OT--our food distribution system--and a scary what ...

Been working the past 18 months in the Information technology department for a large Midwest grocery chain. Had a chance to get up close and familiar with how the food distribution system in this country works. Especially from the software and logistics side of things.

People check out at the register. The clerk scans your lettuce or that can of pork and beans you just bought. The sale goes over the internet to the central computer at company headquarters.

It marks it against inventory and when a critical level is reached, the system automatically flashes an order for new product. It knows where to get the product and how long it takes to ship. Almost no human intervention required.

Whether it's lettuce from California, seafood from Alaska, grapes from Mexico, or fresh meat from the packing plant; it's soon loaded on a truck and on its way to a grocery store in the middle of Iowa or Montana. And all "just in time" before the shelves get empty.

At the store where I work, trucks constantly arriving and unloading. Clerks pulling huge carts down the aisles, restocking the shelves. 24/7 Sundays and Holidays. It still never ceases to amaze me!

All well and good. But I find myself thinking: what if something goes wrong with this incredibly complex process? It's like some huge spider web, and the slightest twitch or interruption would be chaos.

Bottom line---people have no idea of the thin thread that their daily meal depends on. God forbid that we ever find out what will happen if something throws a wrench into how all this works.
 
In the food industry "just in time" is probably a good thing since no one wants month old produce, but in manufacturing it can be terrible. The "manufacturing industry" has been pushing "just in time" manufacturing for a number of years now. The idea is that you dont produce your prodcut, and put it in inventory. You only produce a product to fill and order. This of course frees up company cash. Of couse the downside is nothing is in stock and if you are in a hurry you better plan on waiting. I just called chief hydraulics to get a new thumb cylinder on my excavator. The cylinder I need is scheduled to be made in the end of may! I cant wait 6 weeks for cylinder. They lost a sale over it.
 
Well, I don't think anything would happen to just shut it down forever. I can see power outages like we've had or Internet interruptions. If the apocalypse DID happen, we'd go back to doing it manually, which required a whole lot more people to make it happen. The age of computerization has made processes more efficient in just about every industry. Way back in the 60's-70's, companies would transmit this information point-to-point via modems. I was involved in a major automation project in the late 70's that guaranteed if you needed a part for your diesel engine anywhere in the world, we'd have it on a plane that night. Pretty innovative back then, but we take that kind of service for granted today via the Internet.
 
It used to be that everybody in town knew the line from the guy who owned the hardware store if you needed something he didn't have. "It'll be on the truck Wednesday". He's been gone for several years and that's still the big joke around town if you need something.
 
And all "just in time" before the shelves get empty.

"Just in time before the shelves get empty"
That reminds me when I had to buy hot dog buns for a church Sunday school even that I had to host a couple of years ago. I went into the grocery store and bought every hot dog bun that they had on the shelf. When I got to the check out counter, I mentioned that fact to the lady behind the cash register. She said: "Oh sh**! The hot dog bun delivery truck was just here today and we won't get any more for four more days. There are going to be a few customers who ain't gonna be happy and they are all going to take it out on me. Thanks a lot!"
 
I tell my local NH dealer that he is a geographic oddity, he's 2 days from everywhere because he always tells me he can get the parts day after tomorrow.
 
Must be the same truck that delivers here once a week.....Wed. How does he get here so fast from Michigan?
 
And that"s why the next enemy may not be a physical invasion.....just an IT one! And we have such little manufacturing capacity left here.
 
So explain to me as truck owners we have to pay lumper fees, and finally get reimbursed 45 days later.
 
Could easily deliver in Mi. and Mn. in the same day, if those were the only 2 stops. lol
 
I would imagine somebody would pick up the telephone and call and see what was needed or make an educated guess based on previous history and send the trucks out while they fixed the problem. When it comes to making a buck people are more resourceful than they are often given credit for, a businessman will find a way to fill a need to make a profit, that is the reason capitalism works and all other fairy tale sytems of economic enterprise fail. ''Chaos'' might be the result of a short term food interruption in the kool aid areas because that is the natural reaction of sheeple, take no responsibility for their own well being and bleat to the government to fill their every need. Areas where people still take care of themselves would not have any problems. Where I live people would be going to check on old folks and people who could not do for themselves and make sure they had what they needed.
 
Pat, I agree! People would be so panicked nothing would happen but mass hysteria!

I remember the "gas shortage", late '60s I think.

Got to see the ugly side of it working at my dad's service station. People lined up waiting to get gas, mad and irritated, some near panic fearing the worst. Pushing, shouting, brawling, ridiculous accusations that we (business owners) were holding out just to be mean to them!

Strangest thing, some put themselves in the middle of the chaos deliberately and needlessly. Wait in line for an hour and their car would be full! See them every day, most were elderly, didn't work, just drove home, parked, drove back to sit in line again the next day! They were the loudest complainers! LOL

Seriously, if people panicked over a minor, temporary gas shortage, what would they do over a food shortage!!! Add to that the erosion of ethics since the '60's...

I don't think we as a society could pull together and do it. Would a hysterical crowd quietly sit by while a farmer grew a crop or a rancher raised a herd to slaughter? Would they be willing or able to help?

Or do what they do best, be a part of the problem until there were no winners... Or survivors...
 
I work in IT too. Financial industry for the last 15+ years.
Real-time trading is one really neat aspect.
If our broker trading system is a minute late, a trade
could potentially lose millions. "Just in time"

I have to say that the imaging and backup systems are
so far advanced from when I started in this business that
I don't have any fear of the record keeping anymore!

Shoot, the ATM's will even print you a picture of the check
you just deposited on your receipt. Pretty cool!

The problem with going back to doing it manually is that we
would have to have enough people who could actually make
change from a dollar bill to accomplish it. :roll:
 
I heard that in a 3 day period grocery store shelves would be empty if no restocking occured in those 3 days.
Now just think if an event happened that made everyone run to the store and buy up everything.

Hopefully a grocery store/warehouse/dist. system can be managed well enough by human beings that can think and act by shipping product from farms to packing plants to warehouses to stores.....without computers and the I-net.
Maybe.......But, common sense aint all that common anymore.
 
That's the way it seems. Lots of stores around here do the same thing. No warehouse in the back, just leave an empty space til "the truck comes tomorrow".
 
Being something pf a "prepper" type, I've given this a lot of thought. I've seen what can happen in a mid sized town when the power goes out on a Saturday afternoon in summer and stays off over night. Chaos. Rapes, burglaries, assaults, larcenies, small versions of riots. All in small town center of maybe 8K people. If an EMP or virus was to take out the computer systems, if the power grid was attacked, if the bottom dropped out of the economy real hard...well, it wouldn't be pretty, that's for certain. How long would it last? Anything over a few days is all that matters. You give the average person 3-5 days w/o power and all bets are off. Go a week w/o power or shut the water off for 3 days and I am certain we'd have something the likes none of us have ever even imagined. I'm talking nation wide, not just a local county wide thing. I don't think most people want to give it any hard thought, too scary.
 
I used to service the generators at four of the major grocery stores in Texas.I was at one late at night to do my building test. After the daily report was finished. 15 minutes before the report was finished. The system crashed. The girl in the control room went nuts. I left. Saw a truck pull in one time. With three thousand bars of soap. System ordered the wrong amount.
 
Was in the middle east when the country had a four day revolution, you should have seen how the stores emptied out. First milk, junk drinks, snacky foods and instant foods, SIL bought what he thought was necessary, I loaded up on large containers of rice, potatoes and noodles, Staples. I was suprised how fast MOST things came back on the shelves about a week later. A lot worse than an Iowa snow storm.
 
Food distribution works today because energy is dirt cheap, making it economical to ship produce and other perishables thousands of miles. How well will it work when crude oil hits $1000 a barrel?
 
Driver or Truck Owner responsibility for unloading refrigerated shipments has baffled me ever since first being introduced to the concept during an intermittent career as a driver. Driving a load of boxed meat from Omaha to Seattle as fast as you're legally and logbook legal able to and then unloading 500 85# boxes that are stacked on the floor is a little much to expect from most drivers IMHO. So most drivers hire a lumper from the only or first available in line. Why isn't it the receivers responsibility to provide and pay that lumper? (this may be out of date. I drove my last refrigerated load 19 years ago)
 
(quoted from post at 20:05:55 04/05/14) Guess Wal-Mart hasn't heard about that system yet. Government is just waiting for the right time to throw the wrench.

LOL Wal Marts system works like this.

Clerk scans your items and tells you the total. Once you pay and the transaction is completed that sale into is sent to Wal Mart HQ via a dedicated satellite link. The list of items from you purchase is then flashed via satellite to the regional distribution center (warehouse) and those items, if in the warehouse, are replaced on the next days truck. Wal Mart even goes as far as opening cartons to pull one item, say a tube of tooth paste. Where the problems occur is with the people stocking the shelves or a rush on a certain item. One of my kids worked for Wal Mart while attending college, currently have 2 nephews working there.

Rick
 
I don't know how many times I've walked into a TSC and couldn't find what I needed because the shelf was empty. Ask a employee and they say the computer shows we have 1 or 2. Even though they don't have any, because the computer says they have 1 or 2, it won't allow them to order any more. The computer won't reorder until it shows 0. Then they might not stock those items anymore because it shows they don't sell, but you can't sell what you don't have! Thier system thinks they have had 1 or 2 in store and no one buys them, but if they would restock they would sell. Technology, ain't it great.
 
By what scenario is crude oil going to hit $1000.00 per barrel except rampant inflation caused by a worthless dollar whereby everything is inflated? If we were suddenly reverted to horse and buggy the small local farm system would be born anew. People who want to do business will always supply a need.
 
The 1 or 2 items were stolen; given out to replace a defective item with out going threw the proper refund buy again hassle; got broken in the store and just thrown away without a paper trail; or was just missing when the truck showed up and never got reported.

That's why for the system to work you need a monthly inventory check usually done by one group of employees that goes from store to store matching inventory to what the computer says we have.

Weird thing is now matter how it was lost it always gets recorded as shoplifting.
 
When shyte really hits the fan the chaos would be unimaginable.
I am glad i live out in the bush and have enough food on the shelf and in the freezer to last me 1/2 a year.
I would pity the poor folks that live in the city's, it would get ugly very very fast.
 
Food is getting more expensive all the time. Here around Houston we are seeing a surge in gardening, farmers markets, and back yard chickens. 3-4 month old laying hens are selling for $20-25. "chicken tractors" selling for as much as $1000. that hold 6-8 birds.

Pretty crazy as I was in the store today and eggs sell for $1.89 a dozen.

I do some back hauls for grocers supply here in Houston. The have very little warehouse space and use my dry van as storage. Basically they unload my truck and it gets redistributed to multiple other trucks. The problem is they will keep me tied up for 6-8 hours instead unloading me in 30 minutes and get me out of their. I don't haul for them any more.

Remember back to Katrina and New Orleans for what happens when the food supply chain has a hick up.
 
True, oil prices are unlikely to top $1000 any time soon. I wouldn't be so sure about prices in the two to three hundred dollar range. I am speaking in inflation-adjusted 2014 dollars, of course. Oil is a finite resource, much of which comes from very unstable parts of the world and for which global demand is high.

Regardless of what future energy prices are, it doesn't change the basic fact that our food distribution system is heavily dependent on very cheap energy prices.
 
TSC seems to have a 2-3 month delay with seasonal items. Their winter clothes are soon out of the popular sizes about mid-September, and they don"t get any more in until February. Plus no one at TSC seems to get the idea to order more of the popular sizes with clothing. So if you want Medium or Large jeans, they are often out. But they have tons XXL and Petite. Sprayer fittings and parts are usually gone by mid-June.
 
(quoted from post at 10:31:43 04/15/14) TSC seems to have a 2-3 month delay with seasonal items. Their winter clothes are soon out of the popular sizes about mid-September, and they don"t get any more in until February. Plus no one at TSC seems to get the idea to order more of the popular sizes with clothing. So if you want Medium or Large jeans, they are often out. But they have tons XXL and Petite. Sprayer fittings and parts are usually gone by mid-June.

That seems to be corporate decisions more than store manager decisions. According to the manager at our TSC he has to stock what corporate says, when they say to and that's all there is to it. People in Arkansas don't really understand weather in northern NY.
 
(quoted from post at 07:39:47 04/06/14) By what scenario is crude oil going to hit $1000.00 per barrel except rampant inflation caused by a worthless dollar whereby everything is inflated? If we were suddenly reverted to horse and buggy the small local farm system would be born anew. People who want to do business will always supply a need.

That assumes people remain civil and ethical after such a disaster.

Not. Gonna. Happen.

After such a disaster, people will simply TAKE. There will be no business.
 
(quoted from post at 05:02:52 04/16/14)
(quoted from post at 10:31:43 04/15/14) TSC seems to have a 2-3 month delay with seasonal items. Their winter clothes are soon out of the popular sizes about mid-September, and they don"t get any more in until February. Plus no one at TSC seems to get the idea to order more of the popular sizes with clothing. So if you want Medium or Large jeans, they are often out. But they have tons XXL and Petite. Sprayer fittings and parts are usually gone by mid-June.

That seems to be corporate decisions more than store manager decisions. According to the manager at our TSC he has to stock what corporate says, when they say to and that's all there is to it. People in Arkansas don't really understand weather in northern NY.

true
Stopped at the local TSC to pick up a replacement for an electric heater that quit. Manager said all heater stuff had been clearanced and removed LAST MONTH!?!?
Um, it's 20 degrees and snow on the ground. Not at all unusual
here in mid April.
He said they had no choice. corporate
 

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