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Tractor Transporting Discussion Forum

I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle.

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Rmf1066

09-14-2013 21:11:59




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This message is a reply to an archived post by G1355 on June 27, 2013 at 19:42:56.
The original subject was "I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle.".

My pencil generally doesn't lie. I've owned both gas and diesel. With my figures the gas truck was a 97 F350 with a 460 5speed 4x4 3.55 rears 10mpg empty and 5mph with a 15000 load with $3.50 gas that's $0.35 empty and $0.70 loaded. The truck I have now is a 2000 F350 7.3 6 speed 4x4 with 3.73 it gets 15 mpg empty and 10 mpg with a 15000 load. So with $4.00 fuel that's $0.26 empty and $0.40 loaded. With those figures it doesn't take long to pay for its self in just fuel savings not counting resale value. Then the second argument is service cost is that's a wash in my books. Sure the diesel costs more when it's time to service but when you do it half as often how can you say it really cost more? Then you are talking about speed. Have you ever been in a diesel with a $200 chip or programmer in it? It will blow the doors off your hemi! In my situation I can't afford not to have a diesel. Now that's my 2cents.

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PretendFarmer

12-27-2013 03:15:52




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
If a gas rig suits your needs I say do it.

If I were going to buy a new truck, I would probably not get a diesel because of the up front expense.

They don't get the mileage the used to, unless you delete. They still pull like they used to, actually better.
Money not being an issue, I would get a diesel. Nothing pulls like a diesel. For me I would probably have to suck it up and get the 6.4L Hemi. Luckily my drive to work is only 3 miles so I dont drive much.

But I dont buy new trucks. I buy used trucks and they will be diesels. The maintenance expense on this truck is not much more than a gasser. New trucks go through injectors around 150,000 miles. The oil is not 3 times more expensive. Twice the interval, about twice the cost so its a wash.
This post was edited by PretendFarmer at 03:17:45 12/27/13.

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tommy_harrell

01-01-2014 19:17:48




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 12-27-2013 03:15:52  
An oil change is closer to triple the cost than it is to double the cost. Dealership sent a coupon in the mail offering a oil change for Cummins Ram (6.7L 2500) for $67.95 and Hemi Ram (5.7L 1500) for 24.95.
Tommy



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PretendFarmer

11-26-2013 10:07:35




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I'll keep driving this beauty for years to come. 101,000 miles. Hope to have the cab corners, rockers and fenders done in the spring.



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Mopower

11-21-2013 15:37:03




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I think if buying a new truck is your desire, gas is more economical. I sold my 1973 F250 with 390 gas for $3000 and found a deal on a beat up 1995 F250 power stroke for $3500 and years of nickles and dimes. It was well worth it. I could get 22-24 hwy then and after new injectors and a reprogram, the rustbucket got 27.2 mpg hwy on my 55-60mph road trip north. 2006 and prior diesels seem to be the cut off for good used trucks. My blue book value has increased from $3500 to $6000 on my junker. I'll keep driving it getting 15-16mpg with a 6000# tractor and 25ft gooseneck. Dad's 6.0 Chevy is beautiful, but can't meet my loaded mileage when it is empty. If gas was afordable, I'd probably have a big Chevy gas. Until then, I'll nurse my junk diesel to 400,000 miles lol.

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1206SWMO

10-19-2013 17:53:52




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
For only driving 2000-3000 miles a year my 1988 Ford F-350 dually with a 460 gets the job done nicely..It pretty much stays hooked to a 25 ft gooseneck.. 9-10 mpg with empty trailer and 6-8 mpg with a loaded trailer...It has no problems pulling a load..



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gtx1967jewison@yahoo.com

10-10-2013 21:26:00




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
You forgot about the extra $6000 you paid for it. At 3% (current inflation, or if you prefer, some people have to borrow $, that 6k will buy 1700+ gallons of gas. Can you save 2000 gallons of fuel over the gasser in the 5 yr you'll own the truck? A set of spark plugs is $100 installed. Injectors are $1000, & on the new stuff need serviced just as often. 100,000 miles. Thats another $900 for gas $.

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tommy_harrell

12-26-2013 21:55:38




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to gtx1967jewison@yahoo.com, 10-10-2013 21:26:00  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

I don't think your numbers are big enough. Ram 2014 2500, 5.7 hemi is standard, 6.4 hemi is +$1495 and the Cummins is +$8495 (with auto tranny) according to the window sticker. You get most of the diesel purchase money back when you sell it, but not repair and maintenance money.

The Cummins truck is approximately 1000lbs heavier than the 5.7 and 880lbs over the 6.4, based on the difference in payload on identical trucks. The lighter trucks should be easier on wheel bearing, tires, field roads,

Scheduled maintenance should be nearly identical other than the engine oil, spark plugs, fuel filter and DEF. Cummins oil should have double the interval, at around triple the expense. Hopefully they have cured the emission issues (DPF, EGR) You can replace dozens of sets of sparkplugs for the cost of injectors (new plug $6.99, reman injector $300+) I can change the plugs myself, but the injector would take some research.

I personally have decided to try something different. I have had 2 Cummins trucks ('02 and '05) and I have a 6.4 hemi on order. My payload capacity is increasing, my towing capacity staying around the same. Loosing 181Lb-ft torque and gaining 85hp. Fuel mileage on my '05 is runs between 10-15mpg with a personal world record best of 18.5, trip to in-laws for Christmas (2.5hr each way on I-70 running 5 under limit) was 14.2mpg, at current prices I could get 12mpg on gas for the same money

Things to think about
Tommy

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super trucker

09-28-2013 06:48:52




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
Well I run a 2000 f 350 diesel with a 50hp tow chip and pull 3 4500 lbs tractors all over michigan. There is no way a gas engine is going to do it more efficiently than a diesel. Its going to do it but at what cost? Gas,warped exhaust manifolds,cooling systems are not up to the task of what I do. There are times when I look at it and realize even the p/u isn't going to do it. Then I hook up the KW and drop deck put all 9 of my tractors on and roll. With this set up I can pull my load and 3 or 4 of your gas trucks loaded behind while doing 70mph , I as just a butt buggy gas is fine but really working diesel is king and always will be. How many gas semi trucks and farm tractors do you see ? Case closed.

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G1355

10-01-2013 05:20:39




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to super trucker, 09-28-2013 06:48:52  
Also take a look around from the first diesels feom the 80s up even tell the 90s, most are dead because you rarely see them but you still see the gas trucks, there are still some 24v dodges out there and a few 12v but there getting kinda rare



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T in NE

10-01-2013 21:49:39




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 10-01-2013 05:20:39  
The old Cummins trucks are getting "rare", as you say, because of wrecks, or the bodies falling apart around the drivetrain. Not because of the engine. Plus you have to consider, the last 12 valve Cummins put in a new pick-up is now 15-16 years old. When looking at 15-year-old gas pick-ups, there aren't near as many of those around as there used to be when they were newer, either.



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G1355

10-01-2013 05:02:13




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to super trucker, 09-28-2013 06:48:52  
It's funny in the 80s on back everyone got by fine without a diesel truck, and a gas truck would pull three tractors just fine, look at all the old grain trucks, they were all gas.



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Super Trucker

10-01-2013 11:45:22




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 10-01-2013 05:02:13  
Do you even read the post's or just spew your venom ? I NEVER SAID A GAS COULDN'T DO IT , IT WON'T DO MORE EFFICIENTLY then a diesel. I don't have bottomless pockets for gas so I have to save where I can to still enjoy this great hobby.



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blue924.9

10-01-2013 05:28:46




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 10-01-2013 05:02:13  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see yes, that may be, but 1. they were insanely low geared, 2. the bigger ones used 400-600 cubic inch motors. 3. they used gas like you wouldnt believe, 2 or 3 was the norm in the big gassers, and 4. they dont make very many gas grain trucks anymore, why do you suppose that it



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blue924.9

10-01-2013 05:28:23




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 10-01-2013 05:02:13  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see yes, that may be, but 1. they were insanely low geared, 2. the bigger ones used 400-600 cubic inch motors. 3. they used gas like you wouldnt believe, 2 or 3 was the norm in the big gassers, and 4. they dont make very many gas grain trucks anymore, why do you suppose that it



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blue924.9

09-28-2013 08:42:05




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to super trucker, 09-28-2013 06:48:52  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

there are a lot of gas tractors out there, especially in the somewhat older years, and in cold climates where people couldnt wait for hours while there diesel was plugged in, and todays tractors, i have no clue cause the new ones suck in my opinion



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David G

09-21-2013 17:43:31




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I could easily get by with a gasser, but enjoy driving my diesel.



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ericlb

09-21-2013 05:43:34




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
i agree it doesnt mater what you can justify, you buy what youy want i couldnt justify my '38 chevy street rod, either but i sure had a lot of fun with it lol



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PretendFarmer

09-20-2013 04:09:03




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I haul regularly during the spring summer and fall months to tractor pulls. Some loads can get to 12000. Counting truck about 19000. So yea, I am glad I got the diesel.



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WGWKy2

09-19-2013 18:26:59




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
You guys are funny, trying to convince yourselves that you need gas or diesel when most don't even need a truck. You buy what you want not what you need. Banks make that possible, no I'm not a banker, but I drive a truck with nothing in it 98% of the time because I want to.



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soundguy

09-21-2013 19:00:40




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to WGWKy2, 09-19-2013 18:26:59  
wow.. my truck never has 'nothing' in it.

I carry tools and equipment that would 100% fill the trunk in a small to medium car. need em for work.

I also carry some extra clothes and a few items i might need on long weekends. Both my jobs are away from my house / farm.. so I have to have stuff with me. Car just wouldn't do it.

Besides. never know when you will pass a yard sale.. or farm sale.. or auction.. and need a vehicle big enough to set 2 tractor tires int he back, along with your 3 tool boxes. :)

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Ralph Bauer

09-27-2013 20:35:34




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to soundguy, 09-21-2013 19:00:40  
Ohhh, so well spoken, Soundguy!! Nuttin' left for me to add!!
Ralphie in OK.



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soundguy

09-28-2013 12:46:50




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Ralph Bauer, 09-27-2013 20:35:34  
twice in recent months I have driven back into town and passed an auction. 1 time i drove home with a dearborn 10-1 plow in the back.. and the next i had 2 16.9-24 turf tires on rims with centers.

woulda looked funny in a car. :)



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soundguy

09-19-2013 17:14:21




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
very similar to what i saw / experienced.

I was pulling often and my 98 1500 4x4 dodge with a 5.9 gasser was 1, just not HD enough, 2, wasn't super fuel efficient. not sure on the rear.. felt like near 3.73 or simial.. don't remember now..

I sold it and got a 99 f350 4x4 drw with a 7.3psd and 4.10 rear.

I have MUCH more tow capability, stability and breaking power. I get no worse fuel economy.. maybee even better. Acceleration? ok.. the 98 gasser , EMPTY took off a bit faster thant he PSD.. but loaded.. the psd sucks the doors off the 5.9 gasser...

service costs are NEAR a wash. I was doing 3k oil changes on the gasser using walmart oil at 6qts plus filters.. and 8500 on the diesel using a good synthetic at 15 qts, plus filters.. no spark plugs or wires or any ignition stuff. the diesel, per year.. may cost a bit more on the service.. but if so.. not much.. enough to call it a wash..

I can't see NOT keeping a diesel... especially if you pull a trailer or have large loads in your bed.

I had to go pick up a buddies broke down full size conversion passabger van out of south georgia a while back. blew down the interstate to get it.. and ran a lil slower onthe way back. the old dodge would not have done that for me...

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T in NE

09-29-2013 10:36:13




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to soundguy, 09-19-2013 17:14:21  
Your 98 probably had 3.92s. They had 4.10, 3.92, and 3.55's available. Chevy ran (runs?) 3.73s and I think it would be a better option behind the 318 and 360 than the 3.92s.

The 01 318 half-ton I had was twice the truck our 98 360-powered 3/4-ton was, and it didn't tear up the transmission, either.



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soundguy

09-30-2013 05:59:35




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to T in NE, 09-29-2013 10:36:13  
very well could have been the 3.92.. deffintely wasn't 4.1

can't remember the rpm on the freeway enough to palce it at 3.55 or 3.92.. but i'll bet it was 3.92



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G1355

09-19-2013 18:46:50




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to soundguy, 09-19-2013 17:14:21  
I hope the f350 would out pull a 1500 espicially when the ford is geared lower. Be a different story with a 5.9 in a 2500 or 3500 and 4:10s, or a hemi which has more power and 4:56 gears



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soundguy

09-20-2013 13:36:22




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 09-19-2013 18:46:50  
point is.. for a gas engine.. it was not a small one. and the 7.3 psd is no speed demon... however very reliable..



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uncle henry

09-18-2013 12:27:16




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
i have to have a diesel my truck and trailer weigh in at about 17,000lbs and when i load it no less than 30,000lbs all together and you can"t sleep in the back seat of a gasser



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John M

09-17-2013 14:38:03




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
But he can outrun you!!!!!!!!! He beat a Duramax!!!!!!



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G1355

09-17-2013 18:41:59




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to John M, 09-17-2013 14:38:03  
I will be right beside him pulling to!



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John M

09-18-2013 03:25:51




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 09-17-2013 18:41:59  
Whatever!



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G1355

09-18-2013 05:08:53




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to John M, 09-18-2013 03:25:51  
You can have a diesel, it isn't gonna pull good unless its geared right, you just look at its a diesel it's gonna pull good, but that's not the case. There's more than a motor that comes into play when pulling.



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John M

09-18-2013 08:21:18




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 09-18-2013 05:08:53  
Again, whatever! I dont need a fancy truck to cover up the size of my manhood!



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PretendFarmer

09-18-2013 12:09:33




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to John M, 09-18-2013 08:21:18  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

There's no denying that some dudes buy bigger rigs to cover up for a lack of something. Kinda like the dudes that work out till they can't turn their heads at all. I don't need any of that. If I did, it wouldn't be a 16year old diesel Dodge Ram.



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T in NE

09-19-2013 18:59:58




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 09-18-2013 12:09:33  
HA HA BEATCHA!!!!

Mine's 23 years old. I can send it to town to buy my beer.

Well, I COULD, but it just doesn't seem to understand the route. Would be cool if it did, it could take the dog and he could get my groceries while they are there!



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PretendFarmer

09-18-2013 07:46:19




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to G1355, 09-18-2013 05:08:53  
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oh please. I just got done pulling 12000lbs up and down mountain terrain with my 97 cummins geared with 3.55:1. But your right, diesels are useless pieces of sh**.



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Dean Olson

09-16-2013 22:33:31




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I can and did justify a diesel over gas!

I agree with your findings. My fuel milage is a little better at 20-21mpg on the open road and 14-15 loaded heavy around town.

I'll add a few more opinions.

I bought a 06 Dodge Mega Cab with the 5.9 Cummins. Motor has been trouble free for 192,000 miles so far. I expect it will run close to double that and my cost per mile to own gets lower every mile.

It's been pd for for several years and I sure don't miss payments.

I bought the diesel mega cab because of the room & I can leave it running in 100 degree weather and the AC still blows cold. Cruise can be set, when parked, so that the engine rpm is run up to a fast idle just like the big rigs. I'm a Realtor and it pays to keep my clients cool when out looking at homes.

If you can stand to drive the same vehicle for 3-400,000 miles, I think a diesel is a lot cheaper to own than gas.

My previous experience with gas trucks is somewhere around 150k they are junk. I've never gotten a rebuilt motor the was worth it. I think it has to do with our heat down here in Houston.

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WayneB

09-16-2013 13:09:03




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
Here is my humorous bottom line. Those that live in the suburbs, you may need to drive a gasser, hybrid or electric. You'll wake your neighbors warming up the 4x4 dually with a camper shell and no trailer hitch, and really, it won't get very good mileage.
If you are really concerned about air quality, ride a bicyle or get an electric car, as long as your grid is not produced by coal. If you are a farmer, business man, etc, do the math, run your likes and dislikes and do as you please, and I wish for you with all my heart you can balance the books and make money.
If anyone has been taken by gunpoint to the dealer and made buy a diesel, please share the story. Really, I need a good laugh.

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jimg.allentown

09-16-2013 06:39:28




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
Let me say a few words here about "chips" in your computers....

First let me ask how many of the people in this crowd believe in clean water, air, and soil??

Having been to several manufacturers schools on emissions and emission technology, I have gained a respect for what a manufacturer has to comply with to even get a vehicle to market. All manufacturere that want to sell vehicles in the US have to satisfy THREE major parameters: EPA - they set limits on emissions of polloutant.
CAFE - they set limits on fuel consumption.
THE PUBLIC - set limits on what they will tolerate in terms of performance and economy.

Now, some kid in a garage somewhere with a computer can take the programming and "improve" it. Yeah. And there is born a faster or more powerful engine that no longer meets the legal standards that the manufacturer had to meet in order to legally sell that vehicle to the public. Then I see one of them going down the highway pouring out thick black smoke......

Not a real big deal seemingly as the smoke slowly dissipates and the air clears....BUT now multiply that by the 10 MILLION or so diesel pickups on the road and what do you get?

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gtx1967jewison@yahoo.com

10-10-2013 21:13:21




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to jimg.allentown, 09-16-2013 06:39:28  
You get not even one small forest fire, or a tiny cumsh%t from a small volcano.



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VicS

09-20-2013 10:57:52




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to jimg.allentown, 09-16-2013 06:39:28  
O come on now. You know they (manufacturers) never sell us a engine tuned for max power. They always leave something for next year and the next and so on. A good example is a Compact John Deere 4320- 48 hp then a 4720-66 hp. I have looked at the part numbers of these tractors. The only difference is the injectors. Can buy them for 1800. JD wants over 7000 more for a 4720 over a 4320.



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PretendFarmer

09-20-2013 11:27:30




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to VicS, 09-20-2013 10:57:52  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

Another fine example is a 1990's Dodge with a cummins. Engine is pretty much capable of 500hp. Yet they sold them tuned to 180hp sometimes 160hp and others were 215. OF course my tranny is beefed so I could tune it.



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PretendFarmer

09-17-2013 04:15:50




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to jimg.allentown, 09-16-2013 06:39:28  

jimg.allentown said: (quoted from post at 14:39:28 09/16/13) Let me say a few words here about "chips" in your computers....

First let me ask how many of the people in this crowd believe in clean water, air, and soil??

Having been to several manufacturers schools on emissions and emission technology, I have gained a respect for what a manufacturer has to comply with to even get a vehicle to market. All manufacturere that want to sell vehicles in the US have to satisfy THREE major parameters:
EPA - they set limits on emissions of polloutant.

CAFE - they set limits on fuel consumption.

THE PUBLIC - set limits on what they will tolerate in terms of performance and economy.
Now, some kid in a garage somewhere with a computer can take the programming and "improve" it. Yeah. And there is born a faster or more powerful engine that no longer meets the legal standards that the manufacturer had to meet in order to legally sell that vehicle to the public. Then I see one of them going down the highway pouring out thick black smoke......

Not a real big deal seemingly as the smoke slowly dissipates and the air clears....BUT now multiply that by the 10 MILLION or so diesel pickups on the road and what do you get?


If someone is pouring out black smoke, its because they are a complete idiot and their truck is tuned to run like crap and they think its cool.

I own a 97 12valve cummins tuned with minimal smoke.

My buddy drives a new 6.7L cummins with the epa crap gone and tuned. Just had to go through emissions with it and passed with flying colors. That makes me really want to know why they slap all that emissions crap on, when he could easily get it to pass without it. And his mileage has increased big time without it which in turn makes the vehicle better on your beautiful planet because it consumes less.

All in all: you cant stop idiots from being idiots and you'll simply get a big headache trying. Just because idiots are there doesnt mean the vast majority of diesels arent a good or great thing.

So all in all, I drive a diesel because it tows well and because I love to hug trees, like you.
This post was edited by PretendFarmer at 04:17:58 09/17/13.

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T in NE

09-17-2013 20:33:00




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 09-17-2013 04:15:50  
If you want to blow smoke like that on the track, go for it. Don't do it on the highway. It's stupid, lowers fuel mileage, and gets people's attention on the matter.

You can get the new ones to run really clean and not blow smoke even with full deletes.

How much smoke my 90 Cummins blows depends on how smoky I feel like making it when I fuel up. But I usually put a pint of 2-stroke in it when I fill it. A quart is too much, my top speed is about 85, and with a full quart in the tank, I can still blow smoke at 75.

Just think, these early Cummins trucks were "green" before green was "green". The engine is capable of running over a half million miles, they don't require any exotic metals or alloys to make batteries, they get 20+ MPG highway, unless it's got 4.10 gears, and they are simple enough to rebuild any of the components that may fail over the weekend in the driveway.

I figure I could spend 2 years worth of new-truck payments on my heap on upgrades, and unless someone runs into it, I can still be driving it long after obsolete or expensive electronics and emi$$ions parts have taken the new one off the road.

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Ken Macfarlane

09-18-2013 12:08:26




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to T in NE, 09-17-2013 20:33:00  
There is more to pollution than soot otherwise we wouldn't have all the stuff on gas vehicles to reduce their pollution.



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jimg.allentown

09-17-2013 07:53:50




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to PretendFarmer, 09-17-2013 04:15:50  
My buddy drives a new 6.7L cummins with the epa crap gone and tuned. Just had to go through emissions with it and passed with flying colors. That makes me really want to know why they slap all that emissions crap on, when he could easily get it to pass without it. And his mileage has increased big time without it which in turn

Not all of the EPA crap works to the good. Much of it is to reduce the NOx emissions. Inherently, diesels have very low CO2 and HC emissions. Their primary emissions that are to be controlled are NOx and particulates. Particulates are the visible portion that shows up as smoke. NOx are oxides of nitrogen that are formed at high combustion temperatures. Passing an emissions test is not an indication of low NOx emissions. NOx tests have to be done under load, and require some very expensive and sophisticated equipment. As such, removing "EPA crap" usually results only in increased NOx emissions, and will pass aftermarket emission tests.

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G1355

09-15-2013 19:09:44




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I can get 17 unloaded with my hemi, 8 with 15,000 loaded, and its trouble free, and I beat my buddies 2007 6.6 duramax that has a 135hp bully dog chip and 40hp injectors, he can sure blow smoke, but its not nothing fast. Not to mention I don't have the extra cost of all the new diesels with def fluid, I like my hemi and either way if I buy a truck it's gonna be a dodge, I have nothing against the cummins either. And yes I drive diesel trucks everyday at work, none impress me. Everyone has there own preference and the dodge is mine.

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The tractor vet

09-15-2013 10:23:14




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I have had both , had a 88 F350 4X4 cab and chassie 5 speed 4.10 gears with a custom 9 foot flat bed , i pulled a 28 foot gosseneck . I bought it well used and abused with 68000 miles on it . Had a ton of problems with it and even though i bought it used Ford was looking for this truck as there was a massive recall on it . Well a local Ford dealer did all the recalls and even a new paint job . and the problems were still there . After six or seven computers a bunch of sensors it was starting to be a good truck and why i was lucky on fuel mileage i have no idea maybe it was due to the fact that i had changed the timing gears on the crank and cam and went back to the pre 72 cam timing or what but truck only i would pull down over 15 mpg with the truck weighing in at 7500 lbs empty when the trailer was hooked to the truck and it weighed in at 7500 i would drop down to 12-13 then with a full load of either tractors or implement and that being maybe 4 to six transport disc's or maybe four semi mount plows and four disc's and what ever else i could stack on top of all that a couple thousand pounds of ft. weights and a set or two of duals it would go down to 10 MPG. and yes i kept records . at times i was changing oil twice a week due to the miles i was running . and at times i had way more on then i should have . I put 287000 miles on that truck . Now i have a Dodge with a Cumming . Would i go back to the 460 ?? not on your life , are there things i don't like about my Dodge you betya (1) i plum do not like the fact that it does not have lock out hubs (2) plum hate the ft wheel bearings . (3) don't like the 4.10 gears in mine . But do i want a gasser NOPE , i can work on mine with out a scan tool i do not have to change plugs just change oil and filters . Will my Cumming beat a 5.0 Mustang Nope But it gets down the highway just fine and PULLS the little hump and bumps great . I don't run all over four states anymore looking for sales and the most i pull now is the bale wagon or fertilizer buggy with six ton in it and as long as i can top Teegarden hill at 50 with six ton in forth gear i am happy. Your Hemi will not do that. And neither will a 460 .

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T in NE

09-15-2013 11:54:27




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to The tractor vet, 09-15-2013 10:23:14  
Repeat after me- "THERE IS NO 'G' IN CUMMINS"- OK, sorry, got that outta the way.

What year is it? Dynatrac has locking hubs and servicable wheel bearings for 94-up trucks now.

And if it's got the p-pump (Bosch P7100, 94-98), all it takes is an Allen wrench and you can have that kid in the Mustang spending big bucks to outrun you again.



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The tractor vet

09-15-2013 12:24:26




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to T in NE, 09-15-2013 11:54:27  
It has a P pump and it is a 95 . Yes it is tweaked as far as i want , yes it will fog for skeeters . Yes i can get MORE but then ya need to SPEND more to upgrade this then that . I am happy with where it is set and that is all that matters to me . It will twist 3 grand if needed but for the most part she never runs much over 22-2400 . And only has 151000 miles on it , and i intend to still be driven it till the day they plant me . Then the War Dept and dig a big hole and put me and my Goat in it and back fill.

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The tractor vet

09-15-2013 12:21:00




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to T in NE, 09-15-2013 11:54:27  
It has a P pump and it is a 95 . Yes it is tweaked as far as i want , yes it will fog for skeeters . Yes i can get MORE but then ya need to SPEND more to upgrade this then that . I am happy with where it is set and that is all that matters to me .



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chucksoliver77

09-15-2013 12:03:05




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to T in NE, 09-15-2013 11:54:27  

T in NE said: (quoted from post at 23:54:27 09/15/13) Repeat after me- "THERE IS NO 'G' IN CUMMINS"- OK, sorry, got that outta the way.

What year is it? Dynatrac has locking hubs and servicable wheel bearings for 94-up trucks now.
And if it's got the p-pump (Bosch P7100, 94-98), all it takes is an Allen wrench and you can have that kid in the Mustang spending big bucks to outrun you again.


So your saying turn the screw on the pump and that truck will run the 1/4 mile in 12.60 at 112mph instead of 17.50 at 75mph, wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, Chuck
This post was edited by chucksoliver77 at 12:05:06 09/15/13.

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T in NE

09-16-2013 00:25:12




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to chucksoliver77, 09-15-2013 12:03:05  
Of course that depends on how good the kid in the mustang is, too.



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Nick m

09-15-2013 06:26:15




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I've noticed most people that gripe about diesels have never experienced them in the real world. My 01 dodge 4x4 5 speed diesel can get 20mpg empty. I've done it a couple times. Normally averages 17. Pulling is 12 to 15, depending on the load. I had a v10 dodge for about 6 months. What a turd that was. 10mpg empty and lots of problems. Even if it cost more to operate a diesel, I'd keep it just because I like it. Just like the tractors I have. I sure can't justify spending 60000+ on a new diesel though.

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welding man

09-15-2013 06:23:13




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
I'm not a young kid with an ego, I'm an old man, have worked for over 40 years in a tough profession. I probably can't justify a diesel either,but I LIKE DIESELs,I work on them for a living and that's the reason I drive one.Yes it's got a Chip and chrome stack and an exhaust brake, air bags and a few more goodies. Couldn't care less how much it costs to change the oil or how much milage it gets, it's my pleasure vehicle,to tow my antique tractors. It gets me away from the daily grind of being in business for yourself and the relaxiation of changing gears and hearing the diesel purr. One of the few things that an old man can enjoy and feel like a kid again. I'm at a point in life I don't have to justify anything,just enjoy it.

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varmint

09-16-2013 20:21:32




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to welding man, 09-15-2013 06:23:13  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

i gotta go along with thet - a hundred pur cent



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VicS

09-19-2013 11:51:10




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to varmint, 09-16-2013 20:21:32  
That's where I'm at too! :-) Vic



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bobs old iron

09-14-2013 23:25:37




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 Re: I tried,,,, Cant justify a diesel tow vehicle. in reply to Rmf1066, 09-14-2013 21:11:59  
this topic has come up many of times, you're not alone on subject, myself have often woundered if i should get a gasser, but like your figures show, [maybe a little different] if using it enough, i rather have the power of a diesel, not chipped either, and it still pulls my trailers fine...



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