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Discussion Forum

I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle.

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Nofbdybs

04-21-2012 20:25:23
65.0.16.233



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Been in the market for some time for a tow truck.
Pulling a gooseneck, and about 12,000lbs.
Truck would probably do less than 4,000mi in a years time, as it wouldnt be my primary vehicle. Gas mileage really wouldnt be a concern, as 200miles would be a round trip.
Right off the bat, I was not going to spend $50k on a new Duramax, Powerstroke. I just cant justify that kind of $$ on something that will sit so often.
So, I was looking at 24v Cummins trucks and 7.3 Powerstrokes.
Well, you end up with 2 types of trucks.
1. Something with a bajillion miles,
2. Something with low miles, and the owner wants INSANE $$ for it.

neither of which was appealing.
I think I have settled on a GM unit, with the 6.0 or 6.2 gas engine.
Ill save, literally tens of thousands over a diesel unit.

MX will be far cheaper. No extra fuel filters, much less oil when it comes time to change, ect.
The 6.0s and the like, are rock solid engines. Yes, they are fuel hogs, but again, the $$ I save over the diesel will buy a LOT of gas.


Anyone do any regular towing with the GM 3/4-ton tucks and the gas engine?

Thoughts?

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PretendFarmer

01-05-2014 05:17:46
70.188.162.167



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to JDseller, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

Honestly, why would you go to the stealership for an oil change?

12 quarts of oil is $30 cause I get it on sale.

Filter is about $10. Totals out at $40. Hardly a justifiable complaint.

Like I said, you like gassers so much, then keep going with that.



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PretendFarmer

10-02-2013 06:10:11
192.249.47.207



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to VicS, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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Yup. My 1997 has a fair amount of body rot. Frame and drive train are solid. The rockers and front fenders need work. I could put rust converter on and paint over the rot and get away with another 4-5 years if I wanted to but I am going fix it soon.



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PretendFarmer

08-15-2013 05:22:10
192.249.47.207



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
You can argue all you want. You think gassers perform like diesels? I don't really care. If gassers did what diesels do, there wouldn't be diesels.
One of the past comments mentioned higher insurance...what are you smoking dude? And there isnt a thing on my friends new cummins diesel that he can't wrench on himself. You like gassers so much? Thats cool. But you can't compare to a diesel. Like I said though, if your only towing a few times a year, get a gasser. Me, I tow 8000+ a dozen or more times a year and I would not want a gas powered rig but in all honesty, if I was buying a new truck, I probably would get a GM 6.0 gas 2500. The cost of new diesels is insane. If I needed a newer truck, I would buy a used, newer Cummins.
This post was edited by PretendFarmer at 05:25:06 08/15/13 2 times.

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G1355

08-15-2013 07:47:26
67.224.60.152



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 08-15-2013 05:22:10  
I pull skidloader a, mini excavators, packers, etc for my work every day, they have all fords and one Chevy, the 7.3 is on its last leg at 255,000, the 6.0 doesn't have much power, the one. 6.4 is complete gutless, and the other 6.4 has alright power, and there 3500 dually chevy, pulls descent, if you can keep it out of the shop. the duramax and the 6.0 see the shop quiet frequently. Oh and they all get 8mpg towing 12-15000 pounds like my hemi, and around 15-16 on the road which is almost identical. but I know my hemi would out pull them all, and my bosses new 6.2 ford would out pull the diesels to, I drove that the other day, was pretty impressed except it only got 6mpg but I was running it hard. Maybe the new 6.7 power stroke is better I don't know. But I won't argue, the cummins pulls pretty good.

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PretendFarmer

08-15-2013 08:42:48
66.87.125.0



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 08-15-2013 07:47:26  

G1355 said: (quoted from post at 15:47:26 08/15/13) I pull skidloader a, mini excavators, packers, etc for my work
every day, they have all fords and one Chevy, the 7.3 is on its
last leg at 255,000, the 6.0 doesn't have much power, the one.
6.4 is complete gutless, and the other 6.4 has alright power,
and there 3500 dually chevy, pulls descent, if you can keep it
out of the shop. the duramax and the 6.0 see the shop quiet
frequently. Oh and they all get 8mpg towing 12-15000 pounds
like my hemi, and around 15-16 on the road which is almost
identical. but I know my hemi would out pull them all, and my
bosses new 6.2 ford would out pull the diesels to, I drove that
the other day, was pretty impressed except it only got 6mpg
but I was running it hard. Maybe the new 6.7 power stroke is better I don't know. But I won't argue, the cummins pulls pretty good.


You should get a drug test. There have been plenty of side by side comparisons between Ford superduty trucks. The exact same two trucks. One gas, one diesel. Could the gas do the job? Yes. But the diesel out performed in every way. It's not worth the expense unless you tow heavy regularly OR get a killer deal on it.
This post was edited by PretendFarmer at 09:15:50 08/15/13.

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PretendFarmer

08-14-2013 13:15:46
192.249.47.207



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Heavyduty1, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
Diesels still far surpass gassers. Simple numbers. If your pulling heavy, regularly, Diesel. If your grocery getting, and towing your camper twice a year, get a gasser.

Diesel mileage isnt what it was. But reliability is still there. Do people have problems? Yes. But I wouldnt group every diesel truck into one catagory because a small percentage of owners have issues with the EPA equipment.

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buickanddeere

08-14-2013 14:09:31
216.183.132.182



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 08-14-2013 13:15:46  
We will let time decide how the complex EPA certified diesels fair at the 100,000 and 200,000 mark vs the DI gassers. As the EPA diesels are not home shop serviceable past filters,fluid changes and some external bolt on components. Lets calculate shop hourly rates and parts $$$ against that higher up front. Purchase price. Extra interest if financed. Higher insurance premiums. Higher priced regular service. Against the fuel "savings" with diesel costing more than gasoline. Power is a mute point as a gasser makes more than sufficient towing power.

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welding man

08-14-2013 19:01:49
76.9.224.70



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to buickanddeere, 08-14-2013 14:09:31  
Not trying to stir up anything at all. I am courious as to who is building a gas engine that will even come close to towing like the diesels and get the milage the diesels get. The big GM's won't, The V10 Fords won't and the V-10 Dodges won't. Everyone that I know that has had a Diesel and used it for heavy towing and traded it for a gas has been sick of the trade and most have went back to the diesels.I've got a Dodge 24V cummins,5sp with a 4.10 rear that will play with 20,000# in the mountains and get 12 MPG. I have not seen a gas that will even come close to that. Maybe they are in the big threes plans, but I have not seen one yet.

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buickanddeere

08-15-2013 04:55:48
184.151.61.38



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to welding man, 08-14-2013 19:01:49  
You are living in the long ago past glory of the excellent per-emission 6BT and early 2000's ISB 5.9's prior to common rail injection. VS the dreadful V10 and big block gazers of the era. The fuel prices of the era too. Now in 2013 we need to replace those 12-15 year old trucks with rust perforated tailgates, rocker panels, door bottoms and fender wheel wheels. What are the choices NOW ? We are not talking the past.

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welding man

08-15-2013 10:00:19
76.9.224.70



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to buickanddeere, 08-15-2013 04:55:48  
Buick I've got a 1998 1/2 Dodge 3500 HD with 40,000 miles that looks like the day it came from the factory. I have turned down more money on trade for a new one than I paid for it new. Why would I even dream about trading?



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buickanddeere

08-15-2013 20:42:53
209.240.125.13



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to welding man, 08-15-2013 10:00:19  
I would say keep it and drive it. You must live in an area that doesn't salt the roads in the winter.



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mj

09-10-2013 00:13:57
216.237.70.109



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to buickanddeere, 08-15-2013 20:42:53  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

That's the way it WAS here in Colorado, now they are using MAG (magnesium chloride) in a liquid form and coating the roads at the first sign of snow - it is FAR worse than the previous salt/sand mix. How bad is it? Well, the Colo. Dept. of Transportation (CDOT) stopped using it on the elevated westbound portion of I-70 in Glenwood Canyon after an inspection of the roadway's interior (the elevated portion is hollow) revealed extreme damage to the pipe-ing and re-bar - on the high mtn. passes the foliage is dying next to the roads from exposure to the spray from vehicles' tires - it needs to be removed from the undercarriage of vehicles or severe damage results to frames, suspension components, wiring & brake systems - used to be you slowed down on slick roads but the public won't abide that anymore (got to get there .... NOW!) so, 'lay down the MAG and Hammer It' is the new idea of highway 'safety' :roll: For more info start here: http://xynyth.com/resource/icemelter-concrete/against_magnesium_chloride.html

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G1355

08-14-2013 19:16:08
67.224.60.152



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to welding man, 08-14-2013 19:01:49  
The new 6.4 hemi will, the 5.7 hemi will to with the six speed and 4:56 gears, they really will when they put in the eight speed like the 1500s like there talking about



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welding man

08-14-2013 20:58:33
76.9.224.70



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 08-14-2013 19:16:08  
I have a friend that has the truck you are talking about with the 5.7 hemi and 4:56 gears. 4 door 4WD Dually. I put a B-W Hitch on it a month ago. He hooked a 24 ft. gooseneck behind it and loaded a 10,000# skid steer loader on it and the first mountain he hit he said it fell flat on it's face and he got 7 MPG. He's ready to trade for a diesel.



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PretendFarmer

07-30-2013 05:56:18
192.249.47.207



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to mkirsch, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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My rig is a 1997 12 valve cummins. In stock form it performed acceptably. It is mildly modified now. Mostly injection pump turned up and 30psi of boost. I can tell you for a fact, that this truck pulls way better than my Chevy gasser. I own a diesel because I am heavily into tractors for pulling or shows. At heaviest, I have a slide in camper on, and my Farmall H puller on the trailer. Probably around 10,000lbs all together, camper, tractor and trailer. Next year I will be getting a camper that weighs at least 1500lbs more than this one. I would dread the mountains with a gasser. Absolutely there is a difference.
If I didn't tow like I do, not sure if I wouldve gone diesel or not. This cummins gets far better mileage unloaded than a comparable gas truck. Maintenance is a wash. Most gas guys that bash diesels simply bash because they want an excuse not to do it. It's not chest thumping to me. Better mileage all the way around and much more durable.

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buickanddeere

08-05-2013 17:48:36
209.240.127.193



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 07-30-2013 05:56:18  
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Lets get out of the past and compare a late model EPA emission diesel with a late port injected gasser or better yet a DI gasser. 16yr old truck is a rattling rusted out wreck around here.



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mj

06-27-2013 18:40:22
216.237.70.109



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
I know where you're coming from and I couldn't make the math work either UNTIL I headed one uphill (6+ per cent) with a loaded g/n. :wink:
Geez - don't think it's important enough for TWICE! :oops:
This post was edited by mj at 19:01:18 06/27/13 2 times.



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mj

06-27-2013 18:38:18
216.237.70.109



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
I know where you're coming from and I couldn't make the math work either UNTIL I headed one uphill (6+ per cent) with a loaded g/n. :wink:



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mkirsch

05-24-2013 05:59:30
64.80.110.74



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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I hope you were wearing your barn boots because you were standing in a pile of BS up to your knees.

If a dealer doesn't want a truck on the lot, they send it to the auction.



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charles todd

05-20-2013 23:00:49
70.195.195.23



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
6.0 gasser. Awesome engine. About to transplant one into my old 1979 C20 backed with a TH400. New meets old!

CT



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mkirsch

11-16-2012 06:45:20
64.80.110.74



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
Two problems with the ecoboost:

1. It hasn't proven itself yet, especially where it would have to work hard every day. People love it for grocery-getting, and towing the camper a couple of weekends every summer, but are any farmers hooking a gooseneck loaded with 8 tons of round bales behind one yet?

2. It is not available in the F250/F350 trucks. The best you can do is a "max payload" F150 by special order, which is at best a light 3/4 ton.

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KTNC

11-15-2012 17:28:41
70.192.3.161



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
Another point to look out (just saying) the F150 Ecoboost motor has more torque than the 6.2 liter gasser in the Super Duty and the 6.0 liter in the Chevy... (About 400 ft lbs compared to 800 ft lbs in a diesel)

So you guys with the diesels, is it the difference that noticeable under actual towing conditons?



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Dodgeit

05-14-2012 11:16:57
65.199.61.227



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to ericlb, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  

gtx1967jewison said: (quoted from post at 23:10:44 05/11/12) They all run offload fuel. But still its more $ to drive per mile
than a gas. The 5-7k more you pay up front will fuel a gasser
for 14,000 miles at todays prices & 10mpg. That's 7 yrs of
fuel at 2k miles per yr. Then its easier to sell besides.


It depends on what you want out of your truck. My 3/4 ton Dodge Diesel will pull 14k GN (legally)all day long running 70-75mph and laugh at 10 mpg. The same truck with a hemi, can only legally pull 10k and wish it could get 10mpg, running at 55-60mph.

I'm not interested in what Joe the farmer does with his farm tag exempt from the law truck. The DOT don't care spit about, somebodies opinion of what their truck will do, they only care about what the OEM says the truck can do.

If you pull less than 10K, once,twice,three times a year a diesel is probably overkill. And the math works. If however you are in my position and do some hobby tractor pulling, collecting, restoring. You need a truck that will legally pull a 14K GN. A 3/4 ton anything with a gas engine simply cannot legally even hook up to a 14K GN, because it will be 4K over the GCWR.

I just did a 1k round trip (loaded both ways) from SC to Ohio I-26 to I-40 to I-75. same route on the way back. Pullin my trailer loaded to 11k running speed limit plus 7-8 when traffic allowed the truck averaged 13.94mpg hand calculated for the trip. For those that haven't travelled that route before there is the Saluda grade into North Carolina, and then the climb out of Knoxville to the top of Jellico, with some good long rollers in KY for 185 miles. Try that with a gas engine and you will soon be kicking yourself for not getting the diesel.
FYI my '06 Dodge is bone stock with no mods and has 88k on the clock. If you are Ford or Chevy fans I understand, that you may not enjoy such milage unloaded let alone loaded, and for that I apoligize, for I am not trying to rub anybodys nose in the dirt, I'm just making a statement of fact. Diesels and gas trucks are not an apple to apple comparison unless the trailer is less than 10K, above that and the only player in the game is a diesel do to legal GCWR.

Almost forgot the resale on a gasser sucks compared to diesel as well. In my part of the world they sell for at least 6-8k less than the same truck with a diesel. Heck even the Ford '03-'07 6.0 sells for 5-6k over a gasser and you know your probably buying a problem that's 3K to fix yourself.
This post was edited by Dodgeit at 11:23:04 05/14/12.

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buickanddeere

08-05-2013 17:45:38
209.240.127.193



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Dodgeit, 05-14-2012 11:16:57  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see
Lets try that comparison with a late emission truck with particulate filter and urea vs the latest gassers . Now think again when GM releases the DI gassers in the 2015 HD trucks. The diesel will have even less of a case .
The days of diesel being cheaper than gasoline are long gone. Comparisons of diesels vs gassers as if they were 1986 carbed gassers vs a 1986 Cummins are long past too.

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scotc

05-28-2012 11:06:44
72.106.101.208



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Dodgeit, 05-14-2012 11:16:57  
They care more about the extra fees to register it for a heavier weight than what the GCWR is, considering their is no standard formula for figuring it.



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gtx1967jewison

05-11-2012 21:10:44
174.230.150.18



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
They all run offload fuel. But still its more $ to drive per mile than a gas. The 5-7k more you pay up front will fuel a gasser for 14,000 miles at todays prices & 10mpg. That's 7 yrs of fuel at 2k miles per yr. Then its easier to sell besides.



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scotc

05-28-2012 11:10:26
72.106.101.208



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to gtx1967jewison, 05-11-2012 21:10:44  
Have fun paying the fines when you try running offroad fuel. Not a good idea, I don't care who you are, unless your truck qualifies as an "implement of husbandry" in your home state, but then it's still questionable whether you can get away with it.



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Dodgeit

04-30-2012 11:37:14
65.199.61.227



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Ethan Chamberlain, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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True



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Dodgeit

04-25-2012 08:48:45
65.199.61.227



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to dvtw, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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I was just looking at GCWR max for gas and diesel with 4.3 rear end. But you are right it was a 350 vs 450.

Dodge isn't any better. If you have a 14k trailer, you have to have a diesel to legally pull it on the road, unless you have farm tags



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JimEvans

04-25-2012 19:30:07
66.185.0.208



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Dodgeit, 04-25-2012 08:48:45  
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Unfortunately, if you buy a dually today, it has more than 11,999 GVWR, so if you pull a 14k trailer, even empty, you need a CDL.

There are a lot more DOT officers looking for rigs over the CDL limit, than ones looking for over GCVWR.



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john_Bud

04-25-2012 05:04:59
173.245.138.22



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
Have you excluded the Ford SD's with V10's? They get 12-14 mpg pretty easy and have lots of torque for towing.



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JimEvans

04-24-2012 19:04:23
66.185.0.208



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
I stand corrected. Apparently both the new Fords and new Chevy diesels are quite a bit more than the gassers. Technically, you were comparing a F450 to a F350, but it is still 30k vs 22.5.
They must not be very proud of their gas engines.



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buickanddeere

04-24-2012 09:06:57
184.151.61.153



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to mkirsch, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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Dodgeit

04-24-2012 08:19:03
65.199.61.227



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to T_Bone, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
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Really? Here is Ford's towing guide for 2012 F350 22.5K for a gasser, 33k for diesel.

To my reading level thats 9.5k difference

http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty/specifications/towing/



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Dodgeit

04-23-2012 10:19:58
97.133.223.136



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
The only thing about the gas model is the GCWR is 6k lighter than the same truck in a diesel. So your 12k trailer puts you over GCWR by about 4k.

This is starting to be an issue with all the states DOT dept. they have started check what the GCWR is of the truck pulling the load.



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JimEvans

04-23-2012 17:38:38
66.185.0.208



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Dodgeit, 04-23-2012 10:19:58  
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Really? Every spec I have ever seen on most every brand shows the same GVWR and GCWR. Which means the gas truck can haul more! because it weighs less.

You can't compare a 1/2 ton gasser to a dually diesel.

I have a diesel dually. It replaced a 454 dually. There is only a couple of MPG difference between a modern diesel and a good running big block. Because of the expense and emissions, my next dually will be a gasser.

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mkirsch

04-23-2012 06:21:18
64.80.110.75



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
Despite what people claim there is no shame in owning a gasser.

Those GM 6.0L trucks are as common as raindrops. You should be able to find something decent that's not overpriced if you're patient, keep your eyes open, and are ready to JUMP on a deal when it presents itself.

That's the most important thing... Don't hem and haw, or sleep on it, because the truck will be gone tomorrow.

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LJD

04-23-2012 10:03:36
75.226.71.6



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
There are good rust-free older diesel trucks around if you search around. Whether you want one or not is a different story but they certainly are more fuel efficient then gassers when pulling trailers.

I drove a 2002 2500HD ton Chevy with an 8.1 pulling a gooseneck horse-trailer. Got 8.5 MPG on the highway. The owner told me when he pulled a 14,000 lb. trailer he got 5.5 MPG.

My 1994 Ford with a 7.3 turbo IDI pulls the same horse-trailer and gets 12 MPG. Gets 17 MPG empty.
Paid $3300 for it 12 years ago. Rust free from Colorado and now has 240,000 miles on it.

My 1992 Dodge with the 12 valve 5.9 Cummins pulls the horse-trailer and gets 13.5 MPG. Gets 20 MPG empty. Paid $3500 for it 8 years ago. Rust free from northern Maine from a place that never uses road-salt - just sand. Has 160,000 miles and runs perfect.

My 1983 Suburban with a 6.2 non-turbo diesel pulled a 5500 lb. trailer 2000 miles and got 13.2 MPG. Not great - but it is an old tech diesel and still better then most gassers could do pulling the same weight and wind-resistance. This was a high camper trailer that acted like a big sail.

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730d se

04-23-2012 13:20:22
68.189.186.53



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to LJD, 04-23-2012 10:03:36  
No question that even the "light duty" diesels by the big three have more grunt and better MPG than most gas engines.
However, plow in the added initial cost, added parts cost, added diesel cost over above the high price of gas, and you really need to be hauling often or for a living to make a diesel make sense.
Many times it more of an ego thing, a sound thing, a smoke thing, a bragging rights thing.
All of those truly meaningless "things" come with a hefty price which is always higher than any true value.

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buickanddeere

04-23-2012 10:21:55
216.183.153.99



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to LJD, 04-23-2012 10:03:36  
Not easy finding a pre-common rail injection diesel that isn't rusted through around here.



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LJD

04-23-2012 10:32:13
75.226.71.6



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to buickanddeere, 04-23-2012 10:21:55  
Not easy to find in my area either. None of mine came from NY.

I'll also assume that older diesel trucks bring more in Canada then in the USA. I met several people with older diesel trucks in Ontario and Québec. When I told them what I paid for my trucks, I think they figured I was pulling their legs. I was sitting in a transmission shop in London (Ontario) when my E40D trans sprung a leak in my 94 Ford diesel F250. An old guy came in who also had a 94 Ford diesel F250. He bought his around the same time as me with more miles and paid more then twice what I did. Heck the repair parts cost more in Canada. A lot more. The guy in the shop told me there were a few parts I ought to get once I was back in the USA. He said they'd be 30% more if I bought them in Canada. I know at the time, the exchange rate was about even.

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superseries

04-23-2012 06:58:20
206.221.157.243



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
dont waste money on a diesel. the mileage is worse tnan a 6.0 i have worked as a gm mechanic for 20 years. many expensive problems with a duramax. a few guys i work with have duramaxes and say they get around 14mpg unloaded. i have a 2011 6.0 and get 16mpg. gas costs less than diesel also. not putting you diesel guys down. when you figure in the added cost to buy a diesel you need to drive it 250,000 miles just to break even as compared to a gas. this has been proven over and over

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Toms1650

04-22-2012 14:25:24
69.217.167.176



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
We have seven of the old 6.0 gas trucks. Four duramax. And one new F350 gas. I asked about the same question 30,000 trouble free miles ago. I have to run stock for our trucks get checked. Cost wise not even close the 6.0 were a great buy. The duramax look good,pull good but with only 14mpg and high maint cost are not. I switched from the diesel to the big gas Ford and I do not miss a thing. As far as towing the seat of the pants tells me the diesel got more, real world this dosent mean a thing because whatever trailer I pull I get to the same location with the same time with both trucks. All the diesel is good for is wasting money and pushing your chest out claiming you have a diesel. They are not cheaper to run. BTY the 6.0 have 200k on them and have been in the shop less that the 70-120k diesels.

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S2710

04-22-2012 14:15:30
98.143.227.89



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
I totaled out my pickup last summer and I was looking to replace it. Anything at all had over a 100,000 on it and thay wanted anywhere from 12 to 25,000 for them. I picked up a 99 powerstroke for a very good price. It has 250,000 on it but it was well maintained. I had to replace the glow plugs and the diesel shop said that the motor was in very good shape. I am like you and don't put a lot of miles on a year,and fuel is higher then gas but I get a 1/3 better mileage with it then the gas engine. If you can find a 7.3 power stroke with a lot of miles and was well taken care of don't be scared of it. By the way after the price of the truck and putting in 8 new glow plugs I still had less then book price in it. I was lucky I knew the truck and the owner, and his maintenance. Everyone was scared of the miles and he had it for sale for over a year.

Bob

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bobs old iron

04-22-2012 07:34:01
97.124.222.127



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
it depends where you find a GOOD used/new unit of any kind, how many miles, engine, greedy owners or dealers, condition of unit. i traded my p/s in on a cummins at a ford dealer that didn"t want dodge"s on his lot,,,,my p/s lariet had 102k, didn"t need to sell/trade, couldn"t pass up the deal, gave 4k different for dodge, was going to cost 2-2.5k to do what i wanted to do to truck..got one year newer, 60k less miles ... couldn"t see paying for new/used when, [like you said],it sits for time on end...

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BSpauld

04-22-2012 06:47:29
205.188.116.197



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
I pull a 34 ft 5th wheel with my 6. 2500 Chevy with no problem. It doesnt give great milage but i understand the new ones are a lot better



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M Nut

04-22-2012 05:06:02
50.107.32.110



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
I have an 8.1 gasser in a 2500 HD Chevrolet crewcab. It will drink gas with the best of 'em, but it has plenty of power. Brother used it yesterday to pull 16,000 lbs on a gooseneck trailer, and said it didn't struggle at all. As far as mileage, best I have gotten is 12.5 pulling a 16ft boat with 4 guys at 60 mph on good highway. Lowest is 7 mpg pulling 10,000+ lb loads. If I just figure 10 mpg in almost all usage it will be pretty close.

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IAtractorKid

04-21-2012 20:46:15
166.250.103.25



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Nofbdybs, 04-21-2012 20:25:23  
You want the 6.0, the 6.2 is a high hp engine for lighter trucks and not designed for towing. No personal experience with a 6.0 but everyone seems to love them. Not enough motor for me...7.4l to 8.1l until discontinued then up to a dmax! Fuel cost is higher but mileage is better empty and towing. Maintenance is about a wash, more expensive per time but lo ger time between. Currently on my first dmax but i will never own another gasser.

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buickanddeere

04-22-2012 10:07:56
216.183.153.13



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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to IAtractorKid, 04-21-2012 20:46:15  
The 8.1 "only" makes 340HP which certainly beats the 350 four barrel of the 1980's with 145HP. How did anybody ever manage to pull a trailer then? However GM could not justify an extra 8.1 production line when the Mark IV LS engines are making 360HP 6.0L with 2500/3500 chassis and 403HP 6.2L in the HD tow package 1500. With fuel injection and unleaded fuel. Any old gasser that makes 300,000miles has not been a big deal for the past 25 years. Try 300,000 miles and the bills. To keep a diesel 30,000psi common rail injection, urea injection, particulate filterd, cat convertered, , turbo, variable waste gate, dual battery, and dual alternator rig. Too bad most diesel purchasers won't admit they choose the diesel so they can re-program in some smoke and another 100-150HP. Or run off road fuel.

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