- Thread starter ldj
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dr sportster
Well-known Member
Sounds about normal.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
I'm no expert but I had that problem with my set and it turned out my rosebud tip was a little big for my setup even though they were sold together. I kicked up my pressure on my regulators about 4-5 lbs on each and the hot handle and popping went away, I can run it all day now and the handle barely gets warm. I've heard a hot handle can have to do with the flame actually being partly inside the handle. (premature ignition) from the flame looking for enough gas to burn. Not sure if any of that is real but kicking up the pressures on both tanks a bit made a world of difference for me.
mdtractormechanic
Member
Adjust the flame so it's just off the tip.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Does sound about right.
Cheap torches
tip too big for tank delivery rate
at some point it will burn up the mixing chamber and orings in the handle
meanwhile get a smaller rosebud
or some name brand gear
you are really supposed to turn off the oxygen first to avoid pops
Cheap torches
tip too big for tank delivery rate
at some point it will burn up the mixing chamber and orings in the handle
meanwhile get a smaller rosebud
or some name brand gear
you are really supposed to turn off the oxygen first to avoid pops
JOHNNYfromMI
Member
Your acetylene tank can only deliver 1/7 of it total capacity per hour. If your rosebud keeps popping you need to get a smaller rosebud or a larger acetylene tank. Or get the connection to draw off two tanks or more at the same time. The popping you are hearing is the fire going in the mixing chamber. This has the potential to explode in your hand.
Huh? You burned your eyes brazing with an oxy/fuel setup?
On topic you are going to need to jack your fuel pressure up to about 10psi when using your rosebud be careful not to exceed 15psi with acetylene. Also be sure you have a good seal between the rosebud and mixing chamber if its able to suck any air in there it will pop bad.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Rosebuds aren't made to be throttled back. There
shouldn't be any black soot from the acetylene
when you turn the oxygen on. The higher
pressure/flow of gas moving through the rosebud
helps to cool it off. With too low of pressure it
will backfire(pop) when you shut it off and even
when using it. Getting it too close to the hot
work piece will also cause backfiring even with
the right gas pressures. Flashback arrestors
prevent the backfire from going back through the
hoses and causing a much more serious flashback
and/or explosion. Without knowing the size of your
rosebud, I'd guess about 10 PSI acetylene and 20
to 30 oxygen should be fine. A real big rosebud
needs 15 Acetylene but usually also needs 2 or
more cylinders manifolded together to supply
enough acetylene without drawing the acetone out
of the cylinder(s).
shouldn't be any black soot from the acetylene
when you turn the oxygen on. The higher
pressure/flow of gas moving through the rosebud
helps to cool it off. With too low of pressure it
will backfire(pop) when you shut it off and even
when using it. Getting it too close to the hot
work piece will also cause backfiring even with
the right gas pressures. Flashback arrestors
prevent the backfire from going back through the
hoses and causing a much more serious flashback
and/or explosion. Without knowing the size of your
rosebud, I'd guess about 10 PSI acetylene and 20
to 30 oxygen should be fine. A real big rosebud
needs 15 Acetylene but usually also needs 2 or
more cylinders manifolded together to supply
enough acetylene without drawing the acetone out
of the cylinder(s).
dr sportster
Well-known Member
It was the word "cheap" that inspired my response. Cheap and torches don't go well together.
Stan in Oly, WA
Well-known Member
No UV rays in oxy/acetylene flame, only infrared and visible light. Are you sure your eyes didn't just get dried out from the heat? With oxy/acetylene welding, shaded glasses are only to block some of the visible light, but a lot of people don't bother with them for using a rosebud---there's no weld puddle you have to be able to see.
Stan
Stan
I don't know if I have ever turned off a rose bud that didn't pop. No matter which valve I turned off first. I always turn the fuel off first. I don't like having the tip sooted up.
I think the only acetylene rose bud I have left is a #12, I run right at 15-psi with it.
I think the only acetylene rose bud I have left is a #12, I run right at 15-psi with it.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
If you try to light the oxygen, you'll be there for a long time. However, with propane it helps to have the oxygen on a little bit with the propane so the flame stays lit if there's a breeze.
I don't know what video's you've watched but I think you're confused. Fuel gas first is the same order of doing things. You turn the fuel gas on first so you have something to light and you turn the fuel gas off first to extinguish the flame. Rosebuds often "pop" when shutting off because the head has got a little too hot and there's still a tiny bit of acetylene that didn't make it out the end. Another good reason to shut the oxygen off last is it gives a couple seconds of cooling to the rosebud or tip.
I don't know what video's you've watched but I think you're confused. Fuel gas first is the same order of doing things. You turn the fuel gas on first so you have something to light and you turn the fuel gas off first to extinguish the flame. Rosebuds often "pop" when shutting off because the head has got a little too hot and there's still a tiny bit of acetylene that didn't make it out the end. Another good reason to shut the oxygen off last is it gives a couple seconds of cooling to the rosebud or tip.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Even when setting the flame for cutting, you don't normally wear cutting goggles. I've seen a lot guys do good cuts without goggles but I have real trouble seeing what I'm doing and it really bothers my eyes. With a rosebud you're not usually staring right at the flame. You're watching the piece you're heating up and not melting it.
"I don't know what video's you've watched but I think you're confused. Fuel gas first is the same order of doing things. You turn the fuel gas on first so you have something to light and you turn the fuel gas off first to extinguish the flame."
Apparently there are two schools of thought on this. I just re-watched the Victor Oxy-Fuel safety video that they have on their website and it clearly shows fuel gas on first when lighting and Oxygen off first when extinguishing.
http://victortechnologies.com/Shop_Talk/Victor/shoptalk.php at 29:53
Apparently there are two schools of thought on this. I just re-watched the Victor Oxy-Fuel safety video that they have on their website and it clearly shows fuel gas on first when lighting and Oxygen off first when extinguishing.
http://victortechnologies.com/Shop_Talk/Victor/shoptalk.php at 29:53
Most oxygen/ acetylene heating and welding tips are
equal pressure tips. Yes rosebuds also but not all.
Here is a link to Smiths catalog you have to scroll
down quite a ways and there is a page that gives
pressure settings for their different rosebuds.
Different manufactures might have different ideas.
They also mention to use high flow flash back
protectors when using rosebud.
Untitled URL Link
equal pressure tips. Yes rosebuds also but not all.
Here is a link to Smiths catalog you have to scroll
down quite a ways and there is a page that gives
pressure settings for their different rosebuds.
Different manufactures might have different ideas.
They also mention to use high flow flash back
protectors when using rosebud.
Untitled URL Link
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
A lot of times with a rosebud you use higher oxygen pressure to help cool the tip but since you're not melting the steel, you don't need to equalize the rosebud. As far as flashback arrestors, I've read(Esab I think) where it says to not use check valves when using a rosebud because they restrict the flow of gas to the tip. Flashback arrestors also have a check valve. In school and on the job never had anyone say to shut the oxygen off first.
Couple good videos. Even they don't agree! :lol:
http://youtu.be/AOYQEg9SXoA
http://youtu.be/f2amO0T3vkQ
http://youtu.be/AOYQEg9SXoA
http://youtu.be/f2amO0T3vkQ
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
We had Smith equipment at the trade school I went to and all the Smith safety posters as well. When you have an acetylene manifold and students with no experience, you don't take safety for granted. Teacher was very experienced and even in technical school with a couple dozen experienced welders, none of them taught us to shut the acetylene off last.
I've never read a manual for any torch that tells you how to properly equalize a tip for welding either. They all tell you to set the gauges the same yet the most accurate way doesn't rely on the gauges at all. I guess they don't want to tell you their gauges aren't accurate.
I've never read a manual for any torch that tells you how to properly equalize a tip for welding either. They all tell you to set the gauges the same yet the most accurate way doesn't rely on the gauges at all. I guess they don't want to tell you their gauges aren't accurate.
Puddles, The first video is the procedure that I
use. That is procedure that Smith recommended back
in the early 70's for O/A . Somewhere along the
way the oxygen valve was recommended to be shut
off first with acetylene. I asked why, and the
reply was everything is a fuel, even the copper
tip. So if the copper tip is hot enough and you
shut off the acetylene first the oxygen can cause
the tip to burn and start a fire. I DO NOT AGREE
with what I just repeated. My experience with O/A
is if the cutting tip is too hot it will pop and
go out it will not stay lit. Never had a problem
with a heating/welding tip. A couple of times in a
paint booth I was cutting out return saddles for
the conveyor chain, the tip got so hot it would
not stay lit so I cooled the tip by putting the
torch head in the water of the flood sheets. All
the way up to within 1/8 inch of the flame. The
torch was not adjusted improperly, that conveyor
is covered with paint over spray so you have the
torch in a fire as you are cutting. And yes the
fire does get bigger and is put out with water
before it gets too big to work in.
The second video you posted is for propane. I have
zero propane experience so do not know if there is
a special procedure, different from O/A for light
up and shut down. I did learn something from the
Smith video though.
Here is a picture of one of the paint booths I
have worked in. One of the sprayers in the manual
section. Most of the booth is automated.
I could not get the picture to post. I need another lesson.
use. That is procedure that Smith recommended back
in the early 70's for O/A . Somewhere along the
way the oxygen valve was recommended to be shut
off first with acetylene. I asked why, and the
reply was everything is a fuel, even the copper
tip. So if the copper tip is hot enough and you
shut off the acetylene first the oxygen can cause
the tip to burn and start a fire. I DO NOT AGREE
with what I just repeated. My experience with O/A
is if the cutting tip is too hot it will pop and
go out it will not stay lit. Never had a problem
with a heating/welding tip. A couple of times in a
paint booth I was cutting out return saddles for
the conveyor chain, the tip got so hot it would
not stay lit so I cooled the tip by putting the
torch head in the water of the flood sheets. All
the way up to within 1/8 inch of the flame. The
torch was not adjusted improperly, that conveyor
is covered with paint over spray so you have the
torch in a fire as you are cutting. And yes the
fire does get bigger and is put out with water
before it gets too big to work in.
The second video you posted is for propane. I have
zero propane experience so do not know if there is
a special procedure, different from O/A for light
up and shut down. I did learn something from the
Smith video though.
Here is a picture of one of the paint booths I
have worked in. One of the sprayers in the manual
section. Most of the booth is automated.
I could not get the picture to post. I need another lesson.
In welding school I was taught to turn the oxygen off first. And I think every thing I've read and seen to date says to turn the oxygen off first. But I've been doing this for so long now I have my way of doing things, and it has worked great all these years, so very little I do is up for discussion to change.
What I like about Jody's video, (first one) is how he explains about backing the adjustment valve off after each use, and stand to the side when you turn the bottles on. But I had to laugh when I seen he turns the fuel off first. I'll bet I've been around 10,000 weldors in my life, I can't remember a one who turned the oxygen off first.
What I like about Jody's video, (first one) is how he explains about backing the adjustment valve off after each use, and stand to the side when you turn the bottles on. But I had to laugh when I seen he turns the fuel off first. I'll bet I've been around 10,000 weldors in my life, I can't remember a one who turned the oxygen off first.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
I think he means you meant to say you have never seen anyone shut the oxygen off first.
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