OT - Alternative/Emergency Fuel Sources

FarmallCT

Member
Hi guys,

I remember awhile back someone posted about how they converted their tractor (believe it was a Case) to run off of wood gas which, from my understanding, is created by building a wood gas generator and smoldering wood to release the gas that usually burns and causes a flame. This gas is then used to cause ignition in the engine.

My question is, that if there ever was some sort of emergency situation where there was a shortage of gas and oil, what would you use for the engine oil? Are there any alternatives such as plant based oils that can be used in the engine and transmission?

I have been thinking about this for awhile and although you can run a engine off wood gas, if it is long term shortage or complete outage of oil, then at some point the engine oil and possibly transmission oil would need to be changed and replaced with something non oil based. Let me know what you guys think would work or if you know of any alternatives for engine oil.

Thanks,

~FarmallCT
 
(quoted from post at 00:47:43 02/03/16) Hi guys,

I remember awhile back someone posted about how they converted their tractor (believe it was a Case) to run off of wood gas which, from my understanding, is created by building a wood gas generator and smoldering wood to release the gas that usually burns and causes a flame. This gas is then used to cause ignition in the engine.

My question is, that if there ever was some sort of emergency situation where there was a shortage of gas and oil, what would you use for the engine oil? Are there any alternatives such as plant based oils that can be used in the engine and transmission?

I have been thinking about this for awhile and although you can run a engine off wood gas, if it is long term shortage or complete outage of oil, then at some point the engine oil and possibly transmission oil would need to be changed and replaced with something non oil based. Let me know what you guys think would work or if you know of any alternatives for engine oil.

Thanks,

~FarmallCT
really, really envy you my friend! A man without a problem in the world!!!
 
This has been covered. Our poster from Germany told us about the tractors built during WW II and used beech or birch wood. Had a little cooker unit on the side of the tractor. Cruise back about to November on this site. In Japan the public buses had a unit on the back of them. Looked to be about the size of a 500 gallon giant trash can. Burned charcoal.
 
Yes, a old non-computerized car could be made to run on wood smoke. They did that some during WWII however the vehicle didn't run very good but would get you there eventually. My dad was career military. He knew a formula where gasoline could be mixed with motor oil and used in diesel trucks. He also said the truck wouldn't run very good but wouldn't damage it.

They don't want you to have an alternative fuel anyway. They want you totally dependent on oil based fuels. Twice in the twentieth century someone came up with a motor that would run on just plain water. The first time was around the 1930's and the inventor, the car and the plans mysteriously disappeared. The second time was in the 1990's it was told on the news the inventor of the engine was trying to make a deal with auto manufacturers and that was the last I heard of it. My guess is the oil companies bought him out.
 
Your best bet would be to stockpile as much high grade synthetic as you could then drain and filter with a good centrifugal system. Even then you'll eventually deplete the additive package. 100 years ago it made a big difference what kind of crude you started with, hence all the old ads mentioning "Pennsylvania Crude".

You might could use Castor oil too. Not sure how well it would work by itself in a modern engine. I believe some of the high end 2 cycle oil either contains or is made largely from Castor oil. I haven't really looked into it but I know they used it in early aircraft engines.

If you're looking at a large scale collapse of societal underpinnings then lack of replacement parts and raw materials are going to bring pretty much all machinery operations to a crawl. If you're prepping then the best plan is to start now with learning how to train and use an Ox team. You'll be ahead of the game.
 
I've seen pictures of german tanks in training running on wood gas kinda neat they take it off and switch to diesel for combat
 
I don't know the details about the one in the 1990's but the guy in the 1930's drove the car for many miles with a skeptics following him and all he used for fuel was water.
 
That's part of why I want to find some sort of emergency replacement for oil, so if the worst case scenario comes around I'm not suck with a bunch of tractors and trucks that I have fuel to run them off of (wood gas) but can't run them due to the risk of damaging the engine from not changing the oil. Everyone is thinking of how to run the engines on alternative fuels, but I haven't seen anyone saying how to keep them lubricated using alternative fuels.

Do you mean the engine that converts water to Hydrogen and then burns the hydrogen? I saw New Holland was testing a tractor like that a few years ago.
 
Was mainly just looking at building a wood gas generator for fun and it just occurred to me that since the wood gas generator was built for emergencies how if we can't get gas we might not be able to get oil. One of those things where ya just start wondering.
 
There is a reason that the plans as well as the vehicle are "lost" so to speak. Because they never existed. I would bet my entire net worth that it was gigantic hoax.
Consider: How do you "burn" water??
How many BTUs per gallon does water contain?
Water is a stable END PRODUCT of combustion. That means that it will not oxidize any further under normal conditions.

My bet is that there was another material hidden in the vehicle that was reacting with water to produce a burnable fuel. Calcium Carbide perhaps?? That would generate Acetylene gas that could be used as a fuel. BUT....NO WAY can you burn water to produce energy!!!!!
 
FarmallCT- If you are talking that far into using 'wood gas' and you need to locate lubricant for the engine....Well, just ride a horse.

Unless, you do like the Cubans and make your own parts and whatever you need. They have been doing that since the 1959 embargo.
 
I agree and believe too that this is just another urban legend that gets the conspiracy theory crowd excited. I would venture to guess that if anyone ever invented a real machine that violated numerous fundamental physical laws of the universe as we know them that "big oil" wouldn't stand a chance at keeping it a secret.
 


Wood gasifier on Fordson Model "N" at the Meddo Show in Holland close to the German border.
003-3.jpg
 
Just where is the proof water fuel ran a internal combustion engine theres got to be some pics somewhere and the reason no pics engine will never run on just water same as old stories about secret carb got 100 mi mpg some people will believe anything.
 
(quoted from post at 04:06:00 02/03/16) I don't know the details about the one in the 1990's but the guy in the 1930's drove the car for many miles with a skeptics following him and all he used for fuel was water.

Some people will believe anything, even the scam artists. Unless you are making hydrogen from it or turning it into steam, water won't run an engine. All the rest is conspiracy hokum.
 
You can create hydrogen gas by passing an electric current through it. That is a fact. I could see how it would be feasible for an engine to generate electric power which in turn produces hydrogen to combust in the motor. What makes it difficult is it usually takes more energy to generate another form of energy than you started with. If the guy invented a way to make it equal it would work.
 
The problem is that you would be ending up with exactly what you started with - water. Even if the process of going from water to hydrogen and oxygen then back to water again (in the process of combustion) was 100% efficient (it's not) then you would still have no energy available to remove from the system in the form of mechanical power.
 
If he did, he would be violating every law of physics ever made. You simply cannot generate more energy from any process than what was inputted.

Ben
 
That is the Imbert style gas generator. The one my Dad made is very similar; he even used it on an N series Fordson during the war. Nice picture!

Ben
 
(quoted from post at 21:13:06 02/02/16)

Twice in the twentieth century someone came up with a motor that would run on just plain water. The first time was around the 1930's and the inventor, the car and the plans mysteriously disappeared. The second time was in the 1990's it was told on the news the inventor of the engine was trying to make a deal with auto manufacturers and that was the last I heard of it. My guess is the oil companies bought him out.

Pure , complete and total untruth. Anybody who passed a high school chemistry class knows H2O is a product of combustion/oxidation. .
You can no more burn water than you can take the cold ashes from a campfire and burn those ashes back into firewood.
 
(quoted from post at 23:06:00 02/02/16) I don't know the details about the one in the 1990's but the guy in the 1930's drove the car for many miles with a skeptics following him and all he used for fuel was water.

False. What about the laws of thermodynamics ?
 
That looks pretty cool! I have the plans to build one from FEMA, though a family friend was looking around and found some more detailed blueprints of a slightly different one that is supposedly a newer design and more efficient so I might end up trying that one instead.
 
To a certain extent, I agree with you. But you know what they saw about laws. The EM Drive (Impulse Drive) violates the laws of physics but appears to work (still testing to see why). It needs energy (solar) as an input, but produces thrust with no fuel or combustion. If it pans out, it could revolutionize space travel.
 
(quoted from post at 10:44:50 02/03/16) To a certain extent, I agree with you. But you know what they saw about laws. The EM Drive (Impulse Drive) violates the laws of physics but appears to work (still testing to see why). It needs energy (solar) as an input, but produces thrust with no fuel or combustion. If it pans out, it could revolutionize space travel.

Actually it does NOT violate the laws of physics... If your in a almost pure vacuum and no gravity,, a lot of things will work differently than in our atmosphere here on earth. Things like "solar powered sails" work very well.
 
You might start with oils made from soybeans or rape seed or some other vegetable to create lubricating oil. Before crude oil was available they sill kept the machinery lubricated and I would guess they used animal fats from perhaps pigs or whales. Many of the older engine oils used wax as an additive and I would guess graphite could also be used as an additive .
 
(quoted from post at 06:28:53 02/03/16) Just where is the proof water fuel ran a internal combustion engine theres got to be some pics somewhere and the reason no pics engine will never run on just water same as old stories about secret carb got 100 mi mpg some people will believe anything.

As I recall the guy in the '30s actually got to show it to the Navy at one of their yards - It was repoted that the gas tank was nearly full of water and the guy had a gallon jug full of a clear liquid that he added to the tank - the driver started the car and drove it back and forth on the dock. The govt. tried to make a deal with the guy but he didn't like their terms and left. He died later after returning to his home country (one of the Slavic states as I recall?) and took the formula to his grave ........ but who knows? All I can say is : [b:4e7caf696c]NEVER[/b:4e7caf696c] say NEVER!
 
Space travel??? When it would take 4 years at the speed of light to reach the next nearest solar system, I think that space travel is out of the realm of our lifetimes and even the lifetimes of our great-great-great grandchildren.
 
(quoted from post at 23:41:41 02/02/16)

Do you mean the engine that converts water to Hydrogen and then burns the hydrogen? I saw New Holland was testing a tractor like that a few years ago.

Sorry to upset somebody but the NH story is complete and total BS.
What really bothers me is the number of people who were supposed to have attended and maybe even graduated from school. With no clue about the laws of thermodynamics .
The fact that so many people believe the 200mpg carburator and the water burning engine story shows just how STUPID society is.
 
I know that you can't run a engine on water, but why do you think the New Holland Hydrogen Powered tractor is fake? I have seen engines running on hydrogen before so it
is possible, and if you look on the website they do have a whole video of how the process works and how it is part of their energy independent farm method.
While I will agree that their energy independent method is not perfect yet and there are still some problems, I do not see the problem that prevents a tractor from
running on Hydrogen gas.

If you wish to see the video and point out where exactly a problem with the hydrogen tractor is I have attached the link.

Also there is a video around here somewhere of when they tested the prototype and had it driving around.
New Holland Hydrogen Tractor
 

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