
Loren, the Acg.
 
no ... he does not need to put anything under the tin. reason being there better be a vapour barrier in his ceiling to prevent any moist air getting into the attic from the house. Black rafters and purlins is not mold. the difference between a pole shed and a attic is a pole shed has ground moisture coming up and condensing on the tin. if it houses cattle all the moist air they breath and discharge also ads to moisture. if it is a machine shed in winter the hot air from sun shining on tin to cold air coming up from frozen ground makes a high tempt difference and may cause sweating on under side.in a house it only needs a little bit of vent and the outside temp to underside temp is not enough degrees difference to cause condensation. the other thing is where is the moisture going to come from to create condensation if it is dry in the attic.my house has tin and a only partial ridge venting and a few soffits. No moisture problems what so ever. it will probably out last me. NOW THE REASON FOR TARPS. could it be that he had hail ,maybe the original tin was nailed not screwed, or screwed on the rib instead off tight on the flat, maybe not enough screws. you never know. asphalt shingles with only half the nails won't last long either
 
Geo, can see why this house needs a tin roof,5 different eve corners and built 3 different styles, back to back windows that close in a corner, vertical and horizional siding some kind of room addition scabbed on and no back door what a mess must have started out as a moble home with room additions add on......black wood does not always mean mold
 
I think that's George's house.

It's been entertaining, but time to let up on George or he won't post any more iris pictures.
 

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