Draft Horse related question

Hogleg · Jan 8, 2013

I have a large paint horse (around 15 hands) that is a cross between a paint stud and a belgian draft mare. She was trained to pull, I am told. We have improvised rigging and she has pulled some christmas trees for us out of the woods. The way she is rigged in the pic by my daughter is dangerous, I feel. The mare doesn't seem to care, though.

I was looking on ebay for a draft harness, but realized I don't know the first thing about them. What would be a good harness to use to allow her to drag some small logs, etc for us. Can the same harness be used for a buckboard or some other small wagon?

Lastly, where can I find some good new or used harnesses that don't cost an arm and a leg?

John (who uses tractors to cut hay for these hay burners)

Gary from Muleshoe · Jan 8, 2013

Don"t what part of the country you are in, but if you can get in touch with some Amish or Mennonite people they will fix you right up. Most likely teach you all you need to know about harness as well. The ones I know are eager to share their knowledge.

Gary from Muleshoe · Jan 8, 2013

Ooops "Don"t know what part of the country you are in"

McBride · Jan 8, 2013

Looks like the "Land of Lincoln" to me.

Hogleg · Jan 8, 2013

Yep, Salem, Illinois. Bout 60 mi east of St. Louis.

But I know where Muleshoe is. Been thru there once. Used to live in Austin from 1982 to 2007 when we moved up here. Austin was getting way too full of people and the land prices were out of sight. We always wanted to live on a farm and have crittters so we bought a 40 acre parcel and build a house. Now have horses, cattle, sheep, chickens, a few dogs and a zillion cats (they just keep showing up!). ALso moved here to be closer to my aging mom.

A transplanted city boy that rolled 125 large round bales this last year. Learning a lot!

John

McBride · Jan 8, 2013

If you get to Arcola, Arthur, Sullivan or Tuscola, Illinois have a chat with some Amish folks like Gary suggested.

Wheat Farmer · Jan 8, 2013

Wished you were closer. I have several hanging in a barn West of Denver. I'm sure they are dry, and maybe not good anymore.

jhilyer · Jan 8, 2013

Your setup looks....ok, as long as most of the 'pulling' was being done by the horse 'pushing' with her shoulders, not because of that rope behind her front legs, around her belly. Make sure she's not doing the pulling with that belly rope.

Most harness will really be two parts:
The collar, which goes around the neck and sits against the shoulders; this is where she will 'push' into to the...

...harness, which attaches to the collar and translates the 'push' into the 'pull'. There are two main types, a 'plow' harness that will pull only, and a 'britchen' harness which, when used correctly, will allow the horse to back-up a cart because the britchen is strapping around the rear end of your horse, and when she backs up, she is pushing into it, if you will. For now, just know that it's the britchen type you want! britchen harness works for anything. Plow harness is simpler and can only pull, no britchen straps.

So you need collar + britchen harness for a single horse. You'll have to measure the neck to size the collar. Like someone else said, find your local Amish. There will be a collar maker and a harness maker. Where I am, these are separate Amish businesses.

Get "The Work Horse Handbook" by Lynn Miller! It's the reference on the subject. Lynn Miller writes the Small Farmer's Journal.

Hogleg · Jan 8, 2013

Thanks jhilyer,

Yes, she used a padded girth across the front of the chest, using some other saddle stuff to improvise a collar. The ropes you see on the belly were just there to steady the ropes going back to not let them drop too far. You know, she was one of those girls that had Breyer horses as a kid. She is 16 now and I think she studied one of the toy harnesses to invent this. Pretty smart kid.

Thanks for the info, that fills in a lot of blanks. We have some Amish here in town that I will talk to.

Will take a look at the book also.

On edit - Small Farm Journal still sells the second edition of the book. On order. thx again!

John

jhilyer · Jan 8, 2013

Oh wait...Just re-read that YOUR DAUGHTER came up with the rigging...in that case, quite impressive!

When you look at harness, don't be a traditionalist...don't go with leather. Too heavy and not easy to take care of.

My harness is nylon, lightweight and easy to clean with a pressure washer.

Another popular option is 'biothane', or 'bio' for short, it's basically nylon with a plastic coating. You've probably seen it - there are dog collars, etc, made from it. I don't like the feel of it - seems too stiff. but lots of people use it.

jackinok · Jan 8, 2013

several places its possible to injure your horse with that setup. neck / shoulders need a collar, backstrap shouldnt hold a load at all. one thing you do NOT want to do is injure your horse. Pretty inventive of your daughter to come up with this, but until you get a harness, youll be much better off/ safer pulling from a saddle horn! Just my opinion of course but even the very best horse can spook, when he does with that rig, youve got the potential for a heck of a wreck. First thing to do, get your daughter out from in front of him, thats the absolute very worst place you can be when driving a horse!if the horse gets in a bind he WONT go backwards you can bet on that. One other thing, even though this tree is small, that is THE single most dangerous thing you can do with a team or a single horse simply because the tree wont neccesarily stay behind a horse.And when it doesnt youve got problems. back in the day we only used the steadiest of teams for hauling logs and such. dont know where you are but ive got some old harness here thats been laying around for years. probably not much good but it would be better than that. i would strongly suggest you put off your training till you find a proper collar and harness, even if its a lightweight driving harness. just my opinion of course. i applaud her for being interested , not many kids are these days.

Dick L · Jan 8, 2013

Have her watch the video on harness. It gives some good detail on harnesing.

He rig looks like it would be fine for light horse training.
Here

Dick L · Jan 8, 2013

If you just type in (Neil Dimmock harness) all three videos are in order to get the full show.

Hogleg · Jan 8, 2013

I fully agree, Jack. That is why I asked. This is working but I am not happy that it is safe. Sounds like you agree. Since she wants to continue to use the horse for this sort of stuff, I want to outfit the mare correctly so it is save and not injurious.

Thanks for the info and observations.

John

Hogleg · Jan 8, 2013

Thanks Dick! Excellent video. Sounds like the collar is as important on fit as it is to wear the correct shoe size for us! I will have her watch the videos and we can then start looking for a good rig that fits properly.

John

jackinok · Jan 8, 2013

you can build a very servicable lightweight harmess for about $50 or less. simply buy a tie down strap of the type truckers use. its wide enough it wont injure your horse,and long enough you can make a full harness out of one. to put loops and things where you need them ,simply heat up a nail and poke holes ,use a rivet gun with washers on them to tie it together. THE very first thing before you start, Warn your daughter to never ever under ANY circumstance wrap the reins around her hand. IF you do its VERY likely you wont get loose in case of a problem. if your to the side and cant get loose your going under either the horse,or the load.if your behind and have a run away, your liable to get dragged to death. I dont know how many folks here have ever seen a actual runaway, but it tends to get worse and worse as it goes along until something breaks or the horses give out. you REALLY dont want to be in the middle of it with no way out. i like horses as well as the next guy,worked them as a kid and i love to see them work, but they are animals and they sometimes do things where and when they decide to. when they actually panic,in a real runaway, you have a very real problem.

EJ70 · Jan 8, 2013

The fact that she reasearched and then made the effort to put something together is quite impressive. Great to see that kind of enegry in young folks. I wont be labor what others have said already. Working horses can be alot of fun. The bond between you and the horse can become very strong. Key is to enter into it armed with some knowledge, research, and guidance.For what you described you can get a general purpose collar without the sweat gaurd.Collar fit is critical. I always trailer my drafts to the harness maker I use and have him measure for the collar and fit a new harness. My harnesses are Biothane. The last one I bought was for a large draft and cost around $500. I was used one day during a progress days event. As was suggested try to get with somebody that is already working horses. Those I know love to talk and help others. Dont buy your first harness somewhere like Ebay. Get with a harness maker. The maker I use is Abner Esh (717) 687-5122. He is in Lancaster Co. PA, far away form you I know but he is honest and will anwser any questions you have. Ask him to send you a catalog. If nothing else you can use it to comparison shop.

Mo in NE Tx · Jan 8, 2013

All you needis a collar that fits with hames, trace cahins, back band, belly strap and a single tree. You can also use a good wide breast band instead of collar and hames. Plain ole plow harness. Use the KISS principle. A pair of good lines (reins) are good to have also.

jhilyer · Jan 8, 2013

Have to disagree with the plow harness. Fine for draggin, but eventually she'll want to graduate to a wheeled cart, and a plow harness won't work for that, so you'd have to buy another harness.

Get a britchen harness now and you won't have a problem.

Also, dragging something -is- the best way to practice & learn, in my opinion. So she's starting right. Wheeled vehicles can get to fast too quick for the novice driver.

muleboss · Jan 8, 2013

One with a breast collor will work just a good if you are not going to be doing heavy work. A lot less expensive also. Will also work will with a cart.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 8, 2013

e-mail me for good reasonable harness source near Illinois [email protected]

Bret4207 · Jan 9, 2013

I suggest, extremely strongly suggest, you go to a draft related site and get some information there. Rural Heritage magazine has a decent forum populated by draft horse and oxen people. There may well be someone near you that can show you the ropes. You Tube is no substitute for actual hands on work.

A decent collar properly fitted with properly fitted and shaped hames and an inexpensive (relatively anyway) nylon harness is the way to go. Just remember that a horse can exert something like 120% of high body weight in effort for short periods of time. Cheap hitch gear, make do harness, old dry rotted leather and inexperienced teamsters are a bad combo.

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