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Tractor Transporting Discussion Forum

Another D.O.T nighmare

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larryanderson

05-05-2012 04:37:12
75.105.32.39



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The last time I wrote about a true happening I got some B.S. but heres another.A young man ,his wife,and month old baby bought a 1066 in Ia.He was out of state borrowed a gooseneck 32 ft tandem axle trailer to pull behind his two week old Dodge diesel 1 ton pickup.He was pulled over in the town he picked up tractor for being too wide.Two hours later he had a total of seven violations one being truck not having inspection sticker and put out of service.This was a new young DOT cop that was pretty proud of himself.The purchaser took it back to dealer and had him deliver it .The fines were more than it cost to have it delivered

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LBSMJS

05-06-2012 17:28:42
67.55.148.10



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
I don't understand why he shouldn't get ticket.I have to abide by the laws why shouldn't he.I run in Iowa with 1 ton and 34ft. trailer.Haul farm equip of my own and tractors to be repaired.The truck and trailer require yearly inspections,triangles,andfire ex.I have proper wt and an oversize permit for hauling hay and tractors with duals on.So if you are going to run with the big boys do it right or stay on the porch.

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lumpie

05-06-2012 05:39:47
66.43.196.138



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
I'll be the first to admit that DOT enforcement officers are nothing more than bullies with badges and were rejected for whatever reason from all other law enforcement agencies, but some guys just have it coming. Going down I-35 yesterday passed a 3/4 ton chevy pulling a 36 foot tandem axle dual wheel gooseneck hauling a John Deere G. Had it tied down with 4 yellow ratchet straps. Can't count the number of pallets of seed and totes full of chemical you see just sitting on trailers, or maybe just one strap throwed over them going down the road in the spring.

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jddriver

05-06-2012 11:15:28
108.79.56.180



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 05:39:47  
straps are just as safe and sometimes safer than chains



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lumpie

05-06-2012 12:18:00
66.43.196.138



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to jddriver, 05-06-2012 11:15:28  
That load gets bouncy, back and forth, up and down, and those cheap flimsy straps start to fray and the crappy ratchet mechanism fails and you've got a tractor laying on her lid in the middle of the highway.



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jddriver

05-08-2012 15:49:39
108.79.56.180



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 12:18:00  
you must get your stuff at wal mart straps are legal and safe get used to it



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scotc

05-28-2012 11:55:12
72.106.101.208



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to jddriver, 05-08-2012 15:49:39  
Actually, as long as they have the WLL printed on them, they are legal to use. I just wouldn't go trusting wally'smart crap to hold down an entire load.



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d beatty

05-06-2012 20:32:19
24.12.128.253



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 12:18:00  
I don't where you get straps are flimsy when a lot of over the road drivers use only straps. Over the 38 years I drove I got stuck a few times in construction sites and they pulled me out with one 6" wide strap with a crawler. The rig was 26,000 Lbs. not including the load.



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Ralph Bauer

05-06-2012 18:57:36
75.107.19.155



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 12:18:00  
Quality straps won't be had at HF or WM....DOT/CHP legal ones will cost their price and will be of decent quality. Will they last forever?? Certainly not. But what do you think all these truckers hauling sheet-rock from the local plants are using? NOT chains!!



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jddriver

05-06-2012 11:12:55
108.79.56.180



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 05:39:47  
if those straps where of the two in kind with a load limit of 3500 lbs it was legal



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JimEvans

05-06-2012 10:46:40
66.185.0.208



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 05:39:47  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

4 yellow straps should be more than enough to haul a G legally - no problem there. Tandem dual gooseneck means he needed a CDL to be legal since he was over 26,000 total GVW.

Since when is farming not commercial? It is a business, just like every other business. Normally, if you are hauling something for your business it is commercial. I do realize that there are exemptions in many states for farm use and products.

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Ralph Bauer

05-06-2012 08:06:18
75.107.19.155



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-06-2012 05:39:47  
That would give me the "willis", too. And he was on the interstate! (Hope you didn't see him in my home state, Oklahoma ...lol) Granted, there are DOT/CHP rated yellow straps (Got one, its an Allies?) but chains, and more that 4 should be deployed, There is absolutely nothing wrong with having a couple or more chains too many then too few or just bare minimum. That applies to local and long distance hauls. Just a farmer hauling his own stuff: Ralph in Oklahoma.

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craigco

05-06-2012 05:08:29
69.171.160.143



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
colorado springs had traffic cameras for about6 months. Private company paid all install fees for a percent of fine money. The new mayor shut them of due to it cost more to have extra officers mailing tickets then the fines brought in.



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larryanderson

05-06-2012 00:35:01
75.104.160.54



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
The point I was trying to make is being out of state people have a target if they dont have everything they need.I have trucks and have hauled seed to surrounding states and received a ticket in S.D. for lack of fuel permit to which I said that IFTA covered that.I had to pay a fine on the spot of $200 .I called my lady who did my truck permits and received a phone call apoligizing for the officers lack of the law and a refund.If I hadnt said anything the money was gone.This was a farm tractor not commercial and was not overweight but I am sure was wider than 102 in no way should it have been deemed fit to charge them for DOT numbers,log book etc as it is not commercial.

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John in La

05-06-2012 07:09:15
70.156.102.240



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-06-2012 00:35:01  
I agree. The system is far from perfect. We have laws that only a lawyer can read and exceptions to the exceptions written into the laws. This allows both sides to find that one word in the rules to make it read their way; at least in their minds.
Then we have cops that are TAUGHT when in question write the ticket; arrest them; and let the courts figure it out. This applies to all police work not just DOT or traffic. Problem with DOT tickets is the court is often miles away so it is easier to just pay the fine.

The biggest loop hole I see on this forum is I am not Commercial OR it is a hobby.
You can blame that loop hole on big boats and RV's. It is those guys that got it written into the law. Life would be a lot simpler if the feds would just say anything over this size these rules apply.

With that said you are dead wrong on your point of view.
You even said this was a farm tractor. A farm is commercial. Yes you may only farm on the weekend; you might even loose money at it; but it is still a business.
Yes he would be classified as a private carrier so for hire carrier rules would not apply.
But since he was out of state; log book; federal truck inspection; DOT #; medical card; fuel permit; apportion tags; all sound like good charges. Then we add no permit for oversized; no oversized signs; and most likely over weight and I would say he got off easy.

From the info you have given I would say your friend is SOL. He just as soon pay the fines and be done with it.

As far as being over weight.....
Yes I do not know the exact truck engine; cab; or axle ration so there is a chance he was not over. That is why I say most likely; because there is a very good chance he was over if not very close to being over with a tractor of this size.

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John in La

05-05-2012 12:48:32
70.156.102.240



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
Lets see............
He is caught hauling a over sized commercial load with no permits; with a out of state truck that has not been inspected; has no DOT #'s on it and most likely over his max weight limits............

AND it is the Cops Fault.

OH wait.
His wife and month old baby was in the truck.
There we go that makes the differance.



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The tractor vet

05-05-2012 07:51:55
75.19.127.43



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
Well first off he was in the wrong . A 1066 is over the magic 8 foot 6 inches . It is not a matter of the tires being on the bed of the trailer it is the FACT that the axles stick out past the magic numbers . and there for it is and OVERSIZED load. NEED PERMITS . Now you can DRIVE it on the road way with the duals on and be legal as long as your flashers are out to the edge of the duals thats ok , but when you place it on a TRAILER anything that is easily removable MUST COME OFF and what does not come off and sticks out is what makes it oversized . But had he gotten a oversized load permit and had all his DUCKIES IN ORDER there would not have been a problem, NOW WOULD THERE. Now here is my rub on this , Nobody likes this B/S but what have any of you done to turn this around ???? have you gone to your congressman or Senators and expressed your displeasure over a forced law that none of us voted on . have any of you started a partition and have people sign it to send off to the idiots ???? Talk is cheap and complaining across the fence row or the fuel island is just that . For the ones that haul there toys to a pull for a hat or new grease gun or trophy and bragging wrights at the coffee shop come monday morning and run less then 10000 miles a year then we should not have to comply with other then the SAFTEY reg. and the weight a width laws . If we want to move a piece of equipment over the 8.6 then we should get the permits and there we need to play the game for safety sake with the signs flags and blinky lites . Sofar all i have seen is that these new reg.'s have done around here is take safety out as i am seeing more 1/2 ton pick ups pulling goose necks . Myself i prefer a one ton and a tandem dual trailer for the better brakes and heavier suspension better tires . So instead of complaining about this why not do something and get it on paper and hand it to the idiots we put in office . Myself i feel that the 26000 rule needs to be uped to 32000 with a mileage restriction of 10000 miles a year that should cove all of our PLAY hauling . The 32000 GCVW will cover all one tons and tandem dual trailers . Next would be NON profit pulling and that means NO prize money . Now this one i will be hated for record keeping of miles of trailer pulling and service records on truck and trailer during time of use with trailer. OUR tractor pulling is no different then them law makers gulfing outings and there betting against each other and i would bet they spend more on there gulfing and wagering .

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mosinee dave

05-05-2012 06:52:46
96.60.45.197



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
And what do people do about it ? Nothing just take it like sheep being hauled to slauther



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730d se

05-05-2012 06:40:27
68.189.186.53



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
This is not meant to sound like an "I told you so", but me and others on here have been hammering about this for a few years.
Let me see if I make this make sense:

IT AIN'T LIKE IT USED TO BE!

You cannot just go load a tractor for any reason (play, show, work, sell, buy) and haul it from point A to point B. It used to be that way.

IF you get pulled, and they are seeking out goosenecks and duallys like coon dogs after coons, it will likely cost you MORE than the hidden profit you will make on that tractor that you will resale, and certainly more than the fun you will have at a show.
The fines are steep, the rules are made as they go, and you will at least need to pay a lawyer to get anything adjusted.
I cannot be put it any simplier.
Can you still luck out and not get stopped? Sure, just like meth dealers can still find places to make meth. But you will eventually be caught.
It is about the $$$$, has little to do with safety.
A retired DOT guy told me that IF he stopped someone from out of town (or state), he had a certain amount that he was going to get. If they argue or try to bargain with him, he would increase it.

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Super Trucker

05-05-2012 05:57:42
99.29.199.178



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
I've had similar experience just recently. A major city here in Mi called DETOILET has a new traffic enforcement division. This officer has been caught red handed for lying,false testimony in court,harassment,and other things. They wrote me a ticket for no tarp. I spent over 3000 in fines and court and days off to fight with attorney. Still to get the shaft but not as bad as it could of been if I didn't have a lawyer. The courts just let this guy make them there money and best of all HE'S NOT EVEN DOT CERTIFIED ! JUST A 1 DAY COURSE. I'VE GOT TO GO NOW MY BLOOD PRESS CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE.

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d beatty

05-05-2012 06:37:34
24.12.128.253



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to Super Trucker, 05-05-2012 05:57:42  
Super Trucker you didn't say what you were hauling. I have a brother in law that runs dumps out of Michigan. He says if they are hauling anything that can blow out of the trailer they have to soak it wih water or tarp it.



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super trucker

05-05-2012 07:45:19
107.47.98.65



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to d beatty, 05-05-2012 06:37:34  
Structural I beams. Mich state legislature clearly states metal products b ecause of there weight size and density does not have to be tarp. Law 257.770 sub 3 part b. I think I have the law on my side . They said it was DUST is why they could make it stick.



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Ralph Bauer

05-05-2012 15:01:11
75.107.19.155



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to super trucker, 05-05-2012 07:45:19  
Dust? Don't get it! Can you please elaborate?



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super trucker

05-07-2012 03:42:45
173.139.56.122



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to Ralph Bauer, 05-05-2012 15:01:11  
The officer said DUST could have blown off or out of my container! Not that it did but COULD HAVE! My lawyer had him caught lying on record but the judge would not take action. As we found later the officers wife is a judge in the same court house . This is just a money grab to keep the head nerd from lansing out of the city.



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lumpie

05-05-2012 04:50:10
66.43.196.138



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to larryanderson, 05-05-2012 04:37:12  
Iowa is broke, so the state troopers, county mounties, local fuzz, and the DOT enforcement are conducting fund raisers. Big push for the traffic camera's so the public can just mail in contributions without having to put officers on the roads stopping people and asking for them.



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Ralph Bauer

05-05-2012 07:05:00
75.107.19.155



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to lumpie, 05-05-2012 04:50:10  
That BIG PUSH comes from private companies that install, maintain, mail out and collect on behalf of the city/town/municipality. There was a big bruhaha in Houston, TX a year or two ago, IIRC the contract was about to expire and the public didn't want it renewed. The company fought and lobbied tooth and nails (got a generous cut and would have to dismount them). There was also a question about the legality of a private company owning and operating an enforcement device on public property (roads)..I think the people won out...others chime in, please! Ralph in Oklahoma.

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MSD

05-05-2012 07:13:17
67.4.61.137



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to Ralph Bauer, 05-05-2012 07:05:00  
They had to shut them off in Sioux Falls, SD. I guy took the city to court over a ticket and won out. His defense was he had no defense. Got the ticket and no way to appeal it so the court said the city couldn't do it that way.



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scotc

05-28-2012 11:57:32
72.106.101.208



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 Re: Another D.O.T nighmare in reply to MSD, 05-05-2012 07:13:17  
I read an article several years ago that stated that traffic cameras actually make intersections less safe. When people would run through a yellow, put a camera up, and people would now slam on the brakes. So the person behind them runs into them. Some town in Oregon or Washington actually had something like 8 to 10 times the accidents at an intersection than they did before the cameras went in.

Most fatal accidents related to running a red light happen when the light is run more than 5 or 8 seconds after the light changes. The best way to reduce accidents at a red light, is to put something like a 3-5 second delay between the red light coming on and the crossing red switching to green.

It would also help if they put some sort of blinders on lights that can be seen for long distances. I know of some lights in PA and OH where you can see the lights for anywhere from 4-7 miles away, the speed limit is 55 through them, and you come down a long slop to it two ways, and the other two you pop over a little hill right before the light. And they have more than their fair share of wrecks at them. Even if they had a series of signs just big enough to say "1 mile" ".7 mile" ".4mile" ".2 mile" ".1mile" coming up to the light it would give you something to help judge how far away you are. When you've been on the road for hours and you're looking at a light changing red to green and back for 5-10 minutes, it is verrrrrryyy easy to suddenly realize that it's red and you're about to go under it.

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