house demolition- what machine

Tiger Joe · Jun 30, 2015

looking for opinions here on how to tear down an old two story farm house.

1st option- right now the only machine we own I would even think could be use for demo is our backhoe. I would put a thumb on it and use it to slowly rip the house apart. Only issue here is our backhoe is old and probably pretty tired. and while it has done everything we asked of it, I think this could be pushing the limits of the machine.

2nd option being considered- buying a "large" mini excavator with a thumb and using that. I would imagine one of these is going to be a lot stronger that my hoe.

3rd option- have the local fire department burn the house down. seriously considering this option, however initially I am seeing a lot of hurdles- no shingles, asbestos, or lead can be there when burned. I'm guessing in a house from 1880 there is a lot of the 3. so I might have to rip down 2/3 of the house just for them to burn it.

4th option- pay someone to demo the house. right now least appealing to me. I don't like paying ppl to do work I can do.

Also, the neighborhood isn't the greatest, so I'm a bit leery to leave my backhoe there since its all open, too much for anyone to mess with and possibly steal something. I would make sure to buy an excavator with an enclosed cab so I can lock it up.

I welcome as many thoughts and opinions as I can get. I've never torn down a house before!

Billy NY · Jun 30, 2015

Excavator, rent or own, hands down. With a thumb. No flat tires to worry about, and they are quite strong, even the smaller ones. Don't undersize it for the job. Last modern one I ran was quite impressive for its size, Case EX 70 or whatever it was (see below photo). Asbestos, is something to contend with, its usually removed/abated prior to any demolition and asphalt shingles may have to be separated, but it may not be so bad if you can remove sections of roof decking in whole.

Bill(Wis) · Jun 30, 2015

Have someone with a Komatsu or Cat track hoe knock the house down. Dig a big hole. Push pieces in hole. Cover hole. You can probably do the hole and push in with your rig. If you aren't familiar with the property, better call 811 before you dig. Fire Depts around me don't burn them down anymore. They burned a nearby house down about 20 years ago and some neighbor kids got sick from the smoke. Kids get sick from almost anything nowadays with all the protectionism.

Bob Bancroft · Jun 30, 2015

Does the house have asphalt shingles? If not, why not have the fire dep't. check out the house and see if they will burn it?

IowaJohn · Jun 30, 2015

I hired an excavator to tear mine down, I was doing some other work around the farm so it was here. The local fire department didn't want to use it for practice. I couldn't burn it standing but once I made a pile of "rubble" it was fine to burn. Go figure. I didn't take any shingles to the landfill, just took the windows out and put them in the basement so there wouldn't be glass everywhere. I also took out any copper tubing and other slightly valuable stuff.

OH Boy · Jun 30, 2015

You absolutely must have any asbestos that is present remediated before you do anything, or you are asking for real trouble. I knew a trucking company that was contacted by their banker to come and haul debris off from an old house that the bank had foreclosed on and decided to just demolish. They unwittingly hauled the debris which contained asbestos down the highway and to the local dump. When the asbestos was discovered everybody involved was liable for the cost of cleaning up the whole mess and there were EPA fines levied too.

DMP62 · Jun 30, 2015

Does the house have a value on your property tax? You may be able to deduct that amount off of your income tax as a donation to the fire department if you use option #3. A friend of mine had a house that was valued at $20,000 on his property taxes and donated it to the local fire department for a practice burn, he was then able to use that amount as a deduction on his income tax return. Might want to check with your income tax guy.

dhermesc · Jun 30, 2015

Agreed did a hole and bury on your property to keep the money grubbing government out of it.

Ferd · Jun 30, 2015

Don't know about your state, but here you would need an environmental survey before any demolition - state law. If you have asbestos, you'd be wise to have it properly removed and disposed of by a reputable firm specializing in proper removal and disposal of asbestos. Landfills here will take lead paint but you need to check first. If you want to "save money" by not doing the above, you face stiff fines and possibly jail time if caught.

As for a machine, in the end you will probably wind up cheaper just having a demolition contractor doing the work. The other option is renting a machine instead of buying.

Tiger Joe · Jun 30, 2015

to address some of the issues already-

1- yes the house has asphalt shingles. Those would have to be removed prior to burning.

2- Asbestos- quite frankly I don't know, but im airing on the side of caution and guessing "probably". I need to do more research into this.

3- fire dept- we are going to look into it more. Many people have said this is an option but I'm not sure.

4- environmental survey- first I've heard of this, so I doubt PA has this requirement.

If I went the route and bought a mini excavator, I would try to find one in my price range, but it and use it for all the work needed and then sell it off. I'd imagine this would be cheaper than paying someone.

old · Jun 30, 2015

Me the only machine I use if me. I would not just push one down I would take it apart one board at a time and save all that I could. Too many people believe in just throwing things away that can be salvaged and used again. Most of the wood in this room came form another house I took down years ago. Walls in here are knotty pine and that stuff cost big $$ new

Ken Macfarlane · Jun 30, 2015

After renting a JD 120LC for a while this winter, that size excavator would have the house knocked down into the hole in under 2 hours. I paid
a low rate because a lot of hours but surely for under 1000$ you'd get it done.

Escavator great for tending a fire too, we burned several monster brush piles while it was here.

We can still get the fire department to burn here without much trouble.

Straw Boss · Jun 30, 2015

I don't live in a highly populated area
but around here houses are burnt down
all the time. Some guys will recover
the cast iron from the ashes afterwards
but that's about it. It'll cost you a
couple of straw bales and a match to
get it going and five gallons of diesel
in your backhoe to bury it and your
done with it.

Only you can decide what's right for
your situation. Will the fire spread
on your property to other buildings?
Can it spread to the neighbors? Does
your township or county have a burn
ban? Do you have any trees nearby that
you don't want to see dead within a
year afterwards? Is there a specific
direction the wind needs to be to burn
without smoking out the neighbors? If
your fire department won't burn it
unless asbestos and asphalt are removed
does that mean you can't burn it
yourself? Meaning is this just a fire
department policy, not necessarily a
law you have to abide by? Most people
here will call the local sheriffs
office to report a controlled burn so
people aren't freaking out when the
smoke starts. If there's a chance the
fire could get away they may also call
the V.Fire Dept. just to give them a
heads up and to be on call for a few
hours just in case. Just remember that
on the downwind side at full flame you
won't be able to get within 50 yards of
the house for the heat so do a walk
around before hand and just know your
not going to be able to put out grass,
tree or building fires within that
radius until the fire burns down.
Figure about a half hour minimum that
you won't be able to get close.

If you run into roadblocks on this, a
nighttime thunderstorm is a good time
to burn. Claim lightning strike and
tell everyone to get over it. On the
positive side, everything around will
be wet and keep the fire from spreading
and nobody can see the black smoke in
the dark.

David G · Jun 30, 2015

A track hoe with a claw is the #1 choice, you want a large enough reach so the house does not fall on you. Your methods depend a lot on the state and local ordinances, they will pretty much dictate what is acceptable. You need a demolition permit in my county, one will not be issued unless the asbestos and asphalt shingles are removed or remediation plan is in place.

Mike M · Jun 30, 2015

In town when they demo they spray water on them to keep the dust down.
How about wrapping a large cable around it and pulling it over ? This way it looks like it fell down. Then clean it up and burn small amounts time permitting.
Any old hewn beams ? if so you might be able to get money for those.

Glen SW Wi · Jun 30, 2015

Way way way back in my younger days when I worked for a wrecking company, we used to string a cable around or through the building at floor level and yank the studs out with a good sized cat. Then we would run around on the pile and then load up the scrap onto trucks to be hauled away. It was fun and we didn't have to bring in the crane to get the place down to working level.

Spudm · Jun 30, 2015

You just cannot go in and tear it down anymore without permits and an environmental remediation plan, or you could be facing fines and/or jail time, especially if you dig a hole and try to bury it. 811 is now the law, you must make that call.

kyleMI · Jun 30, 2015

DO NOT BURY IT your township can come and make you dig it back up and hull it to a land fill, don't ask me how I know. Your back hoe will work just fine
I use an old case back hoe just knock it down into pile put a bunch of brush on top of it, make a phone call to get a burn permit tell'em you got some brush to burn than burn it all. That is the fastest and cheapest way that I have found to do it

Bonnan · Jun 30, 2015

Tiger Joe.......first off all counties in Pa have different regs and enforcement. We burnt down a farm house a couple years ago in Pa after stripping out what was worthwhile. Offerred to fire dept but they were too busy or not up to it. Did it ourselves one rainy deer season day. Nobody asked any questions.

phil_n · Jun 30, 2015

Just possible a house from 1880 might have a lot of wood in it that may be valuable today. Burning it might be like burning money - ok if you have an awful lot of it

.

HossinMe · Jun 30, 2015

I would start working on the place with power cords laying around and a couple days work ing on it and some night have an electrical cord failure and VOUIALA! Problem solved! Hoss

mj · Jun 30, 2015

(quoted from post at 11:34:31 06/30/15) Don't know about your state, but here you would need an environmental survey before any demolition - state law. ................

As for a machine, in the end you will probably wind up cheaper just having a demolition contractor doing the work. The other option is renting a machine instead of buying.

What state are you talking about?

I agree with the 'having a contractor doing the work' or renting a machine rather than buying advice.

mattwillson · Jun 30, 2015

No possible to manipulate a little
financial combustion?

Stephen Newell · Jun 30, 2015

There was this huge two story house near me that was taken down by running a cable around the house and pulling it down with a bull dozer.

showcrop · Jun 30, 2015

I have been involved with quite a few house removals. A bunch were burned by the Fire Dept. but that is now done only under certain conditions but it is still worth checking to see if they would like it. You don't say what is the ultimate disposition of the material. If it can be buried on site, that would be very low cost but highly unlikely that it would be legal. If it has to be all hauled away, In order to do it as cost effectively as possible, you need a large enough machine to be able to crush the material down into small sized pieces in the bsement or it will take way too much trucking to haul it all off. I hauled two houses when I had my triaxle dump truck. They had two trucks and one moderate sized excavator on a small house and we got it done in about eight hours. The key is crushing it down into small pieces in the basement.

newhollandnut · Jun 30, 2015

An accidental match then go rent a decent trackhoe
with a thumb. Haha. We burnt on a couple years the
trackhoe was on another farm so just used the
backhoe and stirred the remains to get them burnt
good and just dug and buried the foundation. I've
tore quite a few down and probably the fastest and
easiest way for me was a skid steer and grapple but
it pretty much needs to be on the ground first unless
you're pretty skilled and cautious. If it's block
foundation skid steer should have to problem and
with rubber tracks you don't have to worry about
nails and very fast and effective way to put down fill
dirt. Just my opinion

newhollandnut · Jun 30, 2015

Also in my opinion big roll off dumpsters are the
way to go if you don't mind to spend a little and you
aren't able to burn it. You can use a truck if you
have one but how far do you have to haul it? And
you might as well figure on a nail or two in a tire and
the dumpsters are easier to load than the trick being
shorter and the big advantage if a board gets
sideways and hangs half the load in the bed you'll
never know a thing about it

ScoutB · Jun 30, 2015

I watched a guy take down a two story in the city with a fwd pickup. He chained up to wall sections on the first floor and pulled them out until the house just rolled over. He was selling the used lumber to the neighbors as fast as he could pull it out.
If you go the fire department route be mindful of nearby trees. They'll burn in the process too.

01gentdc · Jun 30, 2015

su8rely that house was not destroyed ? wth is wrong with people /?,. byt yes a cable wrapped around anything will bring it down

Stephen Newell · Jun 30, 2015

I couldn't believe it either. The house had a historical marker on the front of it and everyone in the area used that house as a landmark to give directions. Less than a year earlier they had a contractor do some repair work on the house. The contractor had me make about 20 balusters for the front porch. They pulled the house down and built two modern houses in it's place.

oldtanker · Jun 30, 2015

As others have said make sure of the laws! Should be able to find them right online. I know a guy who tore one down and got caught with asbestos in the rubble. Cost him a lot for the clean up and the fine was pretty stiff.

Rick

John_PA · Jul 1, 2015

NONONO!

You are doing it wrong...

Put a sign on the house that says, "Free drugs inside! pot, smack, snow!"

Then, at every entrance leave a can of gas and a few packs of matches. The house will disappear overnight.

Why worry? People who like to destroy things will take care of it. Being drug depraved will only fuel their ambition further.

Sorry you have to tear it down. It seems anyone will buy a dilapidated structure these days for the architectural salvage and tear it down for you. You get on with your bad self. Markers and poster board are cheap. Arson is free. You just do your thing.

8)

Ron/PA · Jul 1, 2015

Joe, looks like you're in PA so I'll just pass on what I know. I'm the zoning and code officer for our little borough and run into some of this every year.

Here, no fire company will touch a demo burn. State outlawed it a few years ago and they won't even come in on standby if you burn it yourself. If they do, they're an accessory. The only way they'll participate at all is if you jump through all the hoops and get all the necessary state permits.

PA D.E.P. says it can't be burned. If it's got paint on it, or nails in it that makes it demo waste and must be properly landfilled.

Burying it gets a little sketchy, but in general it's not legal unless all hazardous materials are removed first. Having said that, there's a lot of structures that get buried around here.

Since PA subscribed to the Uniform Construction Code, the game has changed by leaps and bounds every year.

Locally it's near impossible to find a construction company with a big excavator to bury one due to the liability laws. Normally folks here look for a farmer with a big enough machine to do it in a day and make it go away overnight.

To be completely legal, I think you would need to haul it off site to a landfill. If it were me, I'd be thinking about that big old hole.

Good luck

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