Question on central AC

David G

Well-known Member
My house AC is about 14 years old, works fine, but will fail sometime.

It is a 3 ton; but how can I tell how many seer it is now, and does the seer really make a difference?
 
The SEER may be noted on the serial number tag on the outside unit.

There would have been a yellow paper label, which is probably long gone, or it could be on the tag itself. Researching the model and serial number may provide it.

From 92 to 00 they ranged from 10 to 12 SEER.
 
We went from no seer no. To a 13 with a heat pump. Probably has saved us more than it cost. Our electric bill is just 1/2 what it was. And our rate is up almost 30 percent. But we went all the way. Two new refrigerators, front load washer and drier that turns off when clothes get dry. And led bulbs or squiggly bulbs. Oh and a heat pump water heater.
 
Yes, you will notice a big difference! At least I did. I didn't go with 18 SEER though, don't remember what it is but it cut my electric bill in half!

The SEER rating is mostly controlled by the gov as to what can be sold and installed in your area. Installation also plays a big part. Proper sizing of the unit, replacing the line set with the proper size, the R rating of the duct work, the sizing of the duct work, how well it is sealed, how well the return is designed, proper refrigerant charge, airflow to the condenser unit, all contribute to the SEER.

I noticed the new unit was much bigger than the old, even though it was the same tonnage. The condenser was twice the size, required a new pad. The inside unit was taller, wider, had a larger motor, evap, and flows more air than the old one.

That is something to consider when buying the system, will it fit where the old one is without major reconstruction? I did mine myself, took my time fitting everything. It would have cost a fortune to have this installed, or they would have did a half donkey job and called it done!

So far I am well pleased with it. I also went with the heat pump since I don't have nat gas and live in a mild winter climate.
 
The problem with SEER is that the manufacturers have set prices high enough for each level of SEER that the prices wipe out a good chunk of the electrical savings. Didn't used to be that way, but it is now!
 
Chances are a 14 year old A/C is less than 13 SEER, maybe only 10. Anything made after 2005 is 13 or more, and that jumped to 14 for southern states in 2015.

If your current A/C has an SEER of 12 and you replace it with an 18 SEER unit, the new unit should use 33% less energy. So yes, it will make a noticeable difference in your electric bill. If your A/C is breaking down every year or two, it's time to bite the bullet and buy a new one. And you might as well bump up the SEER from whatever the minimum is; the higher-priced unit will pay for itself in a few years.
 
Google your model number if the energy efficient rating isn't on the label. If it's a 12 don't even think about replacing it untill it dies. Unless you go with a very high seer you won't see much difference in power consumption and longevity will be much less than what you have now. Contrary to what the folks selling you a unit tell you the payoff time on an 18 vs a 13 or 14 is longer than the life expectancy of the unit. Cost is just too much for the higher end units. There are several online charts to calculate the payoff and it isn't hard to compare but most folks won't bother.
 
David,
Just put unit in my mother's home and min seer here is 14. higher available. Biggest problem there was dad speced a 5 ton unit when they built and it was too big; very short cycle time and the unit didn't take that well. My home unit went 30 years and jumped to a seer of 12 [4 years ago] from 2. Yes; 2. My electric bill dropped 75%.

These days 14 years is a good long run. You may want to consider a hard look at air balance since that makes a big difference in comfort level and system efficiency.
 
(quoted from post at 09:10:46 07/25/16) The problem with SEER is that the manufacturers have set prices high enough for each level of SEER that the prices wipe out a good chunk of the electrical savings. Didn't used to be that way, but it is now!

It's been that way for at least 35 years. When the 95% efficient furnaces hit the market back then, they were priced at least twice, and some three times what the usual 75% efficient furnace cost. Sure there was additional cost to make the 95%, but how they were sold was on energy cost savings; that they would break even in so many years and then save money from then. The potential savings made it easier to justify the inflated cost.

Same time frame the Feds had a 40% tax credit if you installed a solar water heater. I lived in an upscale neighborhood, so the solar guys were everywhere trying to convince me it was a good idea to spend $4000 on a solar heater; I'd get 40% of the $4000 back on my taxes! No sale.

A friend sold the same kind of water heater and he told me the wholesale price was about $300 and he sold them for $1000 installed. My neighbor came home one afternoon and a crew was installing a water heater on her roof. They assumed they could intimidate her into buying it since it was already up there. She called the cops and they had to take everything down. Scum....

I was talking to the customer service at York AC, asked him what changed to go from 10 to 13 SEER? He said they installed another 30 feet of tubing in the condenser, and that was it. But a 13 SEER was about a $1000 more than a 10. I bought the 10 because my AC might run 5 hours a month, I use a whole house fan and a really well insulated home, so don't need AC. Only if it's 100+ for more than 3 days do I need the AC.
 
David, My last central ac lasted 29 years. 14 years isn't that old. Check to make sure condenser isn't dirty. Oil fan if possible. My Bryant is 16 years old, no problems.

To answer your question SEER ratings don't include the air handler blower motor, only looks at the condensing unit outside. So do figures lie or do lyres figure? SEER is somewhat miss leading, yet a way to get some idea of the efficiency. I think EPA mandates a minimum SEER rating on all new units. Google it if you want to find out.

16 years ago I went with a 12 seer, Bryant because it had an expansion valve and high pressure limit switch. At the time my other choice was cap tubs, no limits and only an 8 or 10 seer. I cool 2000+ ft super insulated home with a 2.5 ton unit.

Don't replace if it's still working.

My unfinished basement floor stays around 55 year around. I have to run a dehumidifier in spring, summer and fall. This year I decided to pull more air 55 degree air off basement floor and run it through AC, dehumidifier hasn't kicked on since I started air conditioning. So I concluded the air is dryer using AC instead of dehumidifier.

Guess you could say I have FREE GEO thermal cooling. Air conditioner doesn't run very long. House is very comfortable too. Basement is dry. I leave basement door open too. I never open windows and let in humidity.
geo
 
Don't change till you have to. Also, the new coolant doesn't cool as well so I would recommend you go up at least 1/2 ton when you do. I just replaced my 3 ton last year to gain a heat pump. I replaced the air handler also but it doesn't dehumidify the air as well so I end up setting it a couple of degrees cooler to stay comfortable. The end result is that the higher seer unit costs about to keep house comfortable than the old unit. I had the highest bill I've ever had the 1st month I had the new unit. I will say that I love the heat pump though and it has saved a lot of propane and wood.

Charlie
 
One option may be to buy a "dry" replacement R-22 unit. Reclaim the R-22 from your old unit and charge into the new unit after evacuating the system. I did this on my house recently and bought a new 3 ton outdoor heatpump unit for $1400. If the new outdoor unit comes with a new accurater make sure to install it at the indoor unit. I had recently replaced the fan on my air handler so I should be good to go for many years.
 
Dunno what the big deal is, you can buy all the R22 you will ever need for $15 to $20 a pound on ebay.
 
Was your duct system built with duct board? If so, you also may want to consider replacing that with metal duct while you've got a contractor in there. My home was built in '94 and I had not realized they used ductboard for the main sections. That stuff can be a health hazard when it ages ... the fiberglass dries out and goes airborne. Just a thought.
 

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