O/T Inheritance

sirhc

Member
My wife's ex sister in law came over yesterday very upset her dad passed away last year at the age 99 she had taken care of him for the last 19 years the last five she had left here job to keep from him going to a nursing home no help from her half siblings her mom children from another marriage at all her father had a sizable estate with some good planning no taxes had to be paid he left the balk of the estate to her inclueing the farms letters had been sent to the two half brother each are getting 50,000$ right of way the oldest one is contesting the will her lawyer said she has an iron clad will an exact copy of her mom's everybody tells her not to worry about it any thought so we can calm her nerves.The will was draw up over 25 years ago the whole town knows every witness on it.
 
I would doubt a will that old would not stand up, but someone can always litigate, and they will.
 
Sounds like her father had his stuff together and knew what he wanted to happen. It's too bad that once some free money comes up that everyone wants to make sure that nobody gets more than them. My oldest sister strikes me as that type of person at times, and that worries me for when Mom and Dad go.
 
Instead of posting on here, get her to her lawyer pronto. Have her make extra copy of the will for her records, as lawyer will want the original. Also, she should talk to no other family member, or their lawyers. Keep her mouth shut, and let her lawyer handle them. Tom
 
Tell her when the legal bills get to $50000 the brother will give up because he'll be out of money. Some people always want something for nothing. Have her attorney counter file & ask to recover her legal fees as the brother is filing a frivolous lawsuit by contesting a will that he knew about 25 years ago. I'll bet he drops the suit as soon as that happens.
 
A family in our neighborhood had a son & daughter. Daughter ran off with a no-good right after she graduated from high school; family didn't hear from her for 20 years or more. Son stayed home, farmed their 320 acres and took care of the parents.

They passed away in their late 80's - and left half of everything to the daughter! Son couldn't make a living on 160 acres he had left. The injustice of it all ate on him and he hanged himself in the barn a year later.

When someone takes care of the parents alone; that person should inherit the bulk of the estate. I made sure that my younger brother inherited the land when the folks passed away, as he took care of Mom for 15 years after Dad passed away.
 
Date has nothing to do with it. Probate here looks at the
authenticity of the document and if it meets the criteria and no later
documents are filed, or furnished, the will is probated. BTDT

Course, if someone comes up after the fact with a later document
that meets the legal criteria then I don't know what happens.....just
a big mess I guess.

Mark
 
Same here when my dad passed away years years ago none of my sisters visited him for years but as soon as he was gone they crawled out of woodwork most everything was left to my little brother he had stayed on the farm anything they did to try to get the farm was shot down in a few seconds they didn't have a leg to stand on after the whole town turned on them they left with their tail between their legs Havn't heard from them since
 
Where there is a will there is a way to contest it. My in laws divided their estate equally between the six children. the only son contested on the grounds that the girls were given away at their weddings and were no longer of the family as evidenced by different last names. He was laughed out of court, but it still cost time and money to defend against his silliness.
Maybe neither here nor there, but he is the only member of his family that doesn't work and has been getting government support for the last twenty or so years.
 
I forgot to say it has been gone thru probate court this is the last step to close the estate One thing i can say the man was sharp as a tack till the day he died.One other thing the same firm the drew up the will is handling the estate the lawyer the did the will is still alive but retired.
 
I've been in the middle of an iron clad estate deal since 2008.
No end in sight.

But, it sounds like you all have a better setup.

Shame on family for not honoring their ancestors wishes. Lot
of selfish people out there. Nothing like family to treat each
other the worst.

Good luck to the gal, I hope it turns out well for her, and mostly
to hold her head up high, from what you say she is in the right
on this.

Paul
 
My dad left a mess when he passed. He had no will, many small CD's and bank accounts with random joint ownership between he, my sister and I.

We were lucky that the two of us were able to work together, pool the money into one account pay bills and settle up.
 
A little more detail - James' dad remarried and its his "step-mother's" family that is trying to get their hands on the estate.
 
I have been involved in several estates, on both sides of the issue. I have been the executor in two estates. If the lawyer did a good job on the wills the challenges usually are not too big of an issue. Also I have noticed those making the most noise are the ones with the fewest assets.

We are lucky here. The local probate judge's family is in the law business. People have found out real quick that they do the good wills in this county. They are good. They have the bigger estate wills signed by the three county court judges as witnesses. That really has stopped the nuisance type suits over those wills.

My lawyer wrote my will. Then he turned it over to them to look over. When it was all correct I went to the court house and walked the will through the three judges chambers. We all signed the documents right there.

Tell her that she should be fine. Think of the good times with her Father. Tell her she did what was best for him in his later years. That is the real important thing. The money is a side issue. You will not stand before God with your pockets full of money. Her taking care of her Dad will be what is important.
 
Something else you may want in your will is a no contest clause.
The executor (trix) is in charge of the distribution and handling
of the estate and if you protest, you are out. The instructions
are in the will as to how the deceased wanted the estate
handled. Had an attorney draw mine up also.

For anyone with a big mess, do your survivors a favor and get
your legal documents in order. That way assets will be
distributed per your wishes, not wind up in the pockets of the
arbitrators.........

If you can't deal with doling things out to your kids, get a grip.
Not having a will just because you can't is no excuse. It only
hurts, not helps them. BTDT

Mark
 
Just like electrical questions, legal questions really draw em out on here...

I practice law in the area of Wills and Probate here in Indiana and can tell you this, anything anyone here (lay or professional) thinks DONT AMOUNT TO A HILL OF BEANS, this area of the law is based in a huge part on the common law, much of which has since been codified and is pretty well settled and defined as far as any legal issues are concerned, with the only questions being those of fact for a judge or jury to decide.

SURE a will can always be challenged, but if it was properly prepared (like mine are) and witnessed and self proven, absent a clear showing of duress or coercion or undue influence or the testators incompetency by the Plaintiff, which bears a high burden on their part, YOU CAN BET IT WILL LIKELY WITHSTAND A CHALLENGE. Also remember, the burden of coming forward with good admissible evidence and the burden of persuasion and proof by a preponderance of the evidence ALL RESTS WITH THE PLAINTIFF

The fact it was 25 years old might make it harder for the plaintiff to produce credible admissible competent evidence or testimony as far as its challenge and the submission to probate of the ORIGINAL Will (to avoid other proof issues) really helps the testators case.

Remember, if it was properly prepared signed and witnessed and the original is available, its gonna take hard credible admissible competent evidence to show the testator was incompetent or subject to duress or undue influence to over turn his or her intentions... Its kind of like why there are "dead mans statutes" to protect the interest of their estates because since they arent here to be able to challenge things ITS GONNA TAKE ONE HIGH DEGREE OF PROOF TO UPSET THEIR CLEAR WRITTEN WITHIN THE LAW INTENTIONS..

NOTE even if a will would be say declared completely invalid, the estate would then pass by the laws of intestate succession AND NOT IN ANY WAY ACCORDING TO WHAT A PARTICULAR HEIR WISHES...........

NOTE there can even be law that says if a divorce follows execution of a will, a bequest to the spouse can be ruled completely invalid!!!!

SO YOU SEE WHY SUCH A COMPLEX LEGAL QUESTION CAN NOTTTTTTTTT BE ANSWERED OR BASED ON WHAT ANYONE HERE SAYS OR HAS EXPERIENCED, IT DONT AMOUNT TO ANYTHING. Even a professional trained opinion is as worthless until based on a thorough review of that states laws and the evidence.....

Consult a trained competent professional probare and Estates Attorney NOT anything posted here, but its my unrfesearched professional legal opinion its hard to challenge an original will that was properly prepared absent that noted above, Id rather reprent the testators estate then the party trying to challenge it.......

John T BSEE, JD Attorney at Law
 
It gripes me to no end. I've watched these situations my entire life. One child cares for the ailing parent with no help from the other siblings, and often while receiving criticism from the others about whatever perceived injustice they can dream up. It boils down to this - The caregiver is always the goat. I've seen it in all walks of life. Two preachers - in both cases, the whole family is ticked off at the one sister who took her dad into her home and cared for him. A deacon friend - the whole family is ticked off at a brother who took their dad into his home and cared for him. And several more. In ALL cases, the gripers expected dad to move into their sibling's home with "X" dollars, live there for an extended period, with 24 hour care, while his health declined to his eventual death, and upon his death still have "X" dollars in his bank account to be divided equally among all of the children. These greedy jealous animals totally discount any idea of the high cost of medicines, doctor visits, special facilities needed to accommodate the elderly etc. And that doesn't even touch the disruption wrought to the caregivers family. I know there are exceptions, but they seem to be rare.

I have given orders to my kids to NOT take me into their home when my health declines. Sometimes the family comes out intact, many times it is destroyed. In the case of the two preachers, ten years have gone by and one won't speak to his sister or any member of sis's family. The other is barely civil - a "frosted" relationship, you might say. Jealousy and greed. The caregiver is the goat. Your wife's ex-sister in law needs to accept that and write these people off for what they are.
 
You have that right. LOL I like how the heirs all think you are getting "rich" being the executor.

The fees I got did not even cover the gas money that it took to run around and take care of things.
 
Wills can be totally set aside, even if they are well written..... Many thick books on the topic and every state is different......
Lot of room for people with axes to grind to operate in......

Paul
 
One thing I was always told inheritance was a gift not a right the one thing I have seen is the more they have the more they want all the money in the world will never bring back the dearly departed.
 
My sister had a 2 million dollar estate.She never had any kids,i was here only heir.I had a will that said she left everything to me.But with the help of some shyster lawyers in Oklahoma her
estate went to 4 step kids she never met.
 
I agree - but!!!! While the will may stand all legal challenges there is nothing preventing those legal challenges from happening and tying up the estate for years.

Nothing against John T but I've also seen lawyers draw up a will with the specific intent of drumming up more business. I had one old girl that worked in my office (she was 76) whose aunt died (she was 95). The will was written about 10 years earlier distributing all the assets to her neices and nephews. The problem was she wanted that distribution process to take 20 years so as to give them time to be mature enough to handle the money they were coming into. Her neices and nephews were all in their late 60s to early 80s when she died.

The lawyer that wrote the will told them not to fear - he knew how to legally speed that process up. All they had to do was pay him and he'd make it happen.
 
YOURE EXACTLY RIGHT, Good point, they can be set aside regardless how "well written" IN CASES OF UNDUE INFLUENCE OR DURESS OR COERCION OR INCOMPETENCY IF PROVEN IN COURT BY ADMISSIBLE COMPETENT EVIDENCE BY A PREPONDERANCE OF THE EVIDENCE

Otherwise THEY STAND

Youre right, Ive read and researched many of those volumes of cases lol

John T Country lawyer
 
Unfortunately youre correct, Ive seen wills prepared in such a way follow up legal work may still be required, I try my best to cover all the bases so theres no uncertain future work out there

John T
 
Let the vultures sue, they will have to pay lawyers while the estate will pay to defend the will, no Lawyer is going to take their case hoping to get lucky, they will want cash, I bet the bums don't have it or don't want to spend it. I would call their bluff immediately and tell them we can do as the deceased wished and honor his will or we can fight it out until nothings left and let the Lawyers get it all.
 
That was some legal wranglings ????????? As step kids are NOT legally kids in most jurisdictions....... Even if a will were invalid step kids DO NOT TAKE normally under the laws of intestate succession WOWWWWWWWWW

John T
 
The person commonly referred to as Executor or Administrator or nowadyas in our jurisdiction Personal Pepresentative, is the person who "administers" the Estate of the decedent......with or without pay subject to perhaps the terms of the will

John T
 
I once heard that one should appoint their worst enemy as executor to "get even" with them one last time.

Trouble is a lot of folks squander the money they receive, none of which they worked for, trying to get more.

They have no respect for the deceased's wishes; only what they can put in their pockets.

Its a crying shame watching the step-mother's family waste the money your parents accumulated through hard work during their lifetime.

Well can't expect too much from them since my father was their fourth step-father.

Guess I should be grateful to them for giving me the clothes he was buried in and his empty wallet.
 
If you had a valid will, drawn up by a lawyer, properly witnessed and signed then someone pulled a fast one on you or there is a lot more to the story.
 
UNLESS a "no contest clause" is invalid as contrary to the public policy of the state. The Courts like to decide what can or can not be contested as a matter of law NOT by the testator making up his own law.....

As always, however, in complex legal issues NEVER SAY NEVER, different states may do things differently

Good point

John T
 
Too many people go to a lawyer and say "tell me what to do". If you have an estate bigger than a few bucks, you should also have the common sense to know how you want it distributed after your passing. TELL THE LAWYER WHAT YOU WANT. Then it is his job to put it in a legal form to accomplish your wishes. THEN READ IT BEFORE YOU SIGN IT. and Don't be a cheapskate. Hire a lawyer, skilled at estate work (not the local hack in a trailer office) to protect what you have worked all your life to accumulate.

Too many people are buffaloed by the law..don't be. Ask questions, set down and do what ifs?

What if I die tomorrow? What if I live 30 more years? What if my son goes before I do?
 
With all that has been said already, I would like to made one statement, It matters not if you have a lot or a little, a properly drawn will saves a lot of time and headaches. The wife and I always had to scratch for everything, never was able to save anything, but a few years ago we had our wills made. When she died all I had to do was go to the courthouse and register the will, no red tape, no hassle. One thing, I sure am glad that my name was NOT on any of her four credit cards! According to our state laws, I was awarded the first $20,000 from her "estate" for living expenses four the next year, Her "estate" was not worth anywhere near that and since my name was not on her cards, they had to eat it. With the interest rates that they charge,I call that "poetic justice"!
 
Even when there is a will, some scum sucking relatives will screw you out of it with a sudden contract supposedly signed when they were in a coma for the last week of their life, yet somehow managed to sign a contract selling them half the estate for pennies, and yet even that so called payment somehow the money never shows up in the accounts, lawyers and judges are idiots and say the "family" should reconcile and get along.... That day was the absolute last day I will ever see those loosers. We have now since setup our wishes in a Trust, according to what i have seen here, it's the only iron clad way to keep those scum suckers from even being able to sue to to get our estate...
 
Non adopted step children are "generally" not legal children. Unless a will left them something by name (which sure can still be done) they have no more right then I would to a claim. Also, if the decedent died intestate the laws of intestste succession determines their "heirs at law" and step children are NOT heirs at law and dont "usually" take.

Still, not having read the will nor researched your states laws my albeit still professional legal opinion is worth just what you paid NOTHING

Remember, "A living person has no heirs"

John T
 
9 months after I was appointed administrator of the estate I was removed by a judge in ok city.The step kids represented by the same lawyer my sister had fired a few months before her death
came up with a trust paper supposedly signed by my sister leaving everything to them.We were
supposed to go to court,but a week before the judge ruled the trust was the last will and the valid one.My sisters husband was a attourney.He passed away a few months before she did.His estate was over 3 million.My sister passed away at a health retreat in dallas texas.Never did find out the exact details.They claimed it was an asthma attack,but the coroners paperwork doesn't support that.
 
Dang, I was informed just last night that my father in law wants me to be the executioner of his will. Looks like we need to discuss some things.
 
And, if you win the lottery...who hates you the
most ? Your son-in-law ! You can never give him
enough !
 
Thanks for the input i think she just want to come over last night and vent she seemed a lot better today.
 
Yep, the terms of a Trust can (in circumstances) nnalert those bequests in an even valid perfect good Will WELL DUH.....If the property was in a trust then the Will cant necessarily pass trust only owned property absent provisions to the contrary. As more relevant legal facts now arise its understandable how and why things happen and are prefectly legal. That why even professional legal opinions (let alone Billy Bobs) are worthless until such time the documents are studied and the states laws researched........

best wishes

John T
 
I suspect that things will end up just as the deceased intended.
I know of one will that was declared not valid because one of the two witnesses had died first and the other did not recall having been a witness. But the laws of intestacy made things end up about the same. What is being done now in my area is a "self-proving" will. Drawn up, signed and witnessed plus witnessed by a notary- then sealed in an envelope and deposited unopened with the clerk of court. Was present when one such was was removed from the vault after the death of the person and opened by the clerk. Compared it to the copy that the family had. He declared it valid at that moment. Some states allow "collection by affidavit" for certain estates. Faster, cheaper settlement for those that qualify.
 
Hmmm.....family money being claimed.
I have a SIL that called her grandfather (who was not dead yet) and asked for "her" money. The grandfather was 91 at the time. The nerve of some people is amazing.
She didnt get the money. The grandfather died 2 years ago. (my wife might get $10k some day, but I doubt it.) SIL may also get 10k some day.
 
EVERY Will I prepare for a client I make self proven and consider it malpractice if not prepared that way (although still legal and valid), but thats just the way I do things and my opinion. In our jurisdiction there are provisions for small estate distribution by affidavit absent full blown probate. Different states have different probate provisions although some of the basics are pretty well uniform. Theres obviously a lot of mis information and old wives tales run amok out there lol

take care good driver man

John T
 
Update she mailed off their checks today her lawyer had a long talk with the one that was causing all the trouble pretty well impeached his character when it was heard that she to care of him for so many years without their help his claim against the estate crumbled like a house of cards.
 

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