What brands are most economical re: parts prices

I'm thinking about getting an old tractor to run a bush hog on my scruffy 5 acres of brush and gully. I need to go REALLY low budget, but I'm hoping to find something with a 3 point hitch so it can be as versatile as possible. I see that there are a lot of Fords and some Massey Fergusons in my price range, along with a few John Deeres and even some newer (1970s) Satohs. What I'm wondering is, are there any tractors where parts prices are really high, or really difficult to find? I can't really make a good purchase decision without knowing which tractor is relatively cheaper to maintain (parts-wise, my labor is always "free", heh.)

Thanks for any informed opinions. I'd like to get an old ford, but I'd really prefer something with a live PTO for the brush hog work, or am I wrong about that, too? It just seems it would work best if the hog was turning away, forward, back, clutch in, clutch out, as I churn through the underbrush and turn this place back into usable land/lawn.

Thanks!

Scott in Brighton NY

You will not find tractor parts priced lower and available from more sources than those for vintage Fords.

Dean

Well a good Ford 661 or 861( Live PTO) will do what you want and there are hundreds of places to buy parts other than Ford. So they are pretty economical to maintain.

How bout you tell us what you mean by really low budget?
The little N Fords catch a lot of flak here but they are inexpensive , parts for them - both new and used - are cheap and plentiful and they will still do a lot of work for you.
They have their drawbacks. The biggest one is their lack of live hydraulics and no they don't have live pto either but that's not such a big deal.
You should be able to pick one up that runs good and has decent tires for under $2K.
Whatever you do don't get caught up in the restoration craze on it as you'll soon have $4-5K in a tractor that's now worth $2500.
We're it me, I would save my pennies a little longer and buy a 600 or 800 Ford for around $3K. Parts are just as plentiful and they are WAY more tractor with features you will wish you had held out for.
When buying any tractor pay close attention to the tires as new rears can easily cost you upwards of half again as much as the tractor cost in the first place.

4x old Ford. As the others said go with a hundred or 01 series. There were so any built and still in use. That a lot of what you are most likely to need is available at your local auto supply.

The price of needed parts is of less consideration than the likelihood and frequency of needed repairs. I have some old Farmalls and seldom need a part that has to come from a dealer. The most frequent parts are sediment bowl gaskets and oil filters. I think a $15 (HIGH) governor spring was the most costly dealer supplied part I have needed in the last few years. I give my old iron excellent care and repairs are minimal.

May I put in a plug for the Farmall H? IHC made over 390,000 of them, every salvage yard has bodies of them, and lots of parts that they have taken off and stored on shelves. EVERY part is available on ebay or at dealers, or at secondary manuafacturers. The thing was designed by Raymond Loewy, a famous iduatrial designer of the 1930's. It's long tall and handsome, mine got spray-painted, by me, at very m,inimal cost, and wins awards in Christmas parades. You ride up high, you can see what yo're doing. You'renot sitting down on the ground. Drawbacks; You have to find and attach your own 3-point hitch. You have NO ROPS protection. You have no live PTO.

I will also vote for Fords. No standard 3-point hitch on Farmalls rulled them out for me when I was looking a few years ago. Even if you find one with a 3-point, they are not quite right.

I settled on a 3 cyl 2000. Does everything I ask, has an 8 speed, power steering and an excellent/strong 3-point, and is economical to fix and run. Reason I suggest the 3-cyl rather than the 4-cyl versions is that they generally cost about the same for good running tractors, and the features on the newer tractor are a bit better. Power steering, esp, so the wife can drive the tractor as well.

Stay away from the 3-cyl 4 speed economy version of the 2000. No power steering, live pto nor enough speeds on the tranny.

That is my 2 centavos...

John

Old Ford. I run a 641 and do work for hire such as bush hogging. Keep a few spare parts in the tool box and you can keep it going. Go through it initially with ignition parts, carb cleaning, and fluids. It will amaze you how much work it will do and the dependability.

Its a good thing those old Ford parts are cheap because they always are needing to be worked on,the Fiat diesels sold by Long,AC,Oliver and some others have very reasonable
parts available far less then say New Holland or Deere plus they are tough tractors that hold up well and have Live PTO.I can buy all the front end parts for my 4WD Oliver/Fiat 1450 built in the 1960's at a very reasonable price and most all other 4WD tractors built in that era the parts are NLA (No Longer Available).

Personally i like my 135 Massey Ferguson. Its a great tractor for brush cutting. Its a great size tractor for smaller jobs. Plenty of parts available. Its a stout tractor for its class size. And a real dependable tractor.

another vote for a hundred or 01 series Ford.
simple machines and parts are everywhere.

a nod also to the old letter series Farmalls especially with a 3-point, or Fast-Hitch converted to a 3-point.
Parts are plentiful and cheap like the Fords,
and at least in my area, the initial purchase price is far less than the Fords.

I'd vote for the small Fords, they are plentiful, pretty reliable and parts are widely available... and lots of help on this site if you do have an issue. I've had a 9N for 25 yrs. and 8N for ten yrs. Both still doing their job and I've put all of nothing in them except for normal maintenance. But, if I was you just starting out go with the newest model you can afford (that isn't all beat to death). Once I get my new little tractor paid off I'm going to look for a 2/3/4000 in a 3 cyl diesel to replace at least one of the Ns. Good luck and post back with what you find.

I would vote for a H Farmall but a 800 series Ford would fill your needs better.

You do not sound experienced with tractors so that should factor in. No mater what make stay with a utility style that is low and with wide front for safty. Then I think the live pto like the ford 860 or 861 has is better than the independent type later tractors have as you get in a jam then you only have to remember to jam down the clutch pedal and everything will stop, on the independent you have to also remember to as well as the clutch pedal you have to simutainsley grab the PTO lever. Go with a 800 series as a 600 does not have enough horse power to reasonably handle a 5' hog, I have stalled out my 52 horse 3 cylinder Ford 4000 and the 860 is rated at 44 horse while the 861 is 48 horse, the 6XX series max out at 35 horse.. Yes in good clean going you can get by with the smaller units but in brush you need power. You want only the 660-661 or 860-861 as they are the only ones with live power and the 640-641 and 840-841 do not have that extra gear that you would need and also do not have live power The 650-651 and 850-851 series have that gear but no live PTO. The Grey series 4 cylinder 4000 would also fall into same catagoriy but cost a lot more and on that I cannot give specificate model numbers to stay away from but still stay away from any 4 speed as it will not have live pto. The only other tractor built in that class would be the Massey Ferguson 65 or 165 in being a low down wide front with the 5? HP engine and enough gears and I think (not sure on this) but I believe also have that 2 stage clutch you want for your safty. Good experienced operator would be OK with the independent PTO but sounds like you are not in the experienced cattagorie. The Ferguson TO 35, F35, F40, MF 35, 135, 150 or MH 50 all good but are in that 3?HP range, not enough to cut brush. Also stay with gas engine as some of the deisels at that time had problems and if you are not a mechanic are harder to mantain. John Deere never made that 2 stage clutch, Oliver not that frame size in the 5?hp range, AC also not the 2 stage clutch, Some MM might fit bill but are scarce and repairs might be problem, Do not know of any IHC low built 5?HP with good 3 point hitch or 2 stage clutch. I had 2 of the 3 cylinder 4000 and a 5000 with the independant PTO and did not like it, would have prefered the 2 stage clutch but I grew up with out any live PTO or even any hydrolicks.

If you have gullies or rough terrain, you had best use care, the attached article will explain why. Consider a Roll Over Protection Structure, (ROPS) and a seat with a belt. The work you describe reminded me of what happened to this person, just over the hill from our place.

You more than likely can't go wrong with a Ford, and some others, lot of parts support and most things on them are relatively easy to work on. If you end up with something without live pto, be sure to install an over running coupler on the pto shaft, as the mower can and will push you forward if you have to stop quickly, unless you have one of these installed.

Ford, maybe MF if you can find a good one or JD. The little diesel Satoh's are ok tractors, but parts can be very hard to find now.

Your mentioning of Satoh got me thinking. I assumed by Ford, MF and JD you mean the small ag tractors….any of these should be ok. BUT if you mean the compact / acreage size tractors, (little Kubota sized tractors) beware of all these makes. Ford, MF and I’m pretty sure Deere all used rebadged imports for this size tractor, and they can all be difficult and expensive for parts.

(quoted from post at 21:01:32 07/28/15) I'm thinking about getting an old tractor to run a bush hog on my scruffy 5 acres of brush and gully. I need to go REALLY low budget, but I'm hoping to find something with a 3 point hitch so it can be as versatile as possible. I see that there are a lot of Fords and some Massey Fergusons in my price range, along with a few John Deeres and even some newer (1970s) Satohs. What I'm wondering is, are there any tractors where parts prices are really high, or really difficult to find? I can't really make a good purchase decision without knowing which tractor is relatively cheaper to maintain (parts-wise, my labor is always "free", heh.)

Thanks for any informed opinions. I'd like to get an old ford, but I'd really prefer something with a live PTO for the brush hog work, or am I wrong about that, too? It just seems it would work best if the hog was turning away, forward, back, clutch in, clutch out, as I churn through the underbrush and turn this place back into usable land/lawn.

Thanks!

Scott in Brighton NY

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I agree with live PTO being something to look for but I've been using a '52 Case VAC WF on a 5' bush hog for over 30 years and it works good with the live hyd. and 3-point but a live PTO would be a help, though. Used parts are available and cheap but I haven't NEEDED anything but tune up parts and tires. One thing about the VA series is that they have a grease zerk for nearly every moving part so they tend to last a long time IF you keep them greased.

another vote for older Ford. I researched a lot and ended up with a 1980'is Ford 3600. Great little tractor, have lots of places where parts are available in the aftermarket in addition to this forum. I also own a Ford 755 TLB that is a real strong machine 30+ years after it was built and I've bought parts at reasonable prices many times.

A good way to check the cost of replacement parts, is to look here on YT at the availibility and cost of parts for the brand and model of tractor you're considering.

The joke goes that old Ford parts are cheap and plentiful because the demand is so high they're still mass producing them. (ba-da-da-bump)

Of the dozen or so Fords I've used through the years, the only ones that had half decent brakes, was a pair of 6600's. The hundred series were bad enough trying to stop just themselves on the level, nearly impossible with a loaded wagon behind, or with a 'hog' pushing through a transmission PTO. The N series I've found are even worse. Had an uncle who was brush hogging with an 8n, backing up, and it took him over a bank. Broke his back. It's a miracle he survived, and even more so that he ever walked again, but that was the end of his farming career. NOTE: This can happen with ANY transmission PTO tractor, not just Fords.

I'd put in a vote for a Massey 35, 50 or 65, with a "live PTO" (two stage clutch, engine driven, not transmission driven) or if you can afford it, a 135 or 165 with the Perkins diesel engine. They're just about bomb proof, and if you're only using it during the summer, you don't need to worry about cold starting, or about gas going bad over winter. Most of the 1xx series had independent PTO (better than "live", and several orders of magnitude better than transmission PTO). Most parts are still readily available, especially aftermarket, at reasonable prices.

A Farmall H is not for an inexperienced operator, doesn't have live hydraulics or PTO, and often doesn't include fenders, even if it has a 3pt conversion. If you could find a Farmall 300 or 350 in usable condition at a good price, it would be a reasonable choice. A narrow front will turn on a dime. A wide front doesn't mash a third swath of grass before the hog gets to it. For your purposes, avoid the 340.

The Deere's? My experience is that while generally reliable, anything painted Deere Green comes at a very dear price, and parts seem to be going obsolete faster than with other makes of the same age.

I would avoid the imports: Same, Satoh, Nufield, Long, Deutz, Belarus, etc, unless you personally know how it was used where it came from, AND have friends in that brand's parts business.

My opinions only. Yours or others actual experiences may vary.

(quoted from post at 10:15:49 07/29/15) Personally i like my 135 Massey Ferguson. Its a great tractor for brush cutting. Its a great size tractor for smaller jobs. Plenty of parts available. Its a stout tractor for its class size. And a real dependable tractor.

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Hands down the best tractor ever built in it's class.

You've all given me a LOT to think about, my budget is an unrealistic $1200-2000, but I hope to make it work. It does make sense to save up and pay more for a machine that will have cheap parts prices, and better yet, may never need many parts. Most of the inexpensive tractors around here (that also have 3 point hitches) are old 9N/2N/8N/NAA machines, which are not ideal for this type of work. I've watched some brush hogging videos on YouTube, and learned a lot. How slowly does low gear move in an 8N or NAA (without a special gearbox) when the RPMs are up for hogging? I can see that being able to crawl along with the hog churning away is the way to go, and I get the idea these old Fords don't go that slowly... They'd work to maintain the land, but not for the initial clearing - they just have to keep moving too much. It can be done, but as someone here mentioned, my inexperience makes that a potentially dangerous mix. There's a '72 Massey Ferguson 135 diesel that might be in my price range (amazingly), much more modern, better gearing, dual clutch, etc. If that's still available I'll have to check it out (but first I have to get approval from The Boss.)

We've lived in our old farmhouse on 5 acres for about 16 years, and at first I tried controlling the growth with a 1966 Cub Cadet 123 with a 44" deck (oversize deck for that machine.) It was a little workhorse, but very undersized for the task at hand. One wet year it got stuck way back in the field in the fall, and it's been out there ever since. A neighbor brought his "real" tractor to try to pull it out, but HE got stuck, and though he evenually got out, the 123 never moved again. After winter and wet spring and summer out there, attempts to start it failed, and one of the front tires burst when I tried to pump it up (plus, just getting out to it is a huge chore.)

I've never had anything bigger than a garden tractor (JD 425) so this is new (and fun) territory for me.

On a personal note, the farmhouse caught fire November 1st, and we'll soon be building another house on the property, farther back from the road, then we'll bulldoze the old house (but leave the old garage standing for a storage building - maybe for a tractor?)

Scott in Brighton NY (at a rented house, until the new house is built on our land in Penfield)

The brakes on my 971 will lock up very readily.

OK, so I bought a 1972 Massey Ferguson 135 diesel with 6xxx hours on it (can't remember exactly) has one fairly new back tire, one old tire with OK tread but rough sidewalls (and the fronts appear to be car tires,) runs well enough, I could see some oil seepage here and there, dirty and grimy, but still in daily usage as a sprayer in an orchard (Round-Up.) They're buying a new tractor because they want both the main tractor and the backup to be able to run the big flail mower (he kept calling it the "chipper") and they want it to have a cab, so they don't have to wear the chemical suits when they spray. It is banged up and weathered, but has a good seat, seems to be all there more or less (has only one bent empty headlight bucket for forward lighting, but the rear light is there.) The ad picture showed a goofy spotlight attached to the hood with a conduit strap, that's taken off now (strap still there) as is the sprayer plumbing. It has independent pto (was an option) rather than dual-clutch type. I guess that's good and bad, something to keep in mind for a beginner, have to be ready to disengage the PTO when something goes wrong (someone in the thread mentioned that a beginner can be better off with dual clutch - push the clutch in and everything stops.)

Anyway, I'm glad for all the helpful advice, I suspect this machine will serve me well, and I think I bought it for the right price ($2000 - in my area, most rough condition Ford 9N/2N/8N machines are around that.) No doubt I'll end up putting more into it - like a new tire eventually - or sooner. What's a 12.4-28 tire go for? But this won't be a restoration, if I want a project, I'll get an old Ford or Allis-Chalmers.

Thinking happy thoughts...

Scott in Brighton NY (pics below)

Scott, ya done good, and you'll not only appreciate the Massey far more than an N series Ford for it's dual range transmission, but you'll be safer with the IPTO. If it didn't come with manuals, do yourself a big favor and order a set. They have them here on YT, as well as other places on the web.

You may think there is a LOT of oil and grime, but from what I see, it isn't that bad at all. It's a really good idea to power wash it to get any chem residue off (reduce repeat exposure to you and family) and to provide a clean surface to see how badly what leaks where, that you can address any minor problems before they become big ones. Injector pump throttle and kill lever O-ring seals probably leak - it's a common problem and relatively simple and inexpensive fix. Search the MF forum for details, or ask there. It's also a good idea to at least crack the trans/rear end drain plugs to check for water, and to change the oil if there is water or the oil is milky. Change engine oil and fuel filters while you're at it.

Best of luck with your new tractor.

Thanks, I'll definitely take a look at those items as soon as I get the tractor here. Now I've got to figure out how I'm going to do that.

Scott in Brighton NY

great Scott.
I left the MF diesel 135 off my original list cuz they are usually far too expensive (though I consider them one of the best small tractors ever made)
That is a really, really, good price in NY for a useable one.
congrats

How far away is it? If rear end oil is good, you could drive it home. I remember the angry farmers who snarled traffic in DC a few decades ago by driving their tractors to the capital, some from well over hundreds of miles away.

If the oil is 'iffy', surely you know someone who knows someone who has a HD pickup and an equipment trailer that for a tank of fuel, a few bucks (and perhaps some favorite beverage) would be willing to haul it for you.

BTW, tractor rears are not cheap. You're probably looking at about $450 for a rear of that size, mounted, with new tube. Most rears seem to go a v_e_r_y l_o_n_g time even being weather checked. I wouldn't worry about it until either the tread is insufficient for your needs, or the tire fails in some major way.

For getting it home, I haven't asked him yet, but my boss (technology website company, 100% white collar) has a backhoe and I believe he has a trailer to transport it, so I'm hoping he'll help me fetch the tractor. But if I had to, at least 95% of the 15 mile drive would be on roads where tractors are not an uncommon sight.

There are several places on the sidewalls of the bad tire where the cracks show a lot of cord and it feels really soft there (soft enough to easily push a pencil through, if I had to guess.) So a thorn or sharp bit of brush could easily puncture the tube while hogging, something I'd like to avoid. I recognize the tire will be an expense, but could be put off for years with care and luck. Here's hoping I'm lucky. I'll need my money to buy a 6 foot brush hog. Turns out all the cheap one's I've been seeing are 5 foot, or even 4. No cheap 6 footers found yet...

It's been years since I attended a farm auction, and I'm wondering what the implement deals are like. I've looked at a few listings and will go to some soon, to see what prices are like. If I buy a 6 foot cutter, I'll need a way to get it home, too. I don't have any way to move something like that, and the auctions can be pretty far away.

Scott in Brighton NY

(quoted from post at 16:29:37 07/30/15) A good way to check the cost of replacement parts, is to look here on YT at the availibility and cost of parts for the brand and model of tractor you're considering.

The joke goes that old Ford parts are cheap and plentiful because the demand is so high they're still mass producing them. (ba-da-da-bump)

Of the dozen or so Fords I've used through the years, the only ones that had half decent brakes, was a pair of 6600's. The N series I've found are even worse.

My opinions only. Yours or others actual experiences may vary.

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My 8N has brakes that will put you over the hood if you press on them too hard. My 9N, on the other hand, has about zero brakes and always has. As you said, experience is different for everyone.