Called mets and bounds

da.bees

Well-known Member
I'm trying to sell a shirt tail size piece of land to a man that can't get past how the
parcel is shaped. It's fenced and just standing on it,it's obivously very close to being
retcangular with one little trapizod at one end. He told me that a friend drew it out on
paper according to called mets and bounds from my deed and the lines don't close. Anyone
care to tell me if lines close if I give you called mets and bounds? I told him I would
sell it as 5.2 acres,have it surveyed at my expense then pro-rate the amount +/- 5 acres
but that doesn't satisfy him. To answer the obivous question,no,I will not have it surveyed
just to prove how it's shaped and how many acres are in it.
 
Sell it as a parcel, not acres. So much for the parcel, period. Sounds like he is trying to nickel and dime you.

Surveying is expensive! Might want to get an estimate before selling as it may be more than the parcel is worth.
 
It might depend on whether he gets a loan to buy the land. The lender will be real serious about the exact dimensions and then the description in the deed.

When I bought my 7.5 acres, lender sent somebody out to walk the property lines. When he couldn't, the lender required a new survey if I wanted to buy the land; paid for by the seller....

Other issue might be the Title Company, since they are insuring the land and descriptions being accurate, they too want everything tidy and wrapped up; no vagueness.

Of course if the buyer pays cash and no Title insurance, then it's just convincing him that everything is OK.

Land disputes are just part of deal when selling raw land out in the country.
 
Usually when I deal with meets and bounds around here,it's lakefront and one side is water.
 
If you know where the boundaries are and the neighbors agree, go out and mark at least the corners. Rarely will you find a deed description that matches what is on the ground. Most are off by a bit if you are in an area that uses mets and bounds. If have seen a description that was as simple as bounded on each side by... with a listing of the neighbors.
 
I don't know why someone would express interest in a piece of property just to be a pain. It doesn't sound like there would be any major issue over what's really there. Buyer expecting perfection is unrealistic. And his "friend" is an authority?

No metes and bounds here. Chains, links, and maybe perches?

Sounds like you all need a modern survey. But as you indicate, you need some assurance that it will do some good before spending the money.
 
If I'm not mistaken, surveyors have a software program into which they enter their field taken metes and bounds descriptions (distances and angles etc) and it will force closure by slightly adjusting a distance or angle as required. Then they modify their description accordingly so it indeed closes. Such can still be done long hand but it takes quite a bit of work. Prior to EDM and now GPS surveyor equipment it wasn't surprising to me for a description to not close perfect.

Over several years of buying and selling many faRMS I don't think any ever ended up being the exact acreage called for in the OLD deeds. IE at the end of the deeds legal description it was stated 120 acres MORE OR LESS.

A registered land surveyor is qualified to render an expert opinion in a court of law.

I'm NOT going to open a can of worms regarding the legal doctrine of Adverse Possession, that takes entire law libraries to describe lol

John T BSEE, JD Attorney at Law
 
In my country I can go to county home page on internet. Go to beacon. Put in address it will bring up everything on the tax records, acreage, aerial view of property lines, who owns property, assessment, amount of taxes, everything you need, even legal description of property.

Go to your court house and see if they have a similar service.

If I want a building permit, they go to beacon, look at zoning, board of health uses it to determine if property is not in flood plane.
 
(quoted from post at 13:58:30 02/07/17) I'm trying to sell a shirt tail size piece of land to a man that can't get past how the
parcel is shaped. It's fenced and just standing on it,it's obivously very close to being
retcangular with one little trapizod at one end. He told me that a friend drew it out on
paper according to called mets and bounds from my deed and the lines don't close. Anyone
care to tell me if lines close if I give you called mets and bounds? I told him I would
sell it as 5.2 acres,have it surveyed at my expense then pro-rate the amount +/- 5 acres
but that doesn't satisfy him. To answer the obivous question,no,I will not have it surveyed
just to prove how it's shaped and how many acres are in it.

I live in Michigan, I can go to the county website, type in the parcel number, and get a view that has the lot lines superimposed on it. They are very accurate, imho.
 
Bob: The term "mets and bounds" can be modern. It just means that the parcel is not a regular shape and is not in an area laid out in sections. The deed description starts at one corner and give directions in angles/degrees and distances to the next change in direction. If the survey is good the ends will meet exactly. In real life they rarely meet exactly unless that have been surveyed with modern/GPS equipment. So most Counties that have "mets and bounds" deeds have a tolerance on how close the ends must be. This is called closure and is defined as percentage of the total.
 
If your selling a small piece of ground, put a price on it and call it more or less. It is for sale for what you are asking for the total parcel.
 
A lot of metes & bounds descriptions in deeds are wrong! When I plotted my farm out it was just a zigzag line. I went over the old deeds & found 9 errors. Every secretary who typed it up made 1 to 3 errors in typing. Only by going back to the original deed written 100 years ago did I get the correct description. Sounds like that may be your problem. And the tax maps at the courthouse are not exact; have found numerous errors on them.
 
When i had my place surveyed i found out that there is adjustment built into a survey to compensate for the curvature of the earth. Basically a forty is supposed to be 1320 feet on my farm the south forty is 1326 feet and the farthest north line is 1319 feet. It was a surprise to me that i never thought of.
 

Get it surveyed, platted, and sell it as a urban parcel price.


or do meets and bounds, via simple survey and sell it at rural price.

His choice. You cant argue with stupid.
 
He might be correct and maybe not. What counts is what is on the original deed, regardless if in feet, metes and bounds, links and chains, etc. Sometimes (like often in parts of New York) - original surveys done in the 1700s are difficult to figure out. In that case, usually a court and and a judge decides. A professional survey proves nothing. It is just one person's expert "opinion."
 
Depends on what you mean by "accurate". I've got property in St. Clair County Michigan. I purchased an aerial shot off the view and the county map that you describe has property lines that are about 10-20' off in both directions. (Both onscreen and on paper). Not readily apparent unless you have a fence line on the boundary or if it shows buildings on the neighbor's parcel. Both true in my case. It's good enough to give a rough idea of the parcel size/shape and identify who owns the parcels, though. As for the general topic, I've got 3 different surveys for my property with up to 2 acre size difference (53A vs 55.5A). Last one was done in 2004 with modern equipment and is the most accurate. I've checked a lot of vs the monument markers for the section with a 300' tape and transit. I'm amazed at how close earlier surveys are considering those guys were using chains and transits, stomping through forests and swamps.
 

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