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Tractor Transporting Discussion Forum

when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's

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soundguy

12-20-2011 16:41:21
107.41.196.198



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Ok.. we know LED lamps save power vs incandescent jobs.

we also know that with the exception of actual headlamps.. that LED's are fine, day or night for just about any other illumination needed on an auto.

IE.. marker lamps, turn signals and brake lamps, even 'parking' / daytime running lamps should be fine for hi brite leds.

the power savings having all car interior and exterior illumnination, with the exception, for now, of headlamps being LEd's would = lower electrical demand.. thus better fuel economy.

dome and map lamps could even be led..e tc.

soundguy

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JMOR

12-28-2011 09:02:47
72.190.9.193



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to rustyfarmall, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
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LED light sources

The first series-production LED headlamps on the Lexus LS 600h

Automotive headlamp applications using light-emitting diodes (LEDs) have been undergoing very active development since 2004.[45][46] The first series-production LED headlamps were factory-installed on the Lexus LS 600h / LS 600h L presented in 2007 for 2008 models. Low beam, front position light and sidemarker functions are performed by LEDs; high beam and turn signal functions use filament bulbs. The headlamp is supplied by Koito. Full-LED headlamps supplied by AL-Automotive Lighting were fitted on the 2008 V10 Audi R8 sports car except in North America. The Hella headlamps on the 2009 Cadillac Escalade Platinum became the first U.S. market all-LED headlamps. Present designs, such as those available as optional equipment on the 2010 Toyota Prius, give performance between halogen and HID headlamps,[47] with system power consumption slightly lower than other headlamps, longer lifespans and more flexible design possibilities.[48][49] As LED technology continues to evolve, the performance of LED headlamps is predicted to improve to approach, meet, and perhaps one day surpass that of HID headlamps.[50]

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soundguy

12-30-2011 13:54:19
184.233.129.47



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to JMOR, 12-28-2011 09:02:47  
i knew someone was already using them.. etc..



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chevytaHOE5674

12-24-2011 06:04:28
74.221.62.147



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Oldmax, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
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Never seen LED headlights. HID's are on plenty of higher end vehicles but they are different than LED's.
UP here they have one LED traffic signal in town and it has heaters on it from Nov.1 through April.15 as often times it snows daily. Heard from one of the city commissioners that they hope to refurbish the old signal that they had previous and put it back up in place of the LED one.

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soundguy

12-27-2011 14:47:44
107.41.191.171



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to chevytaHOE5674, 12-24-2011 06:04:28  
I said LED not HID.. but since you bring it up.. there are LED headlamp assy's out there.. just google for it.

soundguy



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scotc

12-24-2011 05:30:26
75.221.111.173



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
Why not headlamps? Cadillac using LEDs for headlamps. As well as I believe BMW and Audi/VW.

LEDs also light faster, which grabs your attention better. But it still doesn't help when the moron in front of you hits the brakes every time a leaf blows across the road in front of him.

Yes, LEDs will snow over faster in winter. But a standard bulb will, too. I've even had my headlights (sealed beam and 9004s) ice over. How many watts does the light in a street lamp run? That's all that's needed to keep them clean, and really, only for a few days a year. With computer-controlled traffic lights, most towns/cities can activate them when needed and still save a bundle.

The trouble with LED street lights, is they can be seen too far away. There is a (LED) light on route 6 near Bryan, Ohio, that can be seen for up to 15 miles away. There are a lot of wrecks from people blowing the red light there, too. The light really sneaks up on you. But that seems to be a problem with any light that can be seen from a mile or more away, without a lowered speed limit in front of it.

Why run the old socket/bulb style trailer lights? The 4" round bulbs have the same plug as LEDs.

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Aaron Ford

12-23-2011 20:33:30
98.157.96.130



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
I was trying to put a trailer hitch on a mazda CX-9 when I noticed the difference. It had a very small gauged wire running some huge taillights. Bright too. This was a major thorn in my side as I had to use the adapter and wire a hot from the battery back because the taillight wire wouldn't carry enough amperage to power the trailer lights. I can see this would save weight, save copper, and save fuel as they use less power. They are also very vivid and shine through weather/splash/spray/fog better. The truckers at work all use them as the DOT cannot assume that at least one light will be out as they did before. I do not have them on my car hauler yet but I will.

Got a string of em on the gutter right now.

Aaron

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soundguy

12-23-2011 22:07:25
184.4.159.217



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Aaron Ford, 12-23-2011 20:33:30  
i notice many christmas tree lamps are going led. maybee safer. hmmm.. :)



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caterpinery@hotillar guy

12-23-2011 17:27:48
75.134.173.56



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
Well I tried those fancy LED's just junk wont last as long as my old incandesant lights. The snow stays on them worse for poorer visibility. If just one diode is burned out it is an out of service issue in the turn signal position. If one diode is burned out the light is considered defective also if you doubt me call Grote and ask them. Also ask any scale man he will also confirm this .



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soundguy

12-23-2011 17:41:04
173.104.246.23



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to caterpinery@hotillar guy, 12-23-2011 17:27:48  
I have heard there are DOT issues with inop segments.

I believe that is currently in the process of being clarified as to whether there can be any inop units in a multi segment display, or if it is all or nothing.

still staying tuned on that issue.

soundguy



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John in La

12-23-2011 17:03:45
67.35.255.88



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
I really do not see a savings in gas mileage great enough to justify the cost of LED lights especially with the high HP motors of today.

Now if you want to put 100 chicken lights on 1 small wire;
Want lights that have several burned out and can still pass a DOT inspection;
Want lights that take a better shock load;
Have lights that lend themselves to replacing the whole lens; bulb; case; when the bulb burns out.
Then maybe you have a use for LED.

LED lights became common on trucks for all the above reasons. Small trailer places use them because that is what is available.
Some car manufactures are even using them now because they look cool.

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soundguy

12-23-2011 17:41:10
173.104.246.23



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to John in La, 12-23-2011 17:03:45  
there's another good point. takes less copper to drive a led segment than an incandescent filament...

soundguy



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chevytaHOE5674

12-23-2011 10:39:29
74.221.62.147



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
They have trained monkeys that plow the night shift.
This post was edited by chevytaHOE5674 at 15:47:26 12/23/11.



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showcrop

12-23-2011 10:12:52
75.67.231.80



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Bob, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
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Who plows the snow the other 14 hours?



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chevytaHOE5674

12-23-2011 08:36:50
74.221.62.147



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
Maybe its just this area. But I know dozens of guys that plow snow 10 hours a day 6 and 7 days a week, all the trucks went back to regular bulbs. Was at the county garage and there is a box of LED taillights in the shop that have been taken off the trucks.
Heck I bought the LED taillights for my trailer and then went out and bought new "regular" lights to replace the LED's because the regulars just work. I tow a snowmobile trailer around 3-5 days a week all winter so I have a little experience with the snow on the taillights.
I'll keep using my energy hog incandescent bulbs and burning an extra cup of gas every year. hahaha

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chevytaHOE5674

12-23-2011 07:18:08
74.221.62.147



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
Sometimes all it takes is a degree or two increase in temp to melt the snow. An incandescent bulb can easily raise the temperature of the lens that much by just running the taillight.
And I'm not talking snow storm, I'm talking daily driving in the snow. Even when it doesn't snow for a week or more UP here there is still packed snow on all the roads that sticks to things like a fine powder. Doesn't take much to melt it away.
And from what I've heard Buffalo really doesn't get much snow. ha

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mkirsch

12-23-2011 06:58:40
64.80.110.75



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
I'm from Buffalo so don't presume to tell me about snow.

My vehicles have always had regular bulbs. The only ones that melt off are the headlights. When I get home from driving in a snow storm, the rear end is plastered with snow, no sign of melting.

Fact of the matter is on typical vehicles, the bulb is so far from the surface and is OFF most of the time. How can it melt snow? So, it doesn't matter if it's LED or a regular bulb.

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chevytaHOE5674

12-23-2011 06:10:49
74.221.62.147



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to IHMANKY, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
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You call it bologna I call it experience. I switched to LED lights for 2 winters and had to stop and scrape the lights very often. Went back to normal bulbs and I haven't scraped a bulb in the 2 winters since.
Should also tell your bologna idea to the counties and states who went to LED and are now spending money to go back because of their troubles.
Move to the third snowiest city in America and you will learn something about living with snow for 6 months of the year.

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S2710

12-23-2011 08:25:32
98.143.227.89



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to chevytaHOE5674, 12-23-2011 06:10:49  
I plow snow for a township and we have 3 trucks and 2 have led's and 1 has regular lights. When all 3 come in after plowing they all look the same in the back WHITE. It don't make any difference neither one puts out enought heat to melt snow of any amount.

Bob



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mkirsch

12-23-2011 05:51:56
64.80.110.75



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
This whole "melt snow" thing is baloney...

Tail lights are "dim bulbs" that don't generate enough heat to melt snow.

The stop/turn bulbs aren't lit long enough to create any appreciable amount of heat.

When it's snowing that hard, your tail lights are going to get plastered. All you can hope is that your lights are bright enough to shine through, and the guy behind you is paying attention.

LEDs are better in this case because the light they produce is much more intense and will penetrate a thicker layer of snow.

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showcrop

12-23-2011 05:34:32
75.67.231.80



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Brown Dirt Cowboy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
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Don't let anyone know where the shop is, or all you and the boys will have to do at your shop is smoke the pipe and laugh because you will have no customers.



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chevytaHOE5674

12-23-2011 04:49:38
74.221.62.147



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
Tried LED taillights on my trailer and found that since they create no heat that in the winter the snow doesn't melt off of them. Normal bulbs create just enough heat that they usually remain a little visible even in a blizzard. This same fact was discovered by the Counties and State on their plow trucks. So they are slowly going back to normal bulbs.
Even switched to LED traffic signals to "save electricity". Now they had to add heating elements to the LED signals to melt the snow off them. Tell me how running a heating element all winter saves electricity.....
I really don't see switching over to LED bulbs saving enough electricity to make any measurable difference in fuel economy. If they did then the manufactures would already be doing it as they try everything to get mpg's out of vehicles.

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Shetland Sheepdog

12-23-2011 04:20:00
72.71.209.231



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Dennis Benson, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
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Don't take any power to turn the generator/alternator Huh? Why don't you and your laughing buddys put together a vehicle driven with an electric motor powered by that "free" electricity! One question, are you Daryll or other brother Daryll?

Dave



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Joathan MacDonald

12-22-2011 14:52:38
68.109.119.246



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
I know allot of new vehicles that have LEDs in them trucks cars and ect.... LED's arnt going to get you better fuel mileage... Sounds like something a salesman would say. (Fact) power train (electrical) in a veichles electrical mods wont give you more power. Alternator only spins as fast as the motor spins (LEDS or no LEDS) alternator just trickle charges whats there regardless of the draw on the batterys. You have to changes drivetrain to get better fuel mileage(motor, fuel delivery, air, etc. Only thing LEDs have as a pro on is they take less off a draw on your battery or batterys and produce a brighter light.

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soundguy

12-22-2011 16:52:23
184.233.63.166



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Joathan MacDonald, 12-22-2011 14:52:38  
you obviously speak as a person with no electromechanical theory knowledge.

electrical load directly corelates to mechanical load.

the more electricity used by a vehicle, the more the alternator charges. the more the alt charges, the more of a mechanical load it is.. the more mechanical load, the more fuel used.

Ok rocketscientist.. look at a generator set.. you know.. portable one.. or heck.. even pto.

ever notice they will tell you fuel usage at half load, or full load.

ever notice the fuel usage goes up as load goes up.

simple physics.. no free lunch.. you use more electricity.. you use more fuel.

if you can reduce the incandescent load on a vehicle by replacing all but headlamps out with LED's then you an reduce overall fuel consumption...

sheesh.... this is high school level stuff here people....


soundguy

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Jon mac

12-22-2011 20:56:25
68.109.119.246



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-22-2011 16:52:23  
LMAOA LAMOA LAMO LAMO Change a car out with leds all the lights we will dyno it before and after. I want to see this. Everyone is going to laugh out you. Am i being punked right now like really!? Lmao you have no idea how a car electrical system works. Your idea is there if cars came with generators WITCH THEY USED TO. Generator in old cars would recharge loss voltage. Alternator only keep batterys up to par. You are so dumb just stop while your ahead leds will get me miliage.hahahahahahahahahaha Put down the pipe sir apparently its to strong for you. Me and the boys at the shop are going to laugh about this tomarrow. Leds will make your car in to a 9 sec track car. Did you come up with the muffler bearing joke too

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soundguy

12-23-2011 15:20:49
173.107.18.205



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to Jon mac, 12-22-2011 20:56:25  
you have a serious lack of reading comprehension.. perhaps comprehension in general.

I never said that an electricity savings would make a car go faster or dyno higher. I said that when using less electricity, it will use less fuel.

it's simple high school physics.

there is no free lunch.

the electrical load the alternator see's is directly related to it's mechanical load on the engine. same with a generator..

I'd wager I understand motive electrons better than you.... so you have an engineering degree right? I do....

soundguy

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bdpayne

12-21-2011 15:36:08
63.111.38.122



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
I don't think it will happen, if it does then they will have to have defrosters on them. The LED's don't make enough heat to melt snow and ice.

Brad



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soundguy

12-22-2011 14:31:15
184.233.18.234



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to bdpayne, 12-21-2011 15:36:08  
1, plenty of led tail and stop lamps already.. I don't lknow of any defrosters on them.

2, I kinda doubt interior lamps will need defrosters.

notice I ssaid with the 'exception' of headlamps.. etc.


soundguy



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d beatty

12-21-2011 17:28:48
98.215.123.133



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to bdpayne, 12-21-2011 15:36:08  
The company I worked for bought several newer trailers with LED's . They replaced them with regular bulbs. I pulled several of them in snow storms and they would totally get covered with snow. The old style bulbs will melt the snow off lens.



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soundguy

12-22-2011 14:32:58
184.233.18.234



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to d beatty, 12-21-2011 17:28:48  
all of our tractor/trailer lamps are coming out, oem'd now , as led fixtures..

soundguy



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mkirsch

12-21-2011 05:25:44
64.80.110.74



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
I think LEDs already have gone "mainstream."
UPS and Fedex trucks all have LED lights on the back. More and more commercial trucks are out there with LEDs.

A lot of cars built in the last 2-3 years have LED tail lights.

If you shop carefully you can get good LEDs pretty reasonably. Harbor Freight has the ovals for $15 each when they come on sale. Walmart sells 4" rounds for $15 every day.

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willie in mn

12-21-2011 00:55:20
205.188.112.108



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 Re: when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's in reply to soundguy, 12-20-2011 16:41:21  
Initial cost is a big factor. When they first came out for the big rigs a 4" round tail/stop light was around 50 bucks, but the old incandescent type was around 4 bucks. With increased useage costs have come down a lot. Projected service life was 100,000 hours, or 24 hours a day for about 11 years. Main causes of failure in old style bulb/socket are moisture corrosion & vibration. Modern design of sealed contacts & shock mounts has greatly reduced light failure of incandescents. I have a 97 GMC p-up with all original bulbs still working.
Power consumption doesn't seem to be enough to be concerned about except for some big rigs with 50 or 100 "chicken lites".
My 2 cents worth.
Willie

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