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Feed store rip off

3

37chief

Well-known Member
Location
California
My daughter keeps her horses at my place. I usually feed them. I notice the bale weight varries from each load the feed store delivers. but the price stays the same at 19.75 per bale for grass hay. We usually get 10 or so bales at a time. With the price for hay so high it would be better to pay by the weight. I realize this will be almost impossible. Do any feed stores around your areas sell by the weight rather than price per bale for small amounts? Stan
 
Not around here. Feed stores are generally the spendiest place to buy hay, but I can understand it. I really don`t like dealing with a lot of the 2-10 bale purchases, they whine and haggle worse than most of the bigger buyers. Not saying this is the case with you, of course.
 
19.75 for a small square bale?!!!! I need to get into this market. That's $40000 for 2000 bales. I'd say forget about the fact that they don't charge on weight. That's very minimal compared to the 19.75 they charge for a bale.
 
I pay 3to4 bucks for grass hay here, feed store gets 5.00.Bales weigh 40 to 50 pounds.Find another place to buy hay.Always buy from the fellow who put up the hay.I used to buy hay for 50 cents,no more.I can buy a big round bale fo 25 bucks here.
 

My friends who run a general ag supply business and sell hay to both feed stores and the public, occasionally run an inbound load over a scale and divide by the number of bales on the truck. They then post the average weight and price on a chalk board in the office. As hard as I try to keep my bales uniform, the difference in moisture in different parts of a field have a big effect on weight of bale. I routinely rake different parts of fields separately in order to have some effect on windrow size.
 
where do you live? Thats really high I know the agway in town here in nj gets 8 per small bale,never heard of a price as high as your paying check around see if you can find a local farmer in your area
 
Shoot the horses and cut your loses. If you are feeding them it sounds like she is not coming around much either to ride them.
 
wow,how would a dad explain that to his daughter? Thats taking tough love to an extreme, having only one child which is a girl,I cant imagine you really mean that, or you dont have any children
 
Here, I'm lucky if I can even sell it for $1.50-$1.75 a bale, picked up after I bale it. Most times I just bush hog the hay(Timothy, fescue and orchard grass) because of no one wanting to buy it.
One year after cutting and baling, I had no buyers. So, I offered it for free just to get it out of the fields. They were lined up down the road with trucks and trailers. That was the last year I did that.
 
They buy it by the ton and theres no way it is 19.75 a bale. They are marking it up at least 4 times what they paid but if ya want horses ya gots to pay da price. People should understand the problem before getting the horse but they just dont. Buy the hay by the ton in season then you will get a better price. Feed store has to pay then store then market having a shed to store costs money taxes labor ect. Hey build a big shed and get into the market for yourself.
 
The circus come to town years ago and moved in across the street on a vacant area. I had a business that dealt with a lot of farmers. The guy come over and wanted to know if I knew where he could buy some hay for the animals. I made a phone call to a farmer I knew and the hay was delivered. The circus fellow come back in before leaving town and said that was the best and the cheapest hay he had bought in a long time.
 
(quoted from post at 13:44:32 01/29/12) wow,how would a dad explain that to his daughter? Thats taking tough love to an extreme, having only one child which is a girl,I cant imagine you really mean that, or you dont have any children
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If he was serious, he wouldn't have posted as a guest...
 
Just attended a BLM wild horse and burro sale. They were feeding the best alfalfa I have ever seen. $32.00/bale. That's not a typo.

Guy said they had 30,000 horses for adoption. Figure up that feed bill for hay alone.
 
Not as drastic, but same around here also... Just takes a couple idiots with too much money to drive prices if you have a crooked salesman/business.......
Bash away boys and girls......That's the only two reasons for 20 buck bales unless local farmers are selling them for that......

Reminds me about one of Jerry Clower's stories about a preacher sellin a guy a horse blanket.....
 
Lot's of unanswered questions here. You stated 10 bales delivered. How far? They have to pay expenses on a delivery truck. Probably has to pay someone to load, and unload and probably carry into barn. Yes it does seem a little high, but have done similar delivery's myself before and is not always easy and time consuming. You could probably cut expenses a little by taking a larger amount at a time or by picking it up yourself.
 
Guess they figure horse owners are suckers and complain alot so the high price, probably selling it to cow owners for $5 bale.Guy I know sells hay the only difference between 'horse hay' and any other is the price he says if they pay more they think they're getting better hay.
 
Chief, I don't think everybody knows you're in southern California. Any hay you're getting is coming from a pretty fair distance.

If you have room to store a truckload of hay, you might consider bringing in a load and reselling what you don't need. At those prices, I'd say there's a profit to be made.
 
(quoted from post at 07:24:50 01/29/12) Lot's of unanswered questions here. You stated 10 bales delivered. How far? They have to pay expenses on a delivery truck. Probably has to pay someone to load, and unload and probably carry into barn. Yes it does seem a little high, but have done similar delivery's myself before and is not always easy and time consuming. You could probably cut expenses a little by taking a larger amount at a time or by picking it up yourself.
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Missed that piece..... Ask what the pickup price is, then call them a crook or not....
 
hi..

Have you checked to see what they charge if you pick the up at the store?
The difference is going to be what they're charging for their overhead ... an extra hired hand to deliver... keeping a truck around for small deliveries... fuel.

Really sounds like they're trying to reduce how much of this kind of business they're doing... or make it worthwhile to cover the overhead.
 
(quoted from post at 07:33:58 01/29/12) Guess they figure horse owners are suckers and complain alot so the high price, probably selling it to cow owners for $5 bale.Guy I know sells hay the only difference between 'horse hay' and any other is the price he says if they pay more they think they're getting better hay.
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My point about crooks exactly....... Sounds like he's proud of his character too......
 
So tell me Dave, how much do you charge for a puppy? I'm thinking your price is a lot more than it costs you in dog food to feed the mother. Does that make you a crook or a good business man? Charge what the market will bear, nothing wrong with that.
 
wow.. Im 40 years old and need to lose some weight. I could sell the stock cows, make about 12k small bales of hay...id even knock it down to $15 a bale...180k and I have a healthy heart...and probably something for the kids to do..
 
Why would you buy hay from a feed store anyhow?Look in your local paper,place a wanted add,look in local free papers,flyers etc.
 
Sounds like it's the delivery that is killing you.

Plus they figure horse folks can afford it.

I have a brother in law from the city. My niece wanted a horse. I would guess they have spent $25,000 to date to feed, board, and care for a horse that most farmers would call a plug.

Around here you couldn't give horses away for a time.

Most folks sell good, wire tied, mixed grass hay around here for $4.00 a bale, picked up at the barn.

I have been saying for a long time I need to tune up that old John Deere square baler I have setting in the shed.

Gene
 
That is some spendy horse hay... Hope the horses don"t drink bottled water from the convenience store to boot.!! Dern near the same ball park??

Curious as to how much hay that feed store sells, and to whom? Wonder where the hay is comming from also?
 
Wow that is expensive! Are u talking about a small square bale? Around here I get 3.00 per small square, and 1.75 for mulch bales
 
$19.75 for a bale? Should be around $3-$4, maybe a LITTLE bit more for real good quality. You need to seriously evaluate your hay buying if you're paying that much. The feed store is probably buying that hay for $3 a bale from one of your neighbours, who you could get it from directly.
 
That is a good amount to be paying for hay.You didn't say if it was grass or alfalfa,but let's say it is alfalfa.Real good alfalfa will run 200-250/ton at the barn.Delivery will run 3-4 dollars/mile with say 650 bales/load at legal ht.You then have 3 people unload at 12.00/hr and it takes 1 1/2 hrs to unload truck and stack,that's if the driver helps which is not always case. That is 54.00 for labor. So you haul it 1000 mi-thats 3500.00.You have 21.1 ton on at 65 lbs/bale.Now you have 13.58/bale in load. So just take a guess what his overhead is with help to deliver,truck that gets 10mi/gal.-gas at 3.50/gal taxes and interest on money.If anybody wants to jump in to starting a feed store in Cal. have at it.I know my figures might be off but you can change them around and the risk is still there.Been raising hay and straw plus buying & selling it for 25 yrs and it is not easy. If you think it is easy get the check book out. I better go move some snow so I can load in morning.Thank you for your patience for the long post.
 
I'm not real sympathetic to owning horses as I really don't understand what they are good for.
Yeah, yeah, they're your pets.
My little dog costs me about $125 a year for dog food. If I found that to be a big financial burden I would get rid of the dog. But I sure wouldn't go around complaining about the cost of feeding it. Nor would I complain that one brand of dog food cost more than another brand.
 
I know everyone needs to make a profit. The delivery proce for the hay is around 8.00 for the load,which isn't too bad. The bales weigh around 80-110 lbs
 
When the girls were in 4H we were feeding two horses, a donkey, and a couple steers. I would buy a truck, and trailer and stack it. The neighbors usually got 1/2 of the load. Then there was the problem keeping it covered. Might look into buying just 1/2 of a load again. Good idea. Yea I do live in Southern calif. Stan
 
you cant be seriuos 19.75 for a small square bale of hay.i wouldnt have the guts to even post that on here.that is unheard of.unbelieveable.
RICK
 
32.00 a bale we are getting off easy at 19.75. We bought a BLM burro years ago. A few months later we had two. The burro had a baby. A baby buro is just about the cutest critter. We had to bottle feed it as the mother would have nothing to do with it. Stan
 
I think I would find a different place to get hay from. I get $3.50 per bale and they are around 35-40lbs each but that price it do right rip off big time. I get $50 for my heavy big rounds that are 5.5X5.5. Doing it that way I might break even over a year which is all I can hope for. I would be checking Criag's list and other such places for hay. Of course if your in an area that was dry this past summer ya I can maybe see it. Been getting calls for OK for my hay and I think that is almost crazy
 
(quoted from post at 07:42:34 01/29/12) So tell me Dave, how much do you charge for a puppy? I'm thinking your price is a lot more than it costs you in dog food to feed the mother. Does that make you a crook or a good business man? Charge what the market will bear, nothing wrong with that.
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Let's just leave that one go... If you're thickheaded enough to throw it out as a comparison in the first place, you won't be smart enough to understand the answer.....
 
The feed store where I work sells by the bale. I think ours is around 7.50 a bale.

Please note I am a mechanic with forty years on the road. I am also a three year country boy. Still learning about this stuff. I am also an expert on where not to stand by a cow. They will lay you out.
 
Looking like a dog pile of comments. My question does the feed store give you a calender so you can see the phone number every day?

Better take the SUV out to the country and fill up the back with hay.
 
Man, that is an OUTRAGEOUS amount to pay for hay. I just bought 100 squares from my hay guy- his bales are always light (50-60lbs) but since he charges by the ton I don"t mind (the girls can handle smaller bales easier. Worked out to $4.26 a bale, delivered, conveyored into the loft and stacked. I also gotsome 6x6 horse quality rounds for $25- not sure what those weight in at.
 
I'm assuming you don't have a pickup. And I know you are in California, which is a further problem. But you're paying $19.75 a bale for grass, PLUS $8 a bale for hauling? There's gotta be a better way.

How about this: Do you know anybody with a pickup? Assuming you do, get on Craigslist, or find a newspaper in the library for farming country withing 50 or 100 miles, and see if you can find a farm to buy hay from. Then borrow the pickup, take daughter and a friend to be the hay crew, and load it up. Should be able to get 40 bales on a pickup without pushing it. And can store outside (with a blue tarp) in sunny southern Cal.
 
Chief........when you go to the grocery store for can of soup, you pay by the can NOT by the BOX. Same with yer grass hay, 1-bale NOT trailer load. Same pricing dynamics. And NO, yer local feed store will NOT sell by weight even though they bought by trailer weight. Hay bale weight very just by the very dynamics of bailing. Then remember, most horsey people are wimmins that can't hardly throw a saddle blanket over the horsey back. I would bet that the feedstore has a contract with the hay guy that specifies 50# bales. (his major customers) There ain't many wimmins that can muscle 100# alfalfa bales. (alfalfa weighs more than grass) ........the hey Dell
 
Neighbor of ours was selling hay to some horse people, they'd come buy 3 or 4 times a week buy 2 or 3 bales and pay him ash. He finally got upset and told them he'd deliver them 40 bales, if they wanted they could come buy and pay him for 2 bales every other day. They got the hint and started buying their hay a pick up truck load at a time.
 
I have several ptrucks I can use, but It is worth 8.00 for me not to haul hay. I worked with Dad when he grew hay, and handeled enough bales to last me a lifetime. Dad grew oat hay. Seams not many people feed horses oat hay anymore. Stan
 
Its time to buy hay by the truck load and resell it.Cover it with blue tarps.Dosent have to be a semi trailer load.You can resell it to local people.Dont fuss over selling 3 or 4 bales, your buyers may be short of money.I buy hay for 3 bucks a bale 2 miles from home.One problem I see with hay sellers is that they are too numb to put out a sign that says hay for sale 3.00 a bale.Im down to one Hereford cow now so i dont need much hay.Dont listen to BS about store overhead,At 19.75 a bale they are stealing.
 
Dave2, I can sympathize with you about the crookedness of selling hay for two different prices, but if a horse lady does it to herself, am I crooked for selling her the same hay for a higher price? Last summer I had some hay for sale for $8 a bale (In Alaska, that is a good price). Several brainy ladys looked at it, said they would never feed that junk to their horse, how much for that better stuff in the other stack? Same hay, same field, baled the same day, but they will even offer $10 for the "good" stuff. Not my fault they are stupid, I have a living to make.
 
I charge 4.00/bale for alfalfa. $50.00 for delivery within ten miles. That is 50.00 if I deliver 1 bale or 200. Once had a horse lady have me deliver 4 bales two miles down the road. Total price---$66.00 for 4 bales. She paid it without hesitation. Had to stack it in a empty stall way in the back of the barn.
 
Im on the other side of this. Delivery of 10 bales, at least an hour to load, drive, unload, and get the driver back. Thats 60 bucks at least, maybe more depending on the truck at break even. Hay price is down in the 14's. If they pay 6, have 10 percent loss in storage, and make 100 percent retail markup which is not uncommon there's your hay price. Most places dont like to change pricing. People think its great when the price goes down but when it goes up look out.

Ive been adding 1 dollar a bale plus handling and trucking. Its not enough with loss. I wont be handling squares next year except on full truckload orders at cost plus pricing. Got 1 order of 40 left to deliver this week and baler and NH bale wago are both going up for sale. Been paying 4.00 for good alfalfa mix in season in lots of 500. Costs me 50 cents to get it in and stacked and driver charges me 1.25 a bale to load and haul up to 30 miles with a 100 bale minimum. Theres the pricing right there, with 10 bales, from me and Im too cheap, thats 12.50 a bale in freight plus the 5.50 for the hay.
 
(quoted from post at 16:26:55 01/29/12) Dave2, I can sympathize with you about the crookedness of selling hay for two different prices, but if a horse lady does it to herself, am I crooked for selling her the same hay for a higher price? Last summer I had some hay for sale for $8 a bale (In Alaska, that is a good price). Several brainy ladys looked at it, said they would never feed that junk to their horse, how much for that better stuff in the other stack? Same hay, same field, baled the same day, but they will even offer $10 for the "good" stuff. Not my fault they are stupid, I have a living to make.
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Whatever lets you sleep at night......
 
So what would you have done in the same situation? You seem like a pretty sharp cookie, lets hear your side of it. Should I turn them away with the reason of low IQ? Tell them the truth (not that I ever told an un-truth) and let them look like an idiot, get angry, AND I lose the sale?

I have no problem with you stirring up the hornets nest, but articulate some answers.
 
(quoted from post at 01:59:35 01/30/12) So what would you have done in the same situation? You seem like a pretty sharp cookie, lets hear your side of it. Should I turn them away with the reason of low IQ? Tell them the truth (not that I ever told an un-truth) and let them look like an idiot, get angry, AND I lose the sale?

I have no problem with you stirring up the hornets nest, but articulate some answers.
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Hard to tell..... Not trying to stir anything up at all... and it really is whatever lets you sleep.... You gotta know the situation and an honest person will do the right thing... Guess if they insisted on the other stuff and offered you the extra 2 bucks, booboo on them... If you said that it was extra knowing it's the same, then......
There's a difference between a living and a killing.... Covering all costs and making a profit is a living..doubling prices cause you see you're brother is in need is a killing.....

That's just me.......
 
Sounds pretty reasonable, thanks for exercising your people skills :wink:
I try to give everyone a fair deal, and around here prices on everything (fuel, equipment, land, parts) is much higher than in the states, so $8 is pretty fair. My neighbor was charging $14 a bale, the feed store is $16, so I come in pretty low. It does tend to pi$$ me off when silly people tell me I am trying to sell bad hay for horses because my price is as low as everyone elses cow hay, even when my hay is as good or better quality.
 
You see, that is how horse people think. If it costs more, it must be higher quality, or a better product, or better for the horse somehow. They will spend $20 on a fancy feed bucket when a $2 mop bucket is all they need.

Want to buy a horse cheap? Go to a horse auction wearing your old crappy barn clothes, and stand in the middle of a mud puddle. Make sure you get EVERYONE'S attention when you make the first bid $200-$300 over what the average first bid is. Everyone in their frilly coats and fancy boots tip-toeing around the above mentioned mud puddle will look at you, and none of them will bid against you.
 
i got into the mail order book business after I got a catalog from a dealer who had some very high prices on farming and back to basics books.A friend printed up lists for me after I bought books from dealers.I started with 50 books.I placed an add in two back to the land magazines.Business was good until 2000 when it slowed down.Every thing had gone up,Postage, advertizing, gasoline and the books.Im too old to handle a lot of hay now but would be in the hay business if I had your oppertunity.You dont need a big truck.Just buy A truck load and resell it.Keep a list of customers,call them when you get a load in.You have to advertize. some people dont have room to store a lot of hay so dont grumble about small buyers.
 
Have a neighbor who moved here a few years ago with 21 Arabian horses. Down to about 17 now....attrition. Keeps the stallions in a separate pen so no hankey pankey, ever! She never rides nor grooms them either. Calls them her babies. Hubby says that her feed bill is about the same as his mortgage and he bought 60 acres and a new house. Oh well, their money their business. Rounds down here are running $100+ for 4x5's and up. Haven't priced "delivered" squares lately and hers are delivered.

Dell, sometimes you have a way with words......and make a lot of sense. Grin

Mark
 
Unfortunately $19.75 a bale is the going rate here in CA. We are in northern CA in hay country. All baled hay here is 3 string, I don't know what you guys mean by small squares, our own hay is 2 wire maybe that is a small square.

No 1 alfalfa is $290- 300 per ton. This goes to dairies. No alfalfa is less than $230. All other kinds of hay follow closely, crappy grass is no less than $180.

We feed cows, we try to buy in 80 bale loads, about 5 tons. The last we bought was $240/ton weighed. It was mixed, some good alfalfa and some watergrass. We have not been able to find any, the word is they are sitting on it.

We found some yesterday direct from grower stored in stacks covered with tarps. He wanted $16/bale. It was grassy alfalfa, looked like a good grass with very little alfalfa. We didn't get a chance to try it. There must have been a hot bale, the hay caught fire 3 mi from home, burned up the hay and truck too.
 
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