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Tractor Transporting Discussion Forum

Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k?

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F-350

06-17-2011 05:03:15
67.142.179.27



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So if everyone else is running 80-90 mph we should all try and keep up even while towing.

This is a rural area in fairly level farming country...The roads are good with not tons of traffic..Theres no big towns..Not all of us are in a hurry..When towing I often run 10 mph under to be safe..The faster you go the harder it is to stop.

Lots of light antique pullers and show tractors are hauled on 7K trailers pulled by 1/2 ton pickups...These guys are careful and cause no problems.

I'll guarantee you the guy with the M kept everything in great condition..He is much safer than someone running 70-80 mph in a crew cab dually pulling a fully loaded tandem axle gooseneck..

If towing with barely adequate but legal equipment you do the following.

You keep everything (tires-brakes-lights etc} in excellent operating condition...You balance your load good with the proper tongue weight.

You drive 5-10 mph under the speed limit and dont tail gate...If traffic piles up behind you,you pull over and let them by...Since this is level farm country I often go lesser traveled roads.

You drive slow going thru towns as thats where most problems happen..I've had kids in bicycles dart out in front of me.

You pay attention and drive 1/4th mile ahead..Youve got to remember that 30-40 years ago lots of us pulled home made trailers that had no brakes...We had to drive careful..

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mkirsch

06-17-2011 08:11:16
64.80.110.75



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to F-350, 06-17-2011 05:03:15  
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No, but you can't be crawling along at 25MPH in 80-90MPH traffic, because your truck doesn't have enough power to go any faster, or the load is so unstable that you don't dare go any faster.

One guy's alleged "success" with a marginal setup does not guarantee the same results for everyone. Slightly different truck or trailer, different results. Slack off on the maintenance, different results. Another driver behind the wheel, different results. Move from the flat land to the hills, different results.

There are literally THOUSANDS of variables that happened to come together to ensure this guy's success, and a change in any of those could turn the situation from a quaint story about an old man and his truck into a tragic headline on page 1 of the local paper.

Again I ask, what purpose does it serve to skimp on equipment when the difference is only a few hundred $$$?

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F-350

06-17-2011 20:04:14
67.142.179.22



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to mkirsch, 06-17-2011 08:11:16  
None of us drive 25 mph...If the speed limit is 60 we run 50 mph and if its 70 we run 55-60 when towing..

In my area barely adequate but legal tow vehicles get along just fine..Its fairly level and not heavily populated..Most of the drivers are older farmers,truckers,mechanics-etc that keep their stuff up to snuff and know how to drive..They often only go to 5-6 pulls or shows per year and arent out there pounding the hiway..

Todays new 1/2 ton pickups are far superior to the 3/4 tons of not that many years ago..My brothers new F-150 is huge compared to an older F-250..You dont have to have a crew cab dually and a 14K gooseneck to haul an H Farmall a few times a year..

As far as I know not a single person in my area has been killed by someone using a 1/2 ton and a car trailer...Yes there are tons of variables but it still boils down to the guy behind the wheel and how he maintains his equipment..

I like to look over the haulers and tow vehicles at shows and pulls..Usually the most overloaded are the crew cab duallys with huge tandem axle trailers...I've seen them at tractor shows with 3 tractors on that had to weigh 18K or more plus the trailer weighed 8K.

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scotc

07-03-2011 02:40:14
75.245.49.140



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to F-350, 06-17-2011 20:04:14  
I don't know where you are, F-350, but I know Nebraska sure is a lot different than back in PA. I've run into the ethanol plant near 100K on 5 axles regularly. The highway's flat, you just let off the throttle and let the engine brake work a little longer. Never could get away with that back east. Only trouble is, the large cars that come into town behind you, just as heavy, and don't think far enough ahead to not burn their own brakes up.

Unless width precluded it, I'd probably just get the 7K car hauler, too. I had over 5K (after chains and binders) on a bumper pull behind a V6 half ton Chevy. It knew the weight was back there, but with that little motor stopping was less a concern than getting going. I kept it on the back roads with that load.

We have three gooseneck stock trailers at work. With the prodigy controller in the one duramax, you can say that none of them have working brakes. You just have to look forward past the end of your hood, and past the rear bumper of any car ahead of you. If you can't see past him, you back off to where you have plenty room to easily stop if he does.

Can't wait to read the heck I catch over this one.

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buickanddeere

06-17-2011 05:53:37
192.75.48.150



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to F-350, 06-17-2011 05:03:15  
So if everyone else is running 80-90 mph we should all try and keep up even while towing.

80-90mph, oh sure. Over in the fast lane 70-75 max or the troupers have a field day writting tickets. Over in the right lane traffic is 60-70mph.

Stay in the right hand lane and move with traffic.

This is a rural area in fairly level farming country...The roads are good with not tons of traffic..Theres no big towns..Not all of us are in a hurry.When towing I often run 10 mph under to be safe.

Crashes happen when there is a disturbance in traffic flow, now when traffic is in steady state. Small town are loaded with stop signs, kids on bikes, corners, women in short shorts etc. Look at the stats, far more crashes per mile in small townsthan on interstate highways.

The faster you go the harder it is to stop.

No suprise there, kenetic energy rises with the square of velocity. Doesn't matter 1/2 ton or dually.

Lots of light antique pullers and show tractors are hauled on 7K trailers pulled by 1/2 ton pickups...These guys are careful and cause no problems.

Half tons with 7000lb trailers are never in wrecks?

I'll guarantee you the guy with the M kept everything in great condition..He is much safer than someone running 70-80 mph in a crew cab dually pulling a fully loaded tandem axle gooseneck.

There you are hating the guy again with $$$ driving the dually crewcab. All other factors identical.I'll take my chances with the modestly loaded 10,000lb goose neck. Instead of the maxed out 1/2 ton and 7000lb trailer.

If towing with barely adequate but legal equipment you do the following.

??? Should you not have all equipment in excellent confition be it the dually goose neck 10,000lb or the 1/2 ton & 7000lb trailer?

You keep everything (tires-brakes-lights etc} in excellent operating condition...You balance your load good with the proper tongue weight.

You drive 5-10 mph under the speed limit and dont tail gate...If traffic piles up behind you,you pull over and let them by.

There you are again causing wrecks. By backing up traffic and disturbing flow. Causing other drivers to attempt passing. Pulling to the shoulder also causes a disruption in traffic flow. Drivers behind have to hit the brakes, swerve and try to look through dust from the shoulder. And b.t.w. how many roads have shoulders wide and firm enough to pull over on? Ever been in NY state around Lake Placid?

.Since this is level farm country I often go lesser traveled roads.

You drive slow going thru towns as thats where most problems happen..I've had kids in bicycles dart out in front of me.

You pay attention and drive 1/4th mile ahead.

Always critical to safe driving be it on a bycycle to a semi truck or anything in between. To look ahead .

.Youve got to remember that 30-40 years ago lots of us pulled home made trailers that had no brakes...We had to drive careful.

Guess that makes cutting corners today ok? May as well throw out the kid's bike and motor cycle helmets, cut the seat belts out etc.

I remember wrecks 30-40 years ago where it was normal for people to be killed or crippled. Now in a similar wreck people push the vehicle door open and walk away.

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F-350

06-20-2011 07:39:00
67.142.179.20



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to buickanddeere, 06-17-2011 05:53:37  
You haul stuff your way and we here in the midwest will haul stuff our way..We must have lots better roads and much less traffic than you do..

Going 10 mph under the speed limit causes no problems here..Its flat level farming country and people can pass most anytime they want to..I get 2-3 mpg better staying 10 under..Theres farm machinery on the roads going 20 mph all the time..

Only twice in the past 4-5 years have I had to pull over and let people by..I was over 100 miles from home in a very hilly area..I pulled over in small towns and let traffic by..I had tall loads and the wind was blowing 40 mph and I couldnt make any headways...This was with a crew cab dually and a 14K gooseneck..

My brothers new F-150 has a combined 16,000 towing capacity..It weighs around 6000 so that leaves him 10000 lbs for a trailer and the load..He wouldnt have any problems pulling a 4000 lb tractor a few times a year on a 7K car trailer..Its done all the time around here with no problems..For a few times a year you dont buy a 3/4 ton or dually with a 10K or 14K trailer..


I just got rid of a 7K car trailer that I used for over 20 years..All that was ever done to it was repace the floor once,pack the bearings,replace tires,and keep the lights and brakes working..It was never once welded on.

I have a neighbor that has bought and sold small tractors for many years..He has a nice 7K tilt bed 16 ft bumper hitch that he pulls with a 1500 Chevy..It doesnt take a semi to haul an 8N Ford..

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buickanddeere

06-20-2011 11:29:26
192.75.48.150



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to F-350, 06-20-2011 07:39:00  
"You haul stuff your way and we here in the midwest will haul stuff our way..We must have lots better roads and much less traffic than you do..""

So the laws of physics don't apply to xenophopes?


"For a few times a year you dont buy a 3/4 ton or dually with a 10K or 14K trailer"

The trailer and truck is either overloaded or it's not. One inspection by the DOT will prove that. Overload anything into the yield point of metal and it will rapidly fatigue and fail. It's not a matter of if, just when. Tires will rapidly deteriate when overloaded. You can't see the failure of belts and rubber inside from the outside.

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JimEvans

06-20-2011 19:00:13
66.185.0.208



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to buickanddeere, 06-20-2011 11:29:26  
There you go calling people names again. Kind of a pot and kettle thing.

The 1/2 ton with a 4000 lb tractor is NOT overloaded. You why do you keep bitching? Maybe you should read some of the posts before you respond.



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F-350

06-21-2011 06:40:02
67.142.179.25



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to JimEvans, 06-20-2011 19:00:13  
Well Jim our friend just doesnt seem to get it...When he doesnt get his way he likes to call names...Its been that way for years..He must be related to Plowboy on Newagtalk..

I guess if he had bought a new 4020 JD in the 1960's he would have only pulled a 3 bottom plow with it because a 5 bottom plow would have maxed it out...There must have been (50) 4020's in my area and they all pulled 5x16's...Even the 3020's pulled 4x16's and the 2510;s pulled 4x14's...Yes,our soil is sandy and doesnt pull hard.

Its perfectly legal to haul a 4000-4500 lb tractor or load of any kind on a 7K trailer pulled by a 1/2 ton pickup..Its probably the most popular combination that I see...Many years ago I towed with a F-100 Ford with a 3/4 ton rear,heavy springs,and bigger tires...It did really nice..

If a nicely built 7k trailer weighs 2200 and the tractor weighs 4000-4500 then he has 300 to 800 lbs to spare..Every once in awhile I'm that close on my 14K trailer...In fact just recently I was some over that for a 7 mile haul..

A 16 ft trailer isnt as maxed out as a 3/4 ton pulling a 25 ft 14K gooseneck with a 9-10,000 lb tractor on it or a dually pulling a huge tandem axle trailer with 18,000 on it..I see that all the time..You seldom see anyone only using half the capacity..

I have a friend that is a new trailer dealer and he probably sells (5) 16 ft bumper hitch trailers to every one of any other size..His trailers are very nicely built..If you want to go up in size he will gladly take your older trailer in trade as he can quickly sell all the used ones he can get..

The guy asked what it would take to haul a 4500 lb tractor and he was given plenty of answers..If thats all he ever intends to haul a 7K trailer will do fine..If not he can always trade up..Thats what I did..I have way more truck and trailer than I need 90% of the time but I occasionally haul some pretty big loads.

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buickanddeere

06-21-2011 05:54:09
192.75.48.150



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to JimEvans, 06-20-2011 19:00:13  
The topic started out as #1 Purchase just enough trailer to get by without any reserve capacity. Not being able to tow heavier loads in the future. And run equipment at or near it max rated limit. Continuous usage at max rated limit is a common factor in area equipment failure. Or #2 For a few extra bucks purchase a hauling system that isn't maxed out.



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JimEvans

06-21-2011 18:30:14
66.185.0.208



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to buickanddeere, 06-21-2011 05:54:09  
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I think owning an old D8 Cat would be very cool someday. Unfortunately, I only have a 12k bumper pull trailer. I guess I really screwed up by not buying a new KW with a detach trailer. I promise to buy something that will cover all of my future needs next time.

You are correct that equipment that is maxed out will have a shorter life than equipment that isnt. Thanks for pointing that out. But I really only need my trailer to last 40 years. I really don't need infinite life. I have seen far more trailer tires blow out from old age than from being overloaded.

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Stuart

06-17-2011 15:58:08
64.198.86.189



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 Re: 4500lb tractor + 2200lb trailer. 7k trailer or 10k? in reply to buickanddeere, 06-17-2011 05:53:37  
Good to see you are logical and rational.



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