Nebraska tests vs dyno

Nick m

Member
I bought a 77 John Deere 4430 last fall from the original owner with 5400hrs on it. When I bought it, I asked the old feller if the injection pump had ever been tinkered with. He said no, never needed any more power. Did some chisel plowing with it last fall and noticed it was quite a bit peppier than my 4320, so when I had the 4430 at a buddies place getting some minor things fixed, I had him put it on a dyno. Put out 160hp. Nebraska says it's rated at 125? Everything is original on this tractor. I could see hp changing a little from tractor to tractor, but this seems a little extreme. Just looking for some thoughts on why it'd be like this. Are they always a little hotter than rated? He's dyno'ed some other tractors for me and all have been around the rated power. Looking to make a little discussion I guess.
 
Maybe it was a demo. My cousin swears right up and down they always turned those up. My uncle bought a new 4010 and 4020. He said the 4020 they bought didn't have near the power that the one they demoed did.
 
It seems that JD for years rated tractors lower then what most of them tested at for HP. We have a 4000 that had 118 hp new and a 4640 that had 208 hp when new. Some of the extra could be on how they were tested Not all dyno s are the same . Air temp, Humidity, can change results also.
 
I never had the opportunity to dyno a new 30 or 40 series tractor. I have rebuilt more than a couple over the years and the ones that made "advertised" horsepower had an issue of some type.
Brother in law bought a 4440 new in the spring and it went back to the dealer in the fall of the same year for warranty work.....made 170 hp. Injection pump had the seals on it still on that day.
 
Seems like you here about the John Deere always dyno higher than what the factory rates em lots of guys say the 6030 would dyno over 200 out of the factory
 
I've read comments about JD publishing a HP number and it is below what would be dyno'd or found in a Nebraska test. IMHO - good for them for being conservative. OTOH - that extra power perhaps explains some of the excessive fuel use - as compared to other similar "advertised" hp tractors.

Just a thought.

Bill
 
Most dynos have not been calibrated since who knows when but that is rather extreme.

Dean
 

I check out horse power ratings on the tractor data page just for something to do. I noticed that Minneapolis-Moline ratings are always listed lower than the Nebraska test listing. Case are listed pretty close to test. Don't remember how other brands compare off hand.
 
Well first of all you can make a dyno show what ever horse power you want!!!! They are only accurate at the correct PTO speed. Second JD sold their tractors to have the advertised horse power from day one out of the box. So after they where broke in they usually had more horsepower.

Then you had the companies that advertised anticipated break in horse power. Meaning the day you bought it the tractor would be 10-15% LOWER than the advertised horse power. Massey Ferguson did this on some models.
 
We also had a 4640 for 20 years which we bought brand new. It was no where near 200 hp so I am doubting that.
 
My cousins back in the day bought a 6030 brand new. It was an acknowledged demo tractor and dynoed 235 hp. Later on they bought a 2nd one and it was almost sick compared to the first one but then again it was not a demo tractor. So yes there might be some truth to that.
 
I've play with a dyno before and like some of what has already been said, you can make them almost read what you want.
 
I'm confident in the guy doing the testing. He's not shooting for high numbers. As stated, has also tested other ones for me that came close to Nebraska numbers.
 
First thing I always look for is the sealing wire or caps for the high speed stop and the max fuel setting, if not there most likely been bumped up a bit. That's why Bosch started using breakoff hardware on governors instead of wires. If you're gonna play you're going to work at getting to the fuel screw now, not just clip a wire quick and be there fast..
 
I worked at a M M dealer back when I was a kid. Yes on a Demo tractor we did everything. We even had a G1000 vista we put a turbo on. Just acted like was a option. And it was!. Also we used 14 in. Bottoms on 16 in plow then cut 3 inches off cutting edge of plow shares. You can not tell it. Except plow pulls easier. Also when setting up semi-mounted plow. Want rear wheel canted enough to keep landslides from touching. We could make a 670 super plow with a 4020. With 20 HP less. MM plows are Oliver and pull easier than a JD.
 
I think a lot of dealers played games with pumps in those days. Their 130 horse had to be better than the other guys 130 horse... so give it a twist and MAKE SURE. Any Deere mechanic I ever talked to freely admitted that...
Particularly with the Manheim tractors... the damn things just won't lug so the only way they can be made to keep up is to turn them up... and tow a fuel truck behind them.

Rod
 
I bought a 4250 from the original owner who was retired and I renting his land. The tractor was all original and never been turned up. I was amazed with the power this thing had so I had a friend dyno it and it came in at 178!
 
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Not to mention what may or may not have been mucked with over these many years, what engine RPM did he dyno it at vs. the official test?

When was his dyno last officially calibrated?

What was the specific gravity of the fuel?

Were any corrections made for air temp and barometric pressure?

(NOT trying to be snarky, but those tests are made under VERY specific and controlled conditions, and I don't know how much variation would be expected under real-world uncontrolled conditions, and I'm gonna GUESS you don't either???)
 
In the early 1970's a neighbor commented that the local Case dealer loaned him a 970 Black Knight (demonstrator) while his 1070 was in the shop. He said the 970 BK had more power than his 1070, and that 1070 was no slouch.
 
(quoted from post at 18:48:17 02/02/16) I've play with a dyno before and like some of what has already been said, you can make them almost read what you want.

YEAH - Kinda like voting - As 'Uncle Joe' Stalin once said - 'It's not important who votes; what's important is who COUNTS the votes! 8)
 
(quoted from post at 15:49:46 02/02/16) I've read comments about JD publishing a HP number and it is below what would be dyno'd or found in a Nebraska test. IMHO - good for them for being conservative. OTOH - that extra power perhaps explains some of the excessive fuel use - as compared to other similar "advertised" hp tractors.

Just a thought.

Bill

Boy you hadn't better post anything like this again or the harbor cnh crowd will run you off this here board ????????
 
(quoted from post at 15:49:46 02/02/16) I've read comments about JD publishing a HP number and it is below what would be dyno'd or found in a Nebraska test. IMHO - good for them for being conservative. OTOH - that extra power perhaps explains some of the excessive fuel use - as compared to other similar "advertised" hp tractors.

Just a thought.

Bill

Boy you hadn't better post anything like this again or the harbor cnh freight crowd will run you off this here board
 

If only I had a dollar for every time someone told me "Well, I don't know, they told me that they never did anything to it"
 

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