Weight scales

Dale c mi

Member
Thinking of buying a tractor in another state. I have a 1 ton truck and a 14 k trailer. Do I have to take it over the scale or can I blow on by? the truck has a farm plate and I have no cdl. Thanks Dale
 
Depends on what state your going to be in. Some states have signs before scales that say all trucks must go over scales and otherssay truck over so many tons go over .
 
I agree w/ D Beatty; depends on what state. I have seen signs @ scales requiring vehicles from 6000# up to cross. If your GVWR is 26000# or less; no cdl is needed; but; if the scalemaster determines you are operating commercially; you will need a medical card. If you run the scale; and you should have crossed; if they chase you down the officer will not be happy. Better check it out and decide what to do in the states you will cross
 
I am like KCTractors. I just blow by them. Have been from colorado to East coast. Same set up. Vic
 
i just blow on bye i have a 1 ton with a 32 foot triple 7,000 lbs axles or a 48 foot with two 12,000 lbs axles the only scale i stop at is the cat scale just to see what i weigh the most i have weighed so far is 39,760
 
In Ia the sign reads all trucks over 10000# must weigh.But most including myself just drive on by.I had a friend that hauled with a gooseneck fifth wheel stocktrailer for many years never stopped and decided He would put DOT numbers [magnetic] signs on .He drove by was chased down cost over $400.Took signs off and never has been stopped.The farmer rule seems to help but I am pretty sure it wont get you out of ticket if checked.Wide loads of hay can get you in trouble if no wide load signs.I know that firsthand.Out of state license puts a target on you.Best to be legal.
 
my 1 ton drw f350 and f450 and 14k gn trailer have pulled all over the southeast ( texas, lousiana, alabama, mississippa, georgia and florida ) and never pulled into a scale. Have bassed many houses full of smokies. had one fly out any pull over a box truck next to me but let me go..
 
Chris;
Just cause you done it for years does not make it correct.

Texas; Alabama and Mississippi will not bother you unless you are commercial.

Louisiana and Georgia (read #2)
The following vehicles must stop: (1) agricultural vehicles; (2) passenger or specialty vehicles, either single or in combination (towing a trailer) with GVWR of 10,000 lbs. or more; (3) commercial trucks with GVWR of 10,000 lbs. or more.

Florida pretty much will leave you alone unless you are commercial; or you have some form of agricultural. Bypassing a Florida scale and especially the ag check station with a horse trailer is a big no no.

With that said I hardly ever see a one ton stop at our Louisiana scales even if they are pulling a trailer and with a business name on the door.
 
Dale if you want to beon the safe side call dot of states you are plan on going through and ask if you are required to cross scales. They all have toll free numbers and you don't have tell who you are or when your going through state.
 
I knew about the ag check in Florida, we have to have coggins test for our horses or the can't go very far. Wasn't aware of la/ ga stopping non com trucks. I have been lucky :)
 
The problem with asking is half the time they don't know, and the other half of the time three people will give you five different answers!

We bought a grain drill 100 miles away that we wanted to haul sideways on my big trailer. Problem was it had a drawbar on it that made it 9'6" front to back.

Dad called the sheriff's office, the state police, and the DMV because he didn't want any trouble. If he had to get a permit, he would get a permit. NOBODY had a clue what he was talking about!

We finally said %$# it and went and got it on a Sunday. Only saw one law officer the entire way home, and he drove right by and didn't give us a second look.
 
As already said, ask 3 people, and you get 5 different answers.
In my own experience, it will vary greatly from state to state. In PA where I live, they mostly do not bother smaller vehicles that are hauling goods. Vans, pickups, and small trailers seem to go unnoticed. I HAVE seen smaller vehicles that have obvious issues stopped and checked - like obviously overloaded pickups and/or small trailers. A famous one is the landscapers that have too much equipment on one trailer and not properly secured. Then, the DOT cops will give them the once-over and most likely put them out of service until the violations are corrected.
One time I was stopped at a scale in KY over a fuel permit. I was running a "hot-shot" load in a small 6-wheel box truck rented from Ryder. Ryder insisted that I did not need a KY fuel permit, but the scale cop said that I DID need a fuel permit. I was also told that even a pickup with a diesel engine has to stop at the scale. Apparently that is the way that things are done in Kentucky. Worst part of it is that even if you ask DOT cops, as said above - if you ask 3 of them you will get 5 different answers.

Food for thought... a 14k trailer is most definitely over the 10k limit as far as CDL requirements go. Even with a farm exemption, I would be inclined to think that you would still be subject to the same safety requirements as any other commercial vehicle. Stopping at the scales could be a mixed bag. You may open a can of worms, and they may just chase you out saying that you do not belong on the scale. You never know.
I would make sure that the load is properly secured and make sure that it is properly positioned on the trailer to avoid overweight on an axle. Then avoid the scales as much as possible by using "alternate" routes.
 
10,000 lbs is not a threshold of needing a CDL. To need a CDL and comply with commercial regulations, the question is; Are you private or commercial? If you're not doing anything in the furtherance of a business, not going to a show where you could win prize money, don't have a sponsor helping to pay transportation costs, not taking the tractor to do work for pay, not showcasing your tractor restoration skills for hire, you're private and commercial regulation does not apply.
If you do fall under commercial regulations, the threshold is 24,001 lbs.
 
When did they change it to 24,001 lbs.? We had DOT safety meetings at the company I worked for and was always told anything over 26,001 lbs..
 
10,000lbs is the threshold for CDL on a TRAILER. From the NY DMV website:

" You need a CDL to drive a commercial motor vehicle (CMV), which is defined as:

Class A: A gross combination weight rating is 26,001 lbs. or more or a trailer with a GVWR of more than 10,000 lbs."

Notice, "or a trailer with a GVWR of more than 10,000 lbs."

OR, being the operative word here. By the letter of the law, technically, you need a CDL if you are towing a 14,000lb GVWR trailer.
 


I found out one thing. Call the DOT in Washington DC and ask them the definition of commerical and lot of folks are going to have a rude of wakening.
 
According to U-Hauls website even a 26 ft. box truck is not considered a commercial vehicle and no special drivers license is required. If it is not a commercial vehicle, why would you have to stop?
 
I can give you a lot of reasons.....
First is the huge fines if you pass by and were supposed to stop
Second is the safety issue. Just being non-commercial does NOT excuse you from complying with safety regulations.
Third is compliance with the law. IF the law requires you to stop on the scale, then you must do so. This requirement varies from state to state.

Pass by if you like, but if you get stopped and fined for passing a scale, don't say you weren't warned!
 
Most people that rent a U haul don't know what a DOT number,a commercial vehicle or a CDL even is. They are renting a truck to move their personal belongings from point A to point B, maybe once in a lifetime. Looks to me like if they had to stop at scales, have a CDL or be considered commercial, U Haul would have to explain that fully at the time of the rental or U-Haul would be the one responsible for the fines.
 
you are missing my point... apparently some states are saying over a certain gvw, it's commercial no matter what..

i do see that florida no longer tags 1-ton trucks on your birthday.. but rather on december like a commerial vehicle...
 
I don't know that I would blow scale in Ill. The signs before scales say all trucks over 8 ton must cross scales.If you look up law is says same thing .
 
I would have to agree with some of the posters below (ask 3 people and get 5 answers) cause they proved it themselves.
Where do you guys get some of these rules. Off the side of a cracker jack box or from your BIL that knows everything about everything.

Lets try and clear some of this up; and yes I will show proof so you can go look it up yourselves.

" You need a CDL to drive a commercial motor vehicle (CMV), which is defined as:
Class A: A gross combination weight rating is 26,001 lbs. or more OR a trailer with a GVWR of more than 10,000 lbs."

That is not only wrong but way wrong.
Here it is straight from the NY CDL manual....
All states are the same as this is federal law.

http://dmv.ny.gov/brochure/cdl10sec01.pdf

a167403.jpg


Now read it word for word. Do not add your own words to it.
It says if the trailer is over 10,000 lbs AND the combination is over 26,000 lbs you need a CDL.
If the trailer is not over 10,000 lbs then it is not even figured into the equation. This is how U-Haul gets away with it on one front. The truck is built to have a GVWR less than 26,000 lbs. Their trailers have a GVWR less than 10,000 lbs. They are special built just to get around CDL laws. So you can rent a truck that has a GVWR of 25,999 lbs and pull a trailer that has a GVWR of 9,999 lbs and not need a CDL.

On top of that the feds ALLOW states to have exemptions from CDL's. Farmers under the right situation fit into this exemption. Some states extended it to even log haulers.
If you read the NY book you can see it also exempts personal trucks.

a167409.jpg


On one hand I wonder how this rule would stand up in court because it is not allowed by federal law.
(and do not get ahead of me cause we will look at other ways the law works)
Lets look at that.....

Part § 383.3 deals with who needs a CDL's and it list the exemptions allowed.

a167413.jpg


383c says all states MUST exempt military.

a167414.jpg


383d says a state MAY exempt farmers, firefighters, emergency response vehicle drivers, and drivers removing snow and ice.
It MAY but it does not have to.

383 e threw h goes on to list drivers that can be given a restricted CDL and drivers hauling fireworks (that are considered hazardous materials) around the 4th of July and New Years.

No where does it exempt personal trucks.
In fact the place where you do find a exemption for personal trucks is in § 390.3f

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390 is the section that deals with DOT numbers; insurance; record keeping.

But if you look in the CDL rules you will see that it takes that exemption away in § 383.3b

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So to say a state will exempt a truck just because it is a personal truck is against federal law.

Now on the other hand.
The feds use to exempt RV's in the regulations.
A few years ago RV exemption was taken out and the wording was changed that the rules only applied to commercial motor vehicle.
This still allowed a exemption for RV's because they are not commercial. This is how NY is getting away with their personal vehicle exemption I highlighted above.
The problem with this wording is some believe their interpretation of what commercial is does not follow federal rules. Its a given a RV and moving your household would be non commercial.

But hauling a tractor that is big enough to get you over 26,000 lbs GCWR is commercial. I sorry no one needs a tractor that big to do home owner yard work. Some where along the line you are using that tractor in the furtherance of a business.
So you are commercial and need a CDL unless you have some other exemption such as a farmer.
 
I won't argue about commerical vehicles but the crossing of scales deffers from state to state. Go to Weigh stations AAA/CAA Digest of Motor Laws and it gives a list of all the states and who has to and who does not have to cross scales by states.
 
It's all about money. I live on a state line.The state I live in WV pays very little attention to anything but Class 8 trucks. About everyone I know around here has at least 1 one ton truck and a lowboy.One tons are are daily drivers for most folks around here. We haul about anything we want and nobody has a DOT number and no one ever gets stopped. We never see a DOT cop. Cross the line in Va and it's a whole different ball game. They are money hungry and will stop anything with wheels and do enforce the over 10,000# rule. That is the reason I down sized to a smaller service truck, because I work in both states. Most of my other hauling is done on weekends and the DOT cops don't work weekends. They shut the scales down on Friday night and don't open back up till Sunday night.
 
First: check and see if your farm tag will cover your distance. Most states that issue a farm tag have a distance restriction (often 150 miles from point of origin). If your truck and trailer combined gvwr is 26000# or under; you will not need a cdl; but; may still be required to stop at scales. Obey the signs posted @ scale. Be sure you are not overweight; on rated tire load capacity or over your registered plate weight. Even most farm tags have a max. weight. If in doubt: you may elect to take the "scenic route"
 
Florida is the same way, I have a 1ton daily driver and pull a 14k trailer, fit don't care, apparently georgia does.. Etc
 
John in LA: I did not "add words." It was quoted directly off the NY DMV website, in its entirety.

It is not "way wrong." It is what NY state publishes as a FAQ, what 99.9999999% of people asking the question will see.

Besides if you want to nit-pick, the number is 26,000lbs not 25,999. The wording is all either "over 26,000lbs" or "under 26,001lbs" anywhere you look.

You can haul 2lbs more with a 26,000lb truck and a 10,000lb trailer.
 
California. One scale I pass on US101 has signs: ALL TRUCKS MUST ENTER SCALES UNLESS GIVEN BYPASS SIGNAL. There is a sensor hanging over the right truck lane about 1/2 mile from the scales.
ALL RENTAL TRUCKS MUST ENTER SCALES. NO PICKUPS.
The scales are open at random, so it takes less cops. Sometimes there are portable scales set up at the top of Pacheco pass on Ca152, a 3 mile grade so there is no way out.
 
(quoted from post at 19:04:49 09/12/14) Iowa is 10,000 lbs. They have also gotten smart on the "scenic routes" often see them patrolling back roads.

you must be in a more strict part of iowa, around here they dont even patrol the main highways hardly, this summer i passed a DOT officer with a civil war era cannon and he never even gave me a second look
 

I drag a 14k 20+5 gooseneck trailer behind a Dodge 2500. Strictly personal use. I've passed scales from TX to MN and never been stopped. I have been randomly stopped and questioned but no issues.
 
(quoted from post at 21:13:34 08/28/14) When did they change it to 24,001 lbs.? We had DOT safety meetings at the company I worked for and was always told anything over 26,001 lbs..
It duffers from state to state; in Alaska it is 8,000 lbs for off road equipment and on trucks it is the difference of having air brakes or hyd. breaks which tops out at 24,000 lbs. GVW or was that way a few years back... However I did just read the current law about the weight limit on off road equipment. I was surprised to find it was only 8,000 lbs. I had to have a trucking Co. move my 1946 Adams motor grader 311. I looked up the statute because I use to have a class A CDL and wanted to know that answer myself. Otherwise, I would have just drove it home. The title, yes title, said the Adams weighed in at 26,000 lbs. But there is no way that old 311's weight is over 18,000 lbs.
PS I forgot a number of years back DOT stopped me in a 5 yard IH dump truck hulling my Dad's stuff out of Anchorage. He asked if was a POV (privately owned vehicle). When I said yes he ASKED if I would display that on the door. All I had was black tape... That was before 9/11 and the Feds implanting new rules.
GOOD LUCK
Fat Dan
 

Guys, it really doesn't matter how hard you try to be legal and in compliance with the D.O.T. laws and rules. If the officer is determined to write a ticket and collect a fine, he WILL find something wrong.

Your best bet is to put on your bib overalls, your dirtiest farmer hat, and stay off the roads that have scales. Do your best to stay under the radar.
 
This is what I was told in Colorado when buying my new 23' PJ GN trailer that could have a 15800 GVW. I called CSP, my County DMV and DOT scale house near me. Got the sam answer from all 3

I drive and F350 dually with a GVWR rating of 11,500.

If the trailer is rated at 15800 I exceed the 26000 combined GVWR and must have a CDL and stop at scales. If the combined GVWR is 26000 or less, I do not need a CDL and do not stop at scales unless I am doing hauling for hire or as a part of my business. I can haul Hay for sale within 150 miles of my place.

Solution - I had PJ de-rate the trailer to 14,000. Nothing different, they just offered this service for a small fee. It can handle the 15800, but is stickered at 14000 GVW

So as long as I am not hauling for hire, I did not need to stop or have a CDL. State patrol told me if it is a piece of farm equipment they dot care much, unless it is a hazard or not tied down correctly (4 or more separate points needed).

I learned about the tie down when I delivered my tractor for service. I had the chain looped through the draw bar with a chain clamp on each end - not allowed. I have sense purchased DOT approved tie down chains for all 4 corners.

What was funny, is on the way to the DMV to get plates, CSP did stop me for no plate, but I also went a ways to find a safe pull off point. He was grumpy at first on my failure to stop, until I mentioned I wanted a safe place to pull over, for me and him. Once I showed him the title, sales contract, temp plate (expired) and mentioned the vin inspection appointment), he let me go with a smile, but not without finding out more about the trailer as he needed one too. He too confirmed the max 26000 combined weight and did check the truck door jam sticker and trailer vin and GVWR. He mentioned a lot of folks just don't know or care.

Many folks get upset about things like this, but they are just doing their job.
 
"Just doing my job!" isn't that what Hitler's men said at the Nuremberg trials? Which lets them off any moral obligations of right and wrong.
 
(quoted from post at 02:26:36 12/14/14) "Just doing my job!" isn't that what Hitler's men said at the Nuremberg trials? Which lets them off any moral obligations of right and wrong.

Well lets put it this way. In my line of work I have run across very tragic accidents, where someone forgot to secure a load, or was speeding, or drunk or both (finding ways around the law). I am sure the Family's of those that were lost would appreciate your thoughts.

I was always taught to respect those in law enforcement, and in my 60 + years I have yet to find a bad apple if your pleasant and reasonable. If you cop and attitude it will not be in your best interest. Been there and done that...only once.
 
I'm not here to debate politics that is agents forum rules. You stated your thoughts and experiences and I stated mine, let us leave it at that. :wink:
 

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