Yesterday's Tractor Co. Shop Now
   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver
Classified Ads
Photo Ads
Tractor Parts

Discussion Forums
Project Journals
Tractor Town
Your Stories
Show & Pull Guide
Events Calendar
Hauling Schedule

Tractor Photos
Implement Photos
Vintage Photos
Help Identify
Parts & Pieces
Stuck & Troubled
Vintage Ads
Community Album
Photo Ad Archives

Research & Info
Tractor Registry
Tip of the Day
Safety Cartoons
Tractor Values
Serial Numbers
Tune-Up Guide
Paint Codes
List Prices
Production Nbrs
Tune-Up Specs
Torque Values
3-Point Specs

Tractor Games
Just For Kids
Virtual Show
Museum Guide
Memorial Page
Feedback Form

Yesterday's Tractors Facebook Page

Related Sites
Tractor Shed
Ford 8N/9N Club
Today's Tractors
Garden Tractors
Classic Trucks
Kountry Life
Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Re: Calling JohnT and BD!!! Sub panel issue!!!

[Show Entire Topic]  

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author  [Modern View]

07-27-2013 06:14:42

Report to Moderator

Separate your grounds and neutrals in the sub panels. Make SURE the sub panel feeders are terminated correctly at the distribution point. Not sure what your sub panels are fed from? I assume a center pole maybe?

Your electrician probably didn't say anything because it has been that way, right or wrong. As a electrical contractor who does a lot of agricultural work, I always do things right on my work......but it is often a real struggle to get a farmer to change something that has been "working ok" for years, even if it is not right.

Most guys don't seem to want to spend much more than they have to on electric work. I understand that.

Example, often on service calls I will notice subpanels with no separate EGC, and the neutral and grounds landed on the same bar in the panel. I mention the issues with this, and what we need to do to fix it. Often, I get the response of it works, has always worked, why change it? (not fix, change, lol)

One guy even had 12 Holstein cows die while milking one night due to stray voltage.....and couldn't convince him why his silo service needed ground rods.....after the overhead service burnt up, and it burnt all the silo unloader wire up, and wire to the rotating bunk feeder up, searching for a path to ground......It found it somehow through the rebar in the concrete and the silo unloader. some guys just don't get it.

Separate your grounds and neutrals in your subs, a ground rod at the panel is not a bad thing. Make sure your main service is put together correctly also.....that will be just as important.

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
Bob Bancroft

07-27-2013 10:57:04

Report to Moderator
 Re: Calling JohnT and BD!!! Sub panel issue!!! in reply to Sparktrician, 07-27-2013 06:14:42  
What do you recommend on a farm such as mine with several sub panels, each fed with three wires, all buried cable a LONG way from the main panel? No animals. No trouble. Ground rods at all locations. Apparently code has changed since my installations. It appears all neutrals and grounds are hooked together in all panels.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
John T

07-27-2013 11:16:26

Report to Moderator
 Re: Calling JohnT and BD!!! Sub panel issue!!! in reply to Bob Bancroft, 07-27-2013 10:57:04  
I recommend you do NOTHING, thats the way the code was for yearsssssssssssssss, it was likely legal when installed and maybe Grandfathered in by your local authority??????? In those days for 120/240 volt single phase three wire you only ran 3 wires to the outbuilding, 2 Hots and Neutral, just the same as the utility ran the twisted triplex 3 wires to your home. Then the Neutral was wired to a suitable GroundING Electrode and Neutral and Ground busses (if it even had two) were tied together.

But do as you please, I wouldnt be too anxious to raise any red flags i.e. dont ask dont tell and keep under the radar. Sure as you ask some bureaucrat and bring it to his attention he may call the SWAT team and the EPA and OSHA and run out and shut you down lol

PS Im always preaching do it right and safe, but while I believe the new 4 wire system to be better, the old 3 wire arent any great hazard in my opinion provided correctly installed and good earth grounding BUT IF A NEW INSTALLATION GO WITH THE CORRECT MODERN 4 WIRE

My opinion only, your choice now

John T

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bob Bancroft

07-27-2013 12:01:30

Report to Moderator
 Re: Calling JohnT and BD!!! Sub panel issue!!! in reply to John T, 07-27-2013 11:16:26  
As always, thank you John. Indeed, I see questions asked on here that make me wonder if the SWAT/EPA/OSHA/NSA/etc. isn't going to come after us freedom loving rednecks! I'm not about to dig everything up. Short of adding a wire, by my limited understanding, there's nothing else to do. I just wondered if there was something that could be done at the panels.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
John T

07-27-2013 06:31:28

Report to Moderator
 Re: Calling JohnT and BD!!! Sub panel issue!!! in reply to Sparktrician, 07-27-2013 06:14:42  
EXCELLENT,,,,,,When I was practicing I had a great relationship with my electrical contractors, we listened to and learned from each other, a two way relationship based on mutual respect, I learned from them and they learned from me......Of course, I was older and more experienced by then, NOT some punk pimpled wet behind the ears kid fresh out of engineering school, they kind they didnt like lol

Couple comments: "some guys just don't get it"

I agree, Ive fought that for over 15 years here AND THEY NEVER WILL lol

"a ground rod at the panel is not a bad thing"

When I practiced I specified a proper GroundING Electrode at EACH AND EVERY buildings electrical service entrance.

Fun chat, I think JD has the picture now, but I'm rusty on those ag building exceptions

Ol John T and all

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Show Entire Topic]     [Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:

Fast Shipping!  Most of our stocked parts ship within 24 hours (M-Th). Expedited shipping available, just call! Most prices for parts and manuals are below our competitors. Compare our super low shipping rates! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor. We are a company you can trust and have generous return policies. Shop Online Today or call our friendly sales staff toll free (800) 853-2651. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums

Copyright © 1997-2018 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters