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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Ford 532 Baler Disaster

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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 07:08:12
69.29.150.30



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I recently purchased a Ford 532 Square baler that supposedly missed a knot on the LH "some of the time". Turns out, it missed a knot every time. I got in and worked with it and got it tying perfect on the LH side, only to then have trouble with the RH not pulling the knot off. Long story short, tightened everything down and then the RH Cam Gear broke off. I know my hay crop is shot for the year, so now I have all winter to find a RH Cam gear. Turns out after calling two different dealers that the part is no longer available. So, I thought I would ask here if anyone knows of a second-hand parts shop that I can order this part from, or does anyone have a used RH Cam Gear on a dead baler that I can buy from them?

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redtom

10-15-2012 18:52:25
71.90.155.125



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 07:08:12  
Funny, I just clicked on Craigslist for my nightly check and theres a 532 on there for $600. Says his son tore the knotters apart and he doesn't know how to reassemble. In michigan.



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Retired Farmer

10-15-2012 18:12:57
207.200.116.12



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 07:08:12  
You might want to pull the knotter completely apart and check the main shaft. I had a 542 years ago that wouldn't tie all the time. I fought it for several years until I finally took it apart and accidentally discovered the main shaft had a slight bend in it. Got new shaft in and it never missed a bale after that.



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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 19:14:03
75.120.89.88



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Retired Farmer, 10-15-2012 18:12:57  
Good point. While I have the knotter apart, I"ll check that. Thanks.



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GordoSD

10-15-2012 17:45:36
64.33.250.162



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 07:08:12  
How big a hay crop we talking here? Dollars worth? If it is over 1000 small bales I would scrap that thing, get a good NH and don't look back. Only one guy in 40 is using s Ford baler. Maybe 1:70? I do xxx thousand SSB's at 3-4$ apiece and I am not goint to let them get rained on while I shop for baler parts. Even if you do get it running it is a time bomb. Cut your losses.



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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 19:16:53
75.120.89.88



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to GordoSD, 10-15-2012 17:45:36  
Very small operation. I've got about 3 acres that I plan to bale. Got another 3 that I want to add.

My first reaction (in rage) was to scrap it and start again, but since the season is done for me, I might as well take the time to at least try and fix it. If you find a craigslist posting for a 532 in Lower Alabama (LA), you will know what happened.



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GordoSD

10-16-2012 17:10:52
64.33.250.162



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 19:16:53  
OK, six acres. Your area, lots of rain, with proper P&K you could get 4.5 T per acre. Call it 30 Tons. At todays hay prices that could be as much as 7000 dollars. Want to risk that on a 500 dollar baler? I think not. Look further down the road. Buy a good baler. It will be worth twice what you paid for it in 12 years. My 275 bought 13 years ago for 1500 is worth 3000 now, of course I put some into it. It will drop 210+ 50 lb bales of alfalfa in an hour.

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wisbaker

10-15-2012 11:46:38
207.118.181.192



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 07:08:12  
A lot of different information on this baler out there. Some claim it's a New Holland baler, others say it was made by New Idea, other information says it was designed by Long and Ford had someone build it under license until Ford bought the production rights outright. More than one post claims that the knotters are the same as a John Deere 14T or 24T. Since you're out of the hay business for the year I think I'd look at John Deere and New Holland knotter parts and see if there is any truth and if the JD or NH parts are close enough to be made to work. Watch E-bay and Craig's list, there is one on Craig's list for sale near Wausau Wisconsin.

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RodInNS

10-15-2012 13:01:09
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to wisbaker, 10-15-2012 11:46:38  
Deere, Ford, NewHolland, NewIdea and Hesston all used the same basic Deering knotter ~licence~. I've got a Ford 532. I've got a Deere 327. They tie using the same concept. That IS NOT to say that the parts interchange. They don't. Not even mabey. Not a little bit, at all. For whatever reason the 532 DOES use the same bill hook as the NH 273, IIRC. I know it crosses to one of them of that vintage because I stumbled on that info when I needed hooks for mine.
The main differences with the Ford and others are the drive style and layout of the trip mechanism and needle brakes...

Rod

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RodInNS

10-15-2012 09:09:29
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 07:08:12  
Watch the consignment sales...

You might also be able to braze this one or weld it with a Sodel 35 rod if you're into that. Depending on how or where it broke would make up my mind on how I repaired it. If the repair needs to be machined flat I'd probably weld it with the Sodel 35 rod. If there's room to allow a weld bead to pass with a lot of buildup I'd probably braze it...


Rod



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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 09:36:29
69.29.150.30



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-15-2012 09:09:29  
Unfortunately, I'm not at all familiar with welding. I wish I was. Also, it broke right at the axle, and it would probably be better to describe it as shattered. I've been hunting down salvage yards and used parts warehouses, but I haven't had much luck yet.

This may be a completely batty idea, but could a cam gear kit from another baler (say a NH baler from the same era) work in its place?



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RodInNS

10-15-2012 12:55:29
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 09:36:29  
The NH part may fit... but probably not. The critical parts like the bill hooks ARE the same... but once you deviate out further in the larger parts the design is different.
What you can do is go to NH online parts and look up what you need. Then take that number and plug it into Messicks parts online and see if it supercedes to something else. If it does, keep following it and see if it's available or what it fits.
A NH dealer can also plug the part # into PAL and see what else it fits besides that baler.
They may also be able to still do a parts broadcast requesting any other dealers with NOS on the shelf to fill your part order if they wish. They used to have that feature anyhow... unless that's been done away with.

As far as the shattered part... if you can find the crumbs sometimes Humpty can be put back together. You just need the critical stuff to get the angle right. Cast usually breaks pretty clean without distorting so as long as you can jig it the way it needs to be set and hold it... someone with cast experience can probably weld it.

I don't know of any wreckers that would bother keeping a baler like that in the yard. You could try Fawcett tractor. They might also steer you to someone who does wreck that stuff.
I find that every year or so I see a 532 or 542 in the junk sale. I've yet to drag one home... The last one was kinda nice and went for over 650 which I thought was a bit dear for a parts haul... that I'd have had to float home because it had junk tires.

Rod

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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 19:28:50
75.120.89.88



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-15-2012 12:55:29  
After working their website to the bone, I finally called the parts hotline for messicks. Very helpful people. They did find a warehouse for obsolete parts that has the entire knotter assembly, but they're wanting $800+, and it weighs 70 lbs, so shipping is going to add a good bit to that.

On a brighter note, my friend had an almost complete knotter assembly off a ford baler, and the cam gear looks good on it. The trick right now is getting the sucker off. The rest of the assembly is rusted into a solid piece, just about, especially around the shaft. I'll peck away at it till I get it off of there, and maybe that will have me back in business for spring. Thanks for the help.

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cd1

10-16-2012 08:45:45
67.234.196.64



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 19:28:50  
That might be cheap but before I spent 800 I would cut my losses and go buy a new holland that I know I can buy parts for. Who knows what might crap out next on the ford, then the 800 was all for nothing.



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RodInNS

10-15-2012 19:40:47
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 19:28:50  
If you can get a complete NOS knotter for 800 bucks and intend to keep the baler... I think I'd be all over that. That is so cheap you don't know how cheap yet. Each bill hook is 100 on the nose...
The main things you should be asking yourself is ... how good are the plunger guides and the baler frame generally... along with the hard parts of the pickup. If that's all in good shape most of the rest can be repaired with a bit of ingenuity.
I'm tempted to go after that knotter myself if you don't...

Rod

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Nathan Skipper

10-16-2012 10:30:46
69.29.150.30



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-15-2012 19:40:47  
Actually, I think Messicks said they had two in stock. Either way, go right ahead. I'm going to see how this spare cam gear plays out. I can't bring myself to sink that much more money into it. As has been advised, I'd rather cut my losses and get a baler that's not obsolete.



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RodInNS

10-16-2012 13:12:41
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-16-2012 10:30:46  
I can't argue with getting something that's not obsolete... I've said that to many on here, many times... mabey including you.
That said... there's a fair bit of NH stuff that's gotten very obsolete as well. If you're running from that boogeyman... you better jump ahead to something like a 565 or that generation. That will cost a lot more money that a knotter stack...
I don't mind spending a bit of money on something like that IF the rest of the machine is still usable.

Rod

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Nathan Skipper

10-18-2012 09:13:42
69.29.150.30



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-16-2012 13:12:41  
Rod,

New development. I told messicks I didn't want it, and they came back and said the obsolete supplier is looking to clear that inventory. They dropped the price to $495. I've both one of them, but they have another one left. You may want to call and see if they will do the same for you. A brand new cam gear with pinions is $375. $495 for the whole knotter assembly... how bout that?!



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RodInNS

10-19-2012 07:59:25
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-18-2012 09:13:42  
Is this stuff on Messick's shelf or the aftermarket supplier? If it's on the aftermarket supplier's shelf it might be more to my advantage to go through my own dealer...

Rod



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Nathan Skipper

10-19-2012 10:34:03
69.29.150.30



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-19-2012 07:59:25  
It"s on the supplier"s shelf.



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cd1

10-16-2012 18:43:12
67.239.32.149



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-16-2012 13:12:41  
Atleast in my area you will find about 100 new hollands to 1 ford so even if the part is NLA you have a chance of finding it. I run a 326 myself.



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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 13:14:16
69.29.150.30



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to RodInNS, 10-15-2012 12:55:29  
Thanks for the response... very helpful. I think I might have lucked up... but I will know for certain after work. I just found out that a friend of a friend has some old ford baler parts, and he actually has a whole knotter assembly. I sure hope it works out.

If it doesn't, I will definitely try your idea of tracing down the part number on messicks and contacting Fawcetts. I tried ordering the part from Messicks, which is how I came to know that it is discontinued. But, they haven't responded to my question about cross-matching parts. Maybe they will, though.

It is strange how this stuff is both irritating but fun at the same time. Irritating, that I bought equipment that broke and have crop wasting on the ground, yet fun in the inventive and investigative sense. Or maybe I'm just masochistic.

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Dusty MI

10-15-2012 09:43:42
76.247.154.39



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 09:36:29  
Why did it break ?



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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 11:50:48
69.29.150.30



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Dusty MI, 10-15-2012 09:43:42  
I really don't know why it broke, other than it was worn out. Maybe it was something I did. There was a lot of distance between the pinion and the cam gear and it was causing the pinion to miss and get stuck on the return so that it would no longer turn. So, I tightened the stack using the adjusting nut. There was still some play in the pinion, so I don't know if the cam was already weak or what. The LH cam seems solid as a rock.

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mazemeister

10-15-2012 17:37:57
24.187.98.163



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to Nathan Skipper, 10-15-2012 11:50:48  
on why did it break: probably the most important question. i had a knotter cam gear break on my JD 224T. When it went through a tying cycle, the knotter gear and the twine disk pinion would try to force each other apart. after scratching my head a little while, i replaced the twine disk pinion and that solved the problem. the old one showed a little wear, but it didn't look too bad. turns out it was. so if you find a replacement gear, i'd sure look into that pinion also. probably the same thing would happen with the billhook pinion if that wears.

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Nathan Skipper

10-15-2012 19:20:49
75.120.89.88



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 Re: Ford 532 Baler Disaster in reply to mazemeister, 10-15-2012 17:37:57  
There is some ware in both pinions, but that didn't happen until the disc pinion started skipping, which I think was actually brought on by the failing cam, not the other way around.

My friend (as Providence would have it) had a whole knotter assembly that I just picked up. It's OLD and rusty, but the cam is good on it. I spent the better part of the night trying to get it off the shaft. I'll let the oil sit in and try again when I have some more time. If I can get it off of there, I should be good to go, at least until the next part breaks.

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