Would you tell the prospective purchaser of your house that the field owner across the road has approval and will definitely put up three wind turbines? This usually results in adversely affecting property values. I said if I was the real estate agent, I would tell them. My inlaws called me every name in the book and said they would never hire me if I did. Just trying to be honest and fair with the new purchasers......and maybe, they don"t really care. The inlaws said legally that you don"t need to; but, I said ethically and morally that you should. Am I wrong?
- Thread starter BrianRBM
- Start date
BillyinStoughton
Member
I"m with you. I"m not sure I could sleep at night if I didn"t. If the energy companies were only "prospecting" the adjacent property...that would be one thing, but if it"s a sure bet I personally would want to disclose that. I"m afraid it boils down to personal ethics. And everyone has a different set of those.
I worked on wind turbines for 9 years (GE and Enron units). While it is true that after a while they become "white noise" to most people, I"ve also heard people say it"s ruined their life and the sky is falling.
Everyone wants green energy, just not in their backyard.
Good luck wrestling with your conscience on this one. I don"t envy you.
I worked on wind turbines for 9 years (GE and Enron units). While it is true that after a while they become "white noise" to most people, I"ve also heard people say it"s ruined their life and the sky is falling.
Everyone wants green energy, just not in their backyard.
Good luck wrestling with your conscience on this one. I don"t envy you.
Sean Feeney
Well-known Member
http://shaffermountain.com/wthpv.php
I don't think its buyer beware!
realtor obligated to disclose
http://www.realestatebuyersagents.com/duties.htm
I don't think its buyer beware!
realtor obligated to disclose
http://www.realestatebuyersagents.com/duties.htm
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Funniest dam thing--never seen anybody Gettin PAID for having one on their property have ANY Ill effects. It is always The lefty yuppie neighbor Lookin for Something for nothing doing the Complaining.
If you knowingly hide some thing that will adversely effect the value of a house then you CAN be libel. It is just like knowing your well goes dry in the middle of the summer.
As for what they do to the home values. My BIL has a home that they put wind mills up around him. It has made his life a living hell. First any wild life that was around his home is gone. The wind mills are not silent like they advertise. He even has very few birds at his bird feeders anymore. Plus you can't set on the back porch if there is any wind at all. The wind mills make kind of a whoop, whoop noise. So you take ten of them with in a half mile and it is annoying.
Then the best part. His home was a major part of his financial retirement plans. He has a very nice large house that they had a need for when their kids where home. It sets on a ten acre tract of land. Very pretty valley. He actually bought it off of a farmer so that the farmer had all of the tillable land and he had the rough land. Which was great for a house and yard. Ten years ago it was valued at over $500K. Even with the down turn it should be worth 350-400. They put the wind mills in 6 years ago. He is down to trying to get $250K out of it and has had ZERO offers after they come out and see/hear the wind mills. He gets people calling all hot to trot about it. He now just tells them right then that there are wind mills around his home. Very few even come out to look after that.
So I would tell them but hope to have it sold before the wind mills are up. Even if you have to auction it off I would have it gone before the wind mills are put up.
As for what they do to the home values. My BIL has a home that they put wind mills up around him. It has made his life a living hell. First any wild life that was around his home is gone. The wind mills are not silent like they advertise. He even has very few birds at his bird feeders anymore. Plus you can't set on the back porch if there is any wind at all. The wind mills make kind of a whoop, whoop noise. So you take ten of them with in a half mile and it is annoying.
Then the best part. His home was a major part of his financial retirement plans. He has a very nice large house that they had a need for when their kids where home. It sets on a ten acre tract of land. Very pretty valley. He actually bought it off of a farmer so that the farmer had all of the tillable land and he had the rough land. Which was great for a house and yard. Ten years ago it was valued at over $500K. Even with the down turn it should be worth 350-400. They put the wind mills in 6 years ago. He is down to trying to get $250K out of it and has had ZERO offers after they come out and see/hear the wind mills. He gets people calling all hot to trot about it. He now just tells them right then that there are wind mills around his home. Very few even come out to look after that.
So I would tell them but hope to have it sold before the wind mills are up. Even if you have to auction it off I would have it gone before the wind mills are put up.
Oliver 1655: If you do some thing that effects the value of my property then why would that make me a "lefty yuppie neighbor Lookin for Something for nothing" ????
Have you ever lived around any of these new big wind mills??? I mean right out your door, not a mile away??? They are far from being quite.
As for the guy getting paid not complaining. He is getting compensated for any ill effects.
I dislike them on many levels. The main one is that they are the most expensive way to produce electric we have. They are only being built because the owners are sucking up tax payer dollars to have them. The second reason it that they are UGLY!!!! They ruin the view and peace/quiet for the whole area.
If they want to built them they should have to pay everyone living within eye site. Not just the guy's land it sets on.
Have you ever lived around any of these new big wind mills??? I mean right out your door, not a mile away??? They are far from being quite.
As for the guy getting paid not complaining. He is getting compensated for any ill effects.
I dislike them on many levels. The main one is that they are the most expensive way to produce electric we have. They are only being built because the owners are sucking up tax payer dollars to have them. The second reason it that they are UGLY!!!! They ruin the view and peace/quiet for the whole area.
If they want to built them they should have to pay everyone living within eye site. Not just the guy's land it sets on.
rustyfarmall
Well-known Member
Anyone who thinks those wind turnines are not a problem just needs to head North out of Corning, Iowa, on highway 148 right on up to Massena, Iowa. There are literally hundreds of those turbines packed into only a few acres, to the point the turbine blades are so close to each other that it creates one heck of a strobe effect and it makes me very naseous and creates a headache that will not go away. They are on both sides of the road, and the only way to NOT see them is to close your eyes. Most definitely NOT a good idea when you are the one who is driving.
there was a small turbine about 3 blocks away from my parents house in Galveston,Tx...when the gulf breezes were kickin it sounded like a Huey hoverin...i can imagine what one of those big turbines sound like...no green wienie here,but if somebody puts one in my back yard,it will be used for target practice.
I think I lucked out, there was going to be three of them about3/4 of a mile west of me. Got a big map from the zoning dept. that showed the location of about 25 or 30 of them to be built to the southwest. The neighbors of the wind farm raised hell for about three years, meetings, lawyers and the wind folks moved on.
There's another bigger wind farm 10 miles to the west and I haven't heard a word good or bad about that
There's another bigger wind farm 10 miles to the west and I haven't heard a word good or bad about that
good post. Here in Michigan, there is a ballot proposal to change the State Constitution to require 25% of electricity to be renewable by 2025. Most asinine thing that a tree-hugger ever came up with. The "pro" groups (mostly windmill mfrs) tout that it will create 94,000 jobs. Well guess who would be paying the wages of those new jobs in Michigan? Not the utilities. They'll just pass it on to the consumers, meaning higher rates to pay for a more inefficient means to generate electricity. The ONLY way renewable makes economic sense is with tax subsidies, meaning you and I are paying for it.
I think that every person in favor of a windmill should have one across the street from their house.
I think that every person in favor of a windmill should have one across the street from their house.
farmerjohn
Well-known Member
Nothing is "for sure" until it actually happens but probably should be disclosed.
The tree huggers have done a very good job to make people believe that windmills are an answer to our energy problem and save money. Why would any businessman invest insomething that has a 50 year payback and a 20 year lifespan? Other than they are getting paid our tax dollars to build them and they solve nothing. An electric engineer told me that to replace ONE power plant it would take a wind farm one mile wide and the whole way across the country to make the same energy, and that is IF it runs 24/7 which windmills only run maybe 30% of the time.
The tree huggers have done a very good job to make people believe that windmills are an answer to our energy problem and save money. Why would any businessman invest insomething that has a 50 year payback and a 20 year lifespan? Other than they are getting paid our tax dollars to build them and they solve nothing. An electric engineer told me that to replace ONE power plant it would take a wind farm one mile wide and the whole way across the country to make the same energy, and that is IF it runs 24/7 which windmills only run maybe 30% of the time.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
I Rest My CASE!!
gtractorfan
Well-known Member
I wonder what's going to happen to all the emphasis on "green" energy if our country comes under new management.
JOHNNYfromMI
Member
Windmills and solar panels are great for making electricty....If your happy with the power on only when the sun is shinning or the wind is blowing. Those still winter nights = no power.
I think it is up to the buyer to try and discover what the surrounding properties are zoned for and could potentially be used for or have constructed on them. I suppose if they specifically ask you, you are obligated to tell what you know but if they do not ask I do not think you are obligated to inform them of anything that may or may not happen for all you know.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
I say burn that clean coal
I had an easement from a company out of Florida to build one on some of my land. No neighbor households for miles around but that was besides the point. Everybody and his neighbor was trying to get in on the deal. I got paid $1000 for signing the lease easement and $1000 a year for 4 years. This year they did not renew the lease. They said times were to unstable to continue with the project. Mainly, they had been counting on a new coal power plant being built not to far from where they were buying up the leases and then they would have tied into their main line into MN. to get rid of the power. When the coal plant didn't go through, they lost interest with no lines to move the power.
Where I have been working the last 3 years you can see I-29. Every morning there are 3-6 trucks going south with blades on them. Each one has a chase car behind and one in front. In the evenings, you would see 3 of them going north. Don't understand why they don't get them moved around without having to cross back and forth.
Where I have been working the last 3 years you can see I-29. Every morning there are 3-6 trucks going south with blades on them. Each one has a chase car behind and one in front. In the evenings, you would see 3 of them going north. Don't understand why they don't get them moved around without having to cross back and forth.
Morals and ethics have a way of changing when large amounts of money are involved.
I'm curious: are you a seller working with a realitor to sell you property; or are you a buyer who has recently purchased the property without knowledge of the turbines? Either way you need to consult with a lawyer in you you area to really learn what your responsibility and libility is. Once payment and posession of the property have already taken place there probably isn't much that can be done about it.
To me the damage to property values was inflicted by the neighbor, not by the seller. Are the turbine approvals and building permits are public knowledge and are available through local government offices? If the seller has not been involved in any activity in favor of the turbines and if the seller has not benefited from the turbines, I would not disclose it to the buyer unless the buyer was a good friend or relative. It's not the nicest answer, but it is realistic.
I'm curious: are you a seller working with a realitor to sell you property; or are you a buyer who has recently purchased the property without knowledge of the turbines? Either way you need to consult with a lawyer in you you area to really learn what your responsibility and libility is. Once payment and posession of the property have already taken place there probably isn't much that can be done about it.
To me the damage to property values was inflicted by the neighbor, not by the seller. Are the turbine approvals and building permits are public knowledge and are available through local government offices? If the seller has not been involved in any activity in favor of the turbines and if the seller has not benefited from the turbines, I would not disclose it to the buyer unless the buyer was a good friend or relative. It's not the nicest answer, but it is realistic.
> First any wild life that was around his home is gone. The wind mills are not silent like they advertise.
If that's all it takes to get rid of the deer/coyote/racoon/opossum menace, sign me up
As an added bonus it will get rid of the city hunters and the mcmansions?
Sounds too good to be true, if you ask me.
If that's all it takes to get rid of the deer/coyote/racoon/opossum menace, sign me up
As an added bonus it will get rid of the city hunters and the mcmansions?
Sounds too good to be true, if you ask me.
farmer boy
Well-known Member
We have windmills not too far from here (1/2 hour) and the only ones complaining are the ones that don't have them. I don't know what the rules are there but here they're not allowed to be right out your door. They have to be a 1/3 mile away minimum from a owner that is not participating. I can't really see them affecting farm land value too much. They provide a fair bit of supplemental income so if you don't want them affecting YOUR land value, get one or a few. Windmills are actually one of the more cost effective green energies out there. Ontario has a green energy program called FIT and MicroFIT. The FIT programs pay out $0.443-$0.802/kwh for solar power $0.185 for farm biogas, $0.122 for hydro, and $0.135 for wind. These prices are all based on what it costs to buy, run, maintain, finance, and profit, so they are a good indication of the true costs of green energy.
Kenneth R Ohnstad
Member
NO
k
k
Kenneth R Ohnstad
Member
Ted Kennedy didn't want one six miles out in the Atlantic from Martha's Vineyard.
Oldtractorfun
Member
Yep wise goverment of Ontario willing to pay out close to 10 times more for power then what they sell it to customers for. Had a few solar farms pop up in the area in last couple of years. Wish I would have had the money to invest in one, all money in the bank.
As for wind power I watched a show on that a few nights ago where one farmer wanted them, along with a few others on township council. Big debate about it, long story short whole council voted out ones against wind voted in.
Solar, wind, whatever is useless. For what power it takes and it costs to make the cement base, the towers themselfs, trucking the parts, making the roads to get in with the parts makes just as much green house gasses as a coal plant, no savings to mother earth. Also does seem to be a good chance there are long term health effects with wind farms.
As for wind power I watched a show on that a few nights ago where one farmer wanted them, along with a few others on township council. Big debate about it, long story short whole council voted out ones against wind voted in.
Solar, wind, whatever is useless. For what power it takes and it costs to make the cement base, the towers themselfs, trucking the parts, making the roads to get in with the parts makes just as much green house gasses as a coal plant, no savings to mother earth. Also does seem to be a good chance there are long term health effects with wind farms.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The old bat says that it's just me............... Now I got her...
Just gotta have tunnelvision when passing them....
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
You can go online here and pick your power source and pay accordingly... A real joke... Good joke for the ones choosing green and a bad one for everyone else including themselves... Just that with that green skin, comes the stupidity that won't let them see that they are just paying more at the other end (taxes).....
Here in our county in western Washington, we were informed by our power supplier that the rates went up because we have to have 10% "green" power. But here's the kicker- we get virtually all our power from hydro (dams), but they aren't considered "green"! How ridiculous is that? Its the most renewable source in the world- works 24/7/365, and nobody has to do anything but maintain the turbines.
The only saving grace to the situation is that our power is so cheap that paying a little more for 10% foofy power hardly makes a difference.
The only saving grace to the situation is that our power is so cheap that paying a little more for 10% foofy power hardly makes a difference.
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
You are legally required to disclose any defects with your home of which you are aware. I think that extends to the property, so if, for example, you had a toxic waste dump in your back yard you'd have to disclose that.
Now a wind farm is a slightly different deal. One could argue that it's not a defect with the house or property, and that it will not affect the property value. However, if the buyer chooses to sue you, you might not prevail in court. At the least you would have some significant legal bills.
Are your in-laws saying there's no legal requirement to disclose based on the opinion of a real estate attorney? Or are they pulling their legal opinion out of their a***s? You might want to pay a lawyer for a half hour of his time in order to avoid spending a day in court. If they don't want to consult with an attorney, then it's because they already know the answer and don't want to hear it.
Now a wind farm is a slightly different deal. One could argue that it's not a defect with the house or property, and that it will not affect the property value. However, if the buyer chooses to sue you, you might not prevail in court. At the least you would have some significant legal bills.
Are your in-laws saying there's no legal requirement to disclose based on the opinion of a real estate attorney? Or are they pulling their legal opinion out of their a***s? You might want to pay a lawyer for a half hour of his time in order to avoid spending a day in court. If they don't want to consult with an attorney, then it's because they already know the answer and don't want to hear it.
Ralph Bauer
Well-known Member
Just guessing they pick up blades from the same (different stage of project) wind farm or another wind farm "close by" and haul them back for maintenance. Or, they haul them one way to a plant for further(pre-installment)work. Here in far SW OK, they go south from the plant to the paint shop and come back about a week later)....in addition to the finished ones going straight to the farm for installing.
Ralph in OK.
Ralph in OK.
Ralph Bauer
Well-known Member
Then capitalism will let the market forces play and everything will be PAINTED GREEN, of course with lead heavy stuff from China, its cheaper and the medical field is pulled out of their dire low income situation as well!!! .... LOL
Sarcastic Ralph in OK.
Sarcastic Ralph in OK.
I bought my place in 2003 and the wind towers came through in 2010. If I had known they were coming through I wouldn't have bought my place. Didn't know they were coming till 2007. "They" only got half the project done in 2010. All the leases that were signed in 2007 expire in December and no one is renewing for the second half of the project. Those towers are noisy and the companies destroy the roads and fields while constructing. It was a bad deal around here in 2010. The landowners that did get towers are regretting it now and would take it back if they could.
Casey in SD
Casey in SD
Our County just passed an ordinance that required a 1500' setback for homes and wind towers. If at a later date you want to build ON YOUR OWN PROPERTY you would be required to sign a liability waiver that released the wind farm operators from any future liability. Think they're getting any flack? DeKalb county IN.
Depending on your state laws you have to disclose known issues that property value. We did look at a house just outside of town before we bought this one. The seller had to disclose that the new 4 lane by-pass was being built about 1/4 of a mile away with an overpass.
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