Yesterday's Tractor Co. Low Prices, Parts Ship Fast!
Click Here or call 800-853-2651 
   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver
 
Marketplace
Tractor Manuals
Tractor Parts
Classified Ads
Photo Ads

Community
Discussion Forums
Project Journals
Tractor Town
Your Stories
Show & Pull Guide
Events Calendar
Hauling Schedule

Galleries
Tractor Photos
Implement Photos
Vintage Photos
Help Identify
Parts & Pieces
Stuck & Troubled
Vintage Ads
Community Album
Photo Ad Archives

Research & Info
Articles
Tractor Registry
Tip of the Day
Safety Cartoons
Tractor Values
Serial Numbers
Tune-Up Guide
Paint Codes
List Prices
Production Nbrs
Tune-Up Specs
Torque Values
3-Point Specs
Glossary

Miscellaneous
Tractor Games
Just For Kids
Virtual Show
Museum Guide
Memorial Page
Feedback Form

Yesterday's Tractors Facebook Page

Related Sites
Tractor Shed
TractorLinks.com
Ford 8N/9N Club
Today's Tractors
Garden Tractors
Classic Trucks
Kountry Life
Enter your email address to receive our newsletter!

subscribe
unsubscribe
  
Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Re: JohnT?

[Show Entire Topic]  

Author  [Modern View]
George Marsh

12-16-2013 14:42:16
50.121.6.110



Report to Moderator

JohnT,

No offense taken.

So, if I got things right in my head, with or without caps, the motor uses the same current and generates the same heat.

The only thing that benefits is the circuit breaker in the load center is seeing less amps and there is less I squared loss in the wire going to the motor.

What about a generator? Is it better for a genny to PF?

George




[Reply]   [No Email]
John T

12-16-2013 15:27:35
216.249.76.176



Report to Moderator
 Re: JohnT? in reply to George Marsh, 12-16-2013 14:42:16  
"So, if I got things right in my head, with or without caps, the motor uses the same current and generates the same heat."

I cant say that's exactly right, but its hard to explain and I'm way too lazy to dust off my books lol. Here's what I will say, however. If the PF is unity meaning, the current isn't leading or lagging the voltage, its in phase, the vector sum of the resistive current component and reactive (L/C) current component is the same as the resistive ONLY i.e. C canceled out the L. However, if the PF is less then unity, the current is the vector sum of the 2 out of phase components (R + L/C) even though a meter doesn't take that into account, its watts NOT Volt Amps.

"What about a generator? Is it better for a genny to PF?"

The utility or a genset generates a sine wave and it has to "work" less if the load is unity PF. If the PF is lousy the genset or utility is actually having to produce the in plus out of phase current components (vector sum) and that's why we were charged a penalty for a lousy PF even though our watt hour meters registered the same

HEY GEORGE IM RUNNIN OUTA SMARTS ON THIS PF STUFF this is my best recollection but certainly not warranted correct. When I believe an answer is correct I just state it, but Im NOT sure on this PF stuff, its been too long, dont take any drastic steps based on the above, consult someone more current in the trade whose not been retired over 20 years ........

Sorry, but that's all I got

John T

[Reply]  [No Email]
George Marsh

12-16-2013 19:16:24
50.121.6.110



Report to Moderator
 Re: JohnT? in reply to John T, 12-16-2013 15:27:35  
thanks JohnT,
I am very familar with vectors, series and parallel tank circuits, XL, Xc, R, Z, all the equations in electronics. Never really applied them to motors.

What I'm not 100% sure of, but going to take a guess an educated guess on what you call unity(powerfactor).

When the phase angle between the vector sum and R is zero, the cos of zero is one and the Power Factor is 1, unity.

So, if you were to find the phase angle then the cosine of that angle transulates to the power factor. example. The phase angle is 45 degrees, the cosine of 45 is .707. Therefore you would say the power factor is .707. As the phase angle approaches 90 degrees, the power factor approaches 0. As phase angle approaches zero, power factor approaches 1.

If you can follow this chatter, good luck.

Yes. I have too much time on my hands.

So, is the cos of phase angle = power factor.

Inverse cosine of power factor = phase angle.

I'm kinda of rusty too. Only been retired 10 years. I pitched all my books.

George

[Reply]  [No Email]
John T

12-17-2013 03:45:52
216.249.76.176



Report to Moderator
 Re: JohnT? in reply to George Marsh, 12-16-2013 19:16:24  
"So, is the cos of phase angle = power factor. "

YOU GOT IT.........And if they are in phase the angle is zero and the cosine of zero is one...

Fun huh

John T



[Reply]  [No Email]
George Marsh

12-17-2013 06:11:34
50.121.6.110



Report to Moderator
 Re: JohnT? in reply to John T, 12-17-2013 03:45:52  
JohnT,
Don't think I ever read that any place. Why do some try to make it so complicated?
George



[Reply]  [No Email]
[Show Entire Topic]     [Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Add a Reply]

Hop to:
TRACTOR   PARTS TRACTOR   MANUALS
Same-Day Shipping! Most of our stocked parts ship the same day you order (M-F).  Expedited shipping available, just call!  Most prices for parts and manuals are below our competitors.  Compare our super low shipping rates!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor.  We are a Company you can trust and have generous return policies!   Shop Online Today or call our friendly sales staff toll free (800) 853-2651. [ More Info ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2014 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters