Rings, my latest stupid mistake.

.Mark · Oct 16, 2013

OK, I was replacing rod bearings and pulled the rod to far down. Rings are out on bottom. I"m working from bottom, with engine (BD154) in tractor. Any ideas? Head is off, so if I can get rings off, I can, hopefully, pull piston from top and re-ring. Problem is getting to rings around crank. Yea, I know I"m a dummy.

Paul from MI · Oct 16, 2013

Maybe use a take-apart type ring compressor and slide piston back up into cylinder. Coupl of hose clamps might work too.

Anonymous-0 · Oct 16, 2013

never did that , YET ,,. hope that never happens again,, ,, seems like you will have to push the sleeve and piston out ,, if you cant get a hose clamp around it .. just a farmer /smartz mechanic ,here , ,,./ hopefully others will come up with sumthin that worx and is a easy fix ,, let us know how it goes

MrJDMan80 · Oct 16, 2013

Paul is right, house clamp would do the trick. Tim

Ted in NE-OH · Oct 16, 2013

I thought this was a marriage response. LOL

John B. · Oct 16, 2013

I would pull the rings off the bottom then push the piston and rod up so the rings will clear in the crank case. Trying to put them back on the piston on the underside of the sleeve I don't think you'll get the ring gaps positioned correctly.

Bret4207 · Oct 17, 2013

Don't know what you're working on, but my ring compressor will open up big enough to clear the rod end on anything I've ever tried it on. Seems to me it's rare to have a rod end bigger than a piston, but I don't know everything!

picassomcp · Oct 17, 2013

I remember watching a kid in high school automotive class spend hours with 2 screwdrivers trying to get the rings back into the grooves of the piston so that he could get the whole works back into the cylinder to pull it out the top. He learned that pistons come out the top the hard way, I and the others in the class got a cheap lesson on that. I hope that you are able to get yours back in quickly, I would try the hose clamp idea.

bjb in TX from Ne · Oct 17, 2013

Don't the international F-series come out the bottom? When I was trying to get the piston out of an F-30 motor I had the opposite problem. Taking them up didn't allow the connecting rod to come through the cylinder. I thought the reason for those large handholes in the side of the block is you could get the pistons out without taking the head off...

RBnSC · Oct 17, 2013

Just curious as to how you got it down past the throw of the crank or the rod past the journal.
Ron

mkirsch · Oct 17, 2013

Hose clamp X3.

Even if you have to do one ring at a time.

.Mark · Oct 17, 2013

Thanks for the replies, Going to probably have to pull the rings out somehow. Don't think I can get a clamp up around the crank. It's all still in. The tractor is a IH 364.

showcrop · Oct 17, 2013

(quoted from post at 06:28:41 10/17/13) Thanks for the replies, Going to probably have to pull the rings out somehow. Don't think I can get a clamp up around the crank. It's all still in. The tractor is a IH 364.

I think that his is telling you that it is time for new rings. I bet your local machine shop can get them into your hands faster than you can get all the ones that are in there now out the top.

Zachary Hoyt · Oct 17, 2013

I used an oil filter wrench, the metal strap type, putting in a piston from the top. Not sure if you would have enough clearance.
Zach

RN · Oct 17, 2013

hose clamps or similar tool for 2 stroke engines. The old 350 to 450cc single cylinder 2 strokes used to get new rings by pulling off cylinder and replace rings, cylinder then put on from top-bottom first-, piston stayed on rod connected to crankshaft. 2 stroke ring compressor looked like a extra wide hose clamp good for about 3 inch plus piston. The ATV/Smowmobile shops likely to have them yet. RN

RN · Oct 17, 2013

hose clamps or similar tool for 2 stroke engines. The old 350 to 450cc single cylinder 2 strokes used to get new rings by pulling off cylinder and replace rings, cylinder then put on from top-bottom first-, piston stayed on rod connected to crankshaft. 2 stroke ring compressor looked like a extra wide hose clamp good for about 3 inch plus piston. The ATV/Smowmobile/Harley shops likely to have them yet. RN

.Mark · Oct 17, 2013

cleaning the rod journal, pulled it down to far. Wasn't paying attention, won't happen again.

Jiles · Oct 17, 2013

My advise would be to break the rings in question and remove. I would then see if I could purchase One set of rings to replace. Or just do it right and replace all piston rings. If you were to be able to compress the rings enough to push piston up, it would be very unlikely that they would be in the same "seated" position. Which could mean they would need to seat again.
Been in similar situations before.

JimEvans · Oct 17, 2013

The old Cases were made so you could actually re-ring a tractor without removing the head. You could slip the pistons out the bottom and out the inspection covers in the oil pan. Reinstall the same way. If you have enough room and are careful, you could probably get the old rings back in the bore with your fingers.

jdv · Oct 17, 2013

You might try a zip tie if you have some room in there

wisbaker · Oct 17, 2013

I used to do VW air-cooled engines with a hose clamp, I'm guessing most aircraft engines are the same way. With the VW the crankcase is 2 pieces, you bolt the rods to the crank, assemble the crankcase around the crank/rod assembly, install pistons & rings, compress the rings and slide the cylinders over the pistons and then install the heads. But on the other hand if you got the top and bottom open go for new rings unless you're a dedicated hobbyist that's doing this for fun and won't mind tearing it down if you got the ring back in and it didn't seal.

Jeff B. · Oct 17, 2013

Years ago when I was in the automotive parts side of the business, you could buy all the rings for one piston if you need it. I bet you still can, but probably have to order them from somewhere.

showcrop · Oct 18, 2013

(quoted from post at 19:53:13 10/17/13) Years ago when I was in the automotive parts side of the business, you could buy all the rings for one piston if you need it. I bet you still can, but probably have to order them from somewhere.

You are right. They call it open stock, and I have done it. As I pointed out in my earlier post any automotive machine shop can have them probably the same day.

.Mark · Oct 21, 2013

Success, Piston is out. Used a scribe to pull ring from bottom, then pushed it out the top. Waiting for the parts now. Head is off, no cracks, pretty nasty and rusty in the water area. Going to find out if any damage to it. Everyone of the glow plugs broke off pulling them, did get them out though. I wonder if more standard type glow plugs can replace these old wire type? When I finally get the old thing running I'll report.

Rings, my latest stupid mistake.

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