Who makes the best semi

NCWayne

Well-known Member
Got a customer looking for a new semi to move his equipment. He's looking for a day cab, and needs a wet line to run a dump trailer, as well as a drop neck trailer.

He looking at everything, but really needs something older, with out all of the electronics and emissions on the newer ones, so it's easier to work on when needed.

He's been looking at Peterbuilts as that's what he has now, but I'm sure he'd be open to any brand if it will stand up to the use.

So, I know a lot of you guys have, or have drive them over the years, so what, in your opinion, is the best brand out there that would fit this criteria?

Too, if anyone knows where he could rent a truck with a wet line kit, please let me know as he's in dire straights until he can find something, or decides to repair the one he's got.

Thanks for any info ya'll can provide.
 
Hello NCWayne,

Best truck in the Mobil fleet was an IH with an 6v92 307HP, DD. That was the truck with the least amount of maintenance we ever had. We had them all......


Guido.
 
We have Macks at work, one of the older ones has close to 3 million miles on it. I know it was just rebuilt last year. We do have 2 or 3 for sale right now I think. One is a Sterling. I have included my work email if you think he may be interested Ill send you my bosses contact info.
 
I used to own and lease trucks and if had to do it again Id stick to a MACK no doubt about it. Maybe not the bells and whistles and comfort of Petes and KW but to work and make money Id go Mack.



John T
 
It's not just about brand, it's also how it is speced. A lightweight freight hauling truck from a fleet won't take it hauling heavy haul or even 80,000 loads in and out of jobsites and up twisting backwoods roads. They were designed to haul moderate loads on highway long distance and get good mileage. At work we have a half dozen Kenworth T800 tractors that haul 100 yard trash trailers, been good trucks, 2006 year with C13 cat engines,all have 5 to 600 thousand miles. Myself if I were looking for my own personal use I would be after a Kenworth or international no newer than late 90s for easier repair. Mack and others make a good truck too but I just am not as familiar with them personally.
 
Stay pre 2010 Mack tho, our 3 Mack trucks at work that are def treatment have been terrible hassle, codes that happen for no apparent reason, derating and having to plug laptop in and regen on the road to make it home, they aren't built like a Mack truck anymore, now it's more like a Microsoft computer with more glitches than an IPhone
 
That depends on his taste.
If he wants a head turner with driver comfort and other bells and whistles he wants a Pete or KW
If he wants cheaper he wants a IH or Freightliner
If he wants get down in the dirt and grunt stick with a Mack

From there he could spec what he needs because while a road truck will pull equipment; It will not stand up to the abuse over the long term.
 
Can't say which is best, but I would stay away from International. Really it comes down to the individual truck and how it was served, especially for heavy haul. Best thing to do is get on truck paper or some similar sight and start looking.
 
Under the cab, they are all the same. All trucks are built with the same components, built by the same suppliers, just different specs for the job you want it to do.

IH,(Navistar) has more dealers nationwide than any other brand. Part prices are usually better also.
I had one Pete, one is enough. Stayed with International after that.
 
For what he is looking to do, I would say a Mack. I live in coal country, and the predominant brand is Mack. There are a few Petercars, and KW's, but I would say that for every Paccar product on the road around here there are 4 times as many Mack's. You couldnt give a IH away, unless its for highway freight. Western Star made a big splash back in the late 90's/early 2000's but you hardly ever see one now. From what Ive seen it has more to do with how a truck is spec'd out (double frame, heavy rears, full locker rears, and lots of gears/deep reduction) but with that being said you cant flick a booger around and and not hit a R model, Superliner, or a pre-volvo CH.
 
Ok here we go , i am sure i will be tacked to the wall drug down the road and whipped For whqat you or i should say your friend wants to do with a semi tractor of pulling a dump trailer and also pulling a low boy for this you just don't run out and buy any old day cab ROAD tractor . First ya what some pony power under the hood . Well if your buying new today ya don't have the choice like we use to . So what you want is a heavy speced tractor Myself i would want a 14200 ft. axle then 44's-46 rears with locking , Some get down stump pulling gears say like nothing lower the 4.10 and maybe even 4.44 Now as to transmission here ya have to think of just who is driving it , him or Billy Bob and what will be the heaviest load . Hp. now today nothing less then 475 This will also dictate transmission and a ten speed is not the transmission to think about . IF you have a good real driver then a 13 speed will do if you have Billy Bob then a 8 Lo Lo that way he does not have to remove his shoes to count the gears to remember where he was at . Mack, or I H is my preference and as for a wheel base around 210-220 that way you have room for a good headach rack and a nice winch a nice flat deck plate . Winches are really nice when you own heavy equipment that way when one of them pieces of IRON breaks down you can set the trailer and move the tractor around and winch it onto the trailer ( done that many times by myself) and hook back onto the trailer and down the road ya go . Today finding a heavy spec day cab is tough , not like thirty years ago . And today if your going to haul a load that needs a permit and say you want 44000 on the drives ya had best have a 44 or 46 rear under the tractor along with higher load rating tires . Now say your friend has say a 335 or a 350 excavator then your going to have to have a lift axle on the tractor for a four axle . Here in Ohio i had to have everything just wright for a six axle set up to haul a Komotsu 300 and i could only make weight with the 36 inch bucket . I do know my trucks as i have speced out a bunch over the years.
 
Comfort in a PETE , you got to be kidding , ya got more room in a V W bug and that stupid clutch pedal is always in the road , ya can clean the passenger window on the outside with out leaving the drivers seat. And ride that they don't have . That is what sold me on I H many years back was the room and ride and handling .
 
The drive components on a truck that old all come from the same vendors except for Mack. So pick the specs you want there. Freightliner cabs are the worst, International and Mack cabs are the toughest, and Pete/Kenworth/Volvo are the nicest cabs.
 
It was the dark of the moon on the sixth of June in a Kenworth hauling logs. A cabover Pete with a reefer on and a Jimmy hauling hogs.
 
I love a slant nose kenworth hooked to a lowboy purely for looks alone in my opinion nothing looks better...unless there's a 330 or 345 cat behind it then it's just pure awesome
 
Yeah, I told him he ought to find an older one with a 92 Series Detroit, as I am intimately familiar with the. Funny thing,his response was, basically, that he wanted to get more than 2 gallons to the mile....LOL Hey, I tried.
 
WE used to own use and sell Petes, maybe the ones you owned weren't, but the makes and models we had were NICEEEEEEEE and we got the best sales and prices out of them along with KW. Still for owning one and putting them on the road with some cowboy drivers, I prefer a Mack.

To each their own likes however

John T
 
I also live in what use to be Coal country and i have driven Macks , yep they are excellent no doubt about it , BUT i bought a I H that was speced to pull a coal bucket and she was broke in on the first load 800 lbs shy of fifty ton in the wagon and that old FARM TRACTOR did a fine job pushen mud with the ft. bumper coming up out of the cuts of small flyby night strip mines . When the EPA got there way and the mills and mines closed down she took a bath and got shined up and went on the road pullen the bucket long distance . Yea she could not make the tripple digits but that old 4300 would run circles around the big meat haulers and bull haulers in the hills with twice the weight . It is all how the man spec.'s a truck out for the job at hand . Now IF i had it to do over again and knowing i would end up on the road coving 29 states i would have geared it a little different But flat out at 88 MPH was really fast enough when you grossen 120-150 grand .
 
We have 9200 and 9400 IH tractors. Bang for the buck it is hard to beat a IH 9200 with a Detroit 12.7 and a 13 speed. Parts are easy to get. Plus the engine and drive line are easy to work on. We look for 2000-2003 models. Another plus is the cab is aluminum so it does not rust out. Also the heater and AC are under the passenger side seat. Just remove about ten bolts and you are right at the cores, fans, and controls to work on them.

A big thing is turning radius. The IH 9200 will turn on a dime. We where in and out of barn yards all of the time when we had the belt trailers. There where many of them that the Pete and Kenworth guys where backing up and wiggling to get around where we just drove right in/out. Another thing is cost. You can buy a IH for 20-35% less than a Pete or KW. Also dealership support. I have IH truck dealerships in Dubuque and Cedar Rapids. Pete and KW Cedar only and they aren't the friendliest bunch either.
 
While i was leased to Chem haulers i was the only one with a 4300 Eagle the rest had Petes and K W's Everybody was going to the walk in sleeper , me i had the little fall in and fall out 36 inch . Everybody was on me to upgrade . So one day on my way to Wabash in. i stopped at the North west Pete in Lima oh. and got looking at a 1980 Pete i was just looking when the salesman cme out and started the high pressure push . He asked me if i had drive a pete lately , no not since 75 > Oh you have to drive this one they are so nice , the ride is improved and this and that and so on and off he goes for the key's and a plate . Well i liked the color , i liked the fact that it was a Cummins , it had a 13 speed , it was on air ride where my Farm tractor was just and old four spring . He hands me the keys and we open it up and climb in and i open the passenger door and he gets in and start talking at 900 MPH . So i start it and as we wait fot it o build air as soon as i have air for the seat to come up i start adjusting the seat . Well first off the seat will not go back far enough so that i have some leg room and the steering wheel is two inches off my at the time smaller belly . The space to get back in the NICE BIG double bunk is so small that my legs would really not fit between the two seats with out forcing them . He and i are almost shoulder to shoulder . Ok so lets go for a ride so back it out of it's spot and head out the drive and we make a right and down the road we go bob tailing . Now this is a 240 inch wheel base on air ride with a 12000 ft axle . That Pete rode like a short wheel base MACK with a 44000 Lb Camel back and a 20000 Ft. Found a place to turn around and take it back and park it . Mommy told me never to lye and when the saleman asked me about the nice ride i told him like it was . It rode like a log wagon it had no room in the cab and the steering wheel was in my belly . The old 4300 bob tail rode like a baby buggy better then my pick up , you had to slide the seat forward to reach the pedals ya darn near needed a road map to find your way around the cab . so i just kept on driving my little Farm Tractor and kept on enjoying my light weight of 27400 Lbs tractor trailer with full fuel. Last truck i drove now coming on seven years ago was a 9400 I H with the walk in . Yea now that was nice but still just a LITTLE TRUCK hauling really BIG loads with really big horse power That had the ride of a baby buggy and the comfort of the living room . and when ya run from sun up to sun down you don't feel all beat up The one driver that came to work where i was working he stated in there on a 9900 I H - Navastar what ever ya want to call them . Well he is still running and now driving a NEWER Pete and i asked him one day how he liked it . He told me that he hated it and really wanted his 9900 back.
 
I find the number of Mack enthusiasts kind of interesting. Back when I worked in automotive instruments, Mack was a customer. I could not figure out how they managed to build a truck. They were the most disorganized customer I ever had. I would go to a meeting on a project we were working on and there would be 30 people in the meeting. The next month there would be 30 DIFFERENT people in the meeting. I think I finally met the Mack person in charge of my project on the 3rd meeting. He didn't show up for the first couple.

Freightliner on the other hand was exactly the opposite. They knew what they wanted to do and had good people working on it to get there.

I do still have a bulldog sitting on my shelf at work. But I would NEVER buy a truck from them.

Cliff (VA)
 

I really liked the IH 5900i that I had. It was a 2003 and the cab was waaaay nicer than the 2005 Mack that I drive occasionally now. Once you get past the cab as others have said it is all in how you spec it. The 2013 Mack that I drive now and then has a far nicer cab, but it spends too much time in the shop. To Tractor Vet, what were you doing airing up the seat of that Peter Car you tried out? No wonder the steering wheel was in your belly!
 
In reality, there is no one best truck. For driver comfort, I would have to give it to the KW or Volvo. For resale value, the Paccar trucks seem to fare the best. In the "bang for the buck" category, the Freightliners and IHs win. Underneath, they are mostly the same. For the most part, you can get the same engines, transmissions and rears in any of them. For straight up durability and ruggedness, the Mack does take the prize. But, it has been said about Mack trucks that they will wear out 3 or 4 drivers until you wear out the truck.
Mack trucks that I have driven have a few glaring shortcomings. They are cramped in the cab. They don't turn well at all. They are a very harsh riding truck. I spent 3 weeks driving a CH model day cab, and finally told the boss that I would not drive it another foot. I got tired of getting beat up on lousy roads and needing to take 3 pull ups to get to a dock.
 
A 10 yr old KW or IH is 1000 times better than a new Freightliner. My opinion with 30 yrs driving and wrenching.
 
I would like to see the Demographics of the group. Bet a good majority of you are east of the big river. Hence the love affair with Macks. As has been said, most components are the same. Personally, I like the Pete or KW, but they have all been Ultra cabs with unibuilt sleepers. Only Macks I have driven SUCKED, but in their defense they were 35 years old 20 years ago. I drive 9400 IHC nearly everyday, and I think they are cramped, If you wear 38 inch jeans, but for the price and service, in our area, they can't be beat.
Never really run Freightliner much. My wife used to sell parts for them, and the company support for their stores seemed to be lacking.
 
I do not have a "dog in the fight", but is interesting that it looks a lot like what it would look like if someone asked who makes the best pickup truck, but with different manufacturers.
 
WE also used, bought and sold some Eagles and White Freightliners AND HEY THOSE WERE SOME FINE TRUCKS. Still our best sellers (and most profit) were Petes and KW but to put on the road and make money especially with less experienced drivers in our day we liked a Mack. IM SURE THINGS HAVE CHANGED SINCE LOL

Fun chattin with yall

John T
 
not an answer, but your question made me think of this picture my cousin took at a rest stop. I thought it was kinda cool.
a213223.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 18:42:07 02/01/16) [b:1f3d9816bf][i:1f3d9816bf]Comfort in a PETE , you got to be kidding , ya got more room in a V W bug[/i:1f3d9816bf][/b:1f3d9816bf] and that stupid clutch pedal is always in the road , ya can clean the passenger window on the outside with out leaving the drivers seat. And ride that they don't have . That is what sold me on I H many years back was the room and ride and handling .

Seems most of the Petes around here always have problems with the seat. The driver is almost always craning his neck to look up over the dash or out the driver's side window. ;)
 
What I learned about which trucks are the best was learned by reading messages on the bathroom walls in dirty truck stops in the 1960's and what kind of people who drive them.
 
Hello NCWayne,

We got 7 to the gallon with the Squeezer Plus DD with 92b90 injectors I think, and 8 with the 3306B Cats. Similar miles per gallon with the 3176 Cat. That one was electronic though. All tuned to the max by yours truly!

Guido.
 
Oshkosh-- be gosh !
Best trucks taxpayer money can buy.

Maybe they can check out military surplus auctions ?
 
Well they came out with a air ride seat for driver comfort and i for one like to see what i am going to run over and since the have closed one of the pariscope company's they are hard to come by now so i like to set UP and not look thru the steering wheel like the drivers today . One has never lived till one has parked his DONKEY in the NON air seat of a 1957 B61 Mack with a 711 with a hair dryer and a five and a four hooked to a 50 ton Rodgers low boy with a D9G fully dressed setting on the deck and haul it just short of 300 miles over the OLD roads BEFORE THE DAYS OF the interstates and set there on that seat for 13 hours doing so . State cop out inft. and one behind and do this seven times in two weeks Oh yea also with NO P/S , NO A/C and NO 260 A/C because you never even got close to that speed and on the hills you were haulen the mail at 12 MPH with smoke and fire coming out the stack. And the heat in the cab would bake bread so every chance ya got ya had the doors open and standing on the fuel tanks with your right foot glued to the floor and one hand on the wheel. You park your donkey on a 10 or 12 inch seat cushion then on a air ride seat and see how fast you air the seat up for the comfort or run and old Pan that did not have a suspension seat of some kind And get your innereds beat out of you.
 

Man, I just love reading stuff from guys that have done it all twice...no, maybe three times, way better, faster and easier than anyone else. Probably got paid more too.
 
(quoted from post at 15:39:16 02/02/16) Well they came out with a air ride seat for driver comfort and i for one like to see what i am going to run over and since the have closed one of the pariscope company's they are hard to come by now so i like to set UP and not look thru the steering wheel like the drivers today . One has never lived till one has parked his DONKEY in the NON air seat of a 1957 B61 Mack with a 711 with a hair dryer and a five and a four hooked to a 50 ton Rodgers low boy with a D9G fully dressed setting on the deck and haul it just short of 300 miles over the OLD roads BEFORE THE DAYS OF the interstates and set there on that seat for 13 hours doing so . State cop out inft. and one behind and do this seven times in two weeks Oh yea also with NO P/S , NO A/C and NO 260 A/C because you never even got close to that speed and on the hills you were haulen the mail at 12 MPH with smoke and fire coming out the stack. And the heat in the cab would bake bread so every chance ya got ya had the doors open and standing on the fuel tanks with your right foot glued to the floor and one hand on the wheel. You park your donkey on a 10 or 12 inch seat cushion then on a air ride seat and see how fast you air the seat up for the comfort or run and old Pan that did not have a suspension seat of some kind And get your innereds beat out of you.

I drove a B-61 with a solid seat. It rode just fine but I expect that it was because it had no power and was way overloaded most of the time. I have never driven a Peter Car, but I always air up the seat of either of the Macks when I get in them. The owners can sit on the floor but I don't.
 
For fuel mileage, cost to buy, and availability of used parts, I'd go with a pre-03-emissions Freightliner Columbia or Century, Detroit, and 13 speed.
Good turning radius, even if it is converted from a condo. The factory conversions have enough room behind the seats you can easily organize spare fluids, tools, parts, etc. And enough frame that you can build a 4 wheeler or dirt bike ramp on it if you move equipment and trucks around yourself.

Throw a set of the Gabriel 3-way adjustable shocks on it, on the firm setting, and the ride will surprise you.

The main advantage a Pete or KW has for ride quality is that long nose that gets in the way when you're in tight quarters, also gets you so far from the steer axle.

They've come a long way since the ones some of the guys here are describing. Peterbilt and Freightshaker both.

Volvo builds a good truck, probably the safest ones in a crash. But I've never run one, likewise with the newer Macks. The 379 Pete rides nice, but they are hard to find with a sane wheelbase, even a daycab. Never ran a KW newer than a 79 or 80.

The 9200 and 9400 Internationals aren't bad trucks, but the powertrains in the 9400s I drove were quite underwhelming, probably leading to most of my bias against them. Should have had fairings on the midroof sleeper and 3.36 or 3.42 gears instead of 3.70s. Only got 4.5 mpg on a good day, but the guy I was driving for wouldn't listen to the dealer about the ideal operating rpm of a C15 vs an E model or a B model Cat.

My dream truck is a 378 or 379 Pete, 13 speed, 500 Detroit, lift axle, daycab.
My reality truck is a century class, 10 or 13 speed, daycab, with the Detroit turned up as far as the computer will let it.

Any way I went if I were to buy a truck, I'd spend the few extra hundred to put good shocks under it.

Your friend's best bet is to buy the truck he likes best or can most easily live with, then add the wet kit (and lift axle if so inclined) to it.
 
(quoted from post at 23:10:03 02/01/16) I also live in what use to be Coal country and i have driven Macks , yep they are excellent no doubt about it , BUT i bought a I H that was speced to pull a coal bucket and she was broke in on the first load 800 lbs shy of fifty ton in the wagon and that old FARM TRACTOR did a fine job pushen mud with the ft. bumper coming up out of the cuts of small flyby night strip mines . When the EPA got there way and the mills and mines closed down she took a bath and got shined up and went on the road pullen the bucket long distance . Yea she could not make the tripple digits but that old 4300 would run circles around the big meat haulers and bull haulers in the hills with twice the weight . It is all how the man spec.'s a truck out for the job at hand . Now IF i had it to do over again and knowing i would end up on the road coving 29 states i would have geared it a little different But flat out at 88 MPH was really fast enough when you grossen 120-150 grand .

What did ya have for power and gears in that 4300?

We had on with a 1693 cat, 13 ahead, geared for 78mph.

It was a good horse for Michigan loads.

My favorite for pulling the big stuff was an old DC model Autocar with a 350 come-a-part(turned up a smidge), 13 ahead geared for 62mph & setting on 44k Hedricksons.
 
(quoted from post at 16:56:07 02/02/16) For fuel mileage, cost to buy, and availability of used parts, I'd go with a pre-03-emissions Freightliner Columbia or Century, Detroit, and 13 speed.
Good turning radius, even if it is converted from a condo. The factory conversions have enough room behind the seats you can easily organize spare fluids, tools, parts, etc. And enough frame that you can build a 4 wheeler or dirt bike ramp on it if you move equipment and trucks around yourself.

Throw a set of the Gabriel 3-way adjustable shocks on it, on the firm setting, and the ride will surprise you.

The main advantage a Pete or KW has for ride quality is that long nose that gets in the way when you're in tight quarters, also gets you so far from the steer axle.

They've come a long way since the ones some of the guys here are describing. Peterbilt and Freightshaker both.

Volvo builds a good truck, probably the safest ones in a crash. But I've never run one, likewise with the newer Macks. The 379 Pete rides nice, but they are hard to find with a sane wheelbase, even a daycab. Never ran a KW newer than a 79 or 80.

The 9200 and 9400 Internationals aren't bad trucks, but the powertrains in the 9400s I drove were quite underwhelming, probably leading to most of my bias against them. Should have had fairings on the midroof sleeper and 3.36 or 3.42 gears instead of 3.70s. Only got 4.5 mpg on a good day, but the guy I was driving for wouldn't listen to the dealer about the ideal operating rpm of a C15 vs an E model or a B model Cat.

My dream truck is a 378 or 379 Pete, 13 speed, 500 Detroit, lift axle, daycab.
My reality truck is a century class, 10 or 13 speed, daycab, with the Detroit turned up as far as the computer will let it.

Any way I went if I were to buy a truck, I'd spend the few extra hundred to put good shocks under it.

Your friend's best bet is to buy the truck he likes best or can most easily live with, then add the wet kit (and lift axle if so inclined) to it.

Talk about long noses. There were two times in the two years that I had my International, that I pulled up to a traffic light, and when it changed I started off, and a small car drove out from in front of me. Couldn't see them there and thinking of things I forgot they were there. Yeah, I know I pulled up too close.
 
My 2cents what is the best dealer around? With older equipment that is important. Next price range probably most truck for the buck ana navistar or military surplus. Wet kit can. Be added to most every. Transmission out there. The Pete's have a reputation for high priced parts. E model cats are very durable as r mocks after 2000 Cummins r great westernstars are heavy with steel cabs they and freightliner have alto of component problems with age. Some sleepers can be removed. A heavy front axle allows weight transfer. I'm sold on 385's on front axle last so much longet. Test drive anything and get them to throw in a new seat if needed. Richie bros has a lot coming thru now that oil field is down.
 
tractor vet back in the late 70's hauled coal into conesville power plant, hauled 25-28 ton per trip 4 loads a day that wasnt enough money.started hauling coal to Paulding oh every nite bring back limestone and load coal again. leave house at midnite with 40 ton of coal on dump at Paulding pick up limestone at any national plant haul back to Stockers load coal and go home, do it again the next day all week long.....4300 IN 400 cummins 13 speed, east tri axle coal bucket best truck I ever had
 

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