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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio

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mwhite94

11-06-2011 07:00:07
75.90.231.44



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What oil to gas ratio should a Homelite 360 automatic chainsaw use???




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VernMI

11-06-2011 13:13:56
209.86.226.58



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to mwhite94, 11-06-2011 07:00:07  
I have a 360 and the manual calls for 4 ounces per gallon or 32:1.



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buickanddeere

11-06-2011 10:48:18
216.183.151.188



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to mwhite94, 11-06-2011 07:00:07  
Amsoil Sabre which is made for chain saws and mixed 50 to 1 with 91 octane gasoline. Mix accurately instead of via "by guess and by golly. Why 91 octane? #1 For all the saw uses it won't break your budget. #2It's detonation protection in case the saw is running a little lean or hot. Holes in two stroke engine pistons are not made by lube breakdown. They are caused by detonation/knock. Knock/detonation is caused by high temps, low octane, lean mixtures and excess lube oil.

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LJD

11-06-2011 11:00:30
72.171.0.141



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to buickanddeere, 11-06-2011 10:48:18  
Amsoil has two Saber versions. Saber Outboard has a flash point of 238 F and Saber Professional has a flash point of 237 F. Both excellent ratings.

I give Amsoil credit. At least most of their "synthetic oils" are actually synthetic.

What I find amazing is that Shell Rotella T single-grade 30W petro oil has a flash point of 450 degrees F ! That's higher then most oils sold as super-synthetic. And the 40W version is 460 degrees F.

Can't say I've found many saws that suffered from detonation when timed right. Most I've had to fix because they suffered from melted or scored pistons - caused by lack of lube.

Stihl HP Ultra (made by Omni) has a flash point of 432 F.

Stihl Universal two-stroke oil has a dismal flash point of 168 F.

Ammsoil Dominator has a flash point of 198 F.

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JT

11-06-2011 14:23:17
68.53.181.110



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to LJD, 11-06-2011 11:00:30  
"Can"t say I"ve found many saws that suffered from detonation when timed right. Most I"ve had to fix because they suffered from melted or scored pistons - caused by lack of lube."

I used to think the same thing, but as I got older and more educated, I have found predetonation from low octane fuel, or fuel that is old, will destroy an engine and yes, it will look as though was from insuffient oil/gas ratio. Low octane fuel will burn quicker, sometimes before the spark plug fires, before the piston gets to TDC and henceforth, the piston will travel through the flame, getting to TDC and literly melt itself.

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LJD

11-06-2011 14:43:46
67.142.130.21



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to JT, 11-06-2011 14:23:17  
I'm aware of all that and don't need more education on the subject. I don't need to get older either, but it's apt to happen. 7/8 of my life is already used up and I'm in no hurry to use the rest.

Why do you think cars built 1902-and a little "newer" had hand-operated timing-advance controls?

Why do you think cars used to get "carbon and valve" jobs as routine maintenance?

Over-advanced timing, overly high compression-ratio, too lean a mixture, and/or low octane fuel can cause detonation. But it won't cause piston skirts to melt as I already mentioned. Skirts melt from lack of lube or lack of clearance. Big difference between problems on the thrust side of the piston, and problems on the top of the piston. The former is not in the combustion chamber.

Detonation has been around as long as internal combustion engines have existed. The causes we see today aren't much different.

At least in a car built 100 years ago, the operator could control the detonation with a simple hand-control. Too bad Chrysler didn't have something to stop detonation on their "electronic lean burn" engines in the 70s.

I'll say it again and stick by it. I've seen very few chainsaws with detonation problems. Do they exist? Well yeah, I'm sure they do. Especially with newer saws that are probably running higher compression ratios then in the past. I rarely work on the newest and the "greatest" stuff, so what I see the inside of - is often 15-50 years old (with chainsaws).

On older saws, for the most part, I've seen it in saws that were converted to breaker-less ignition with cheap kits that resulted in overly advanced timing. Other then that, most piston wear problems have been from lack of lube, too little clearance, debris, or overheating. The latter results in a combination of much of the aforementioned.

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LJD

11-06-2011 09:58:24
72.171.0.141



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to mwhite94, 11-06-2011 07:00:07  
When new Homelite called for a preferred mix of 32 to 1 with the special "Homelite" oil. Also allowed 20 to 1 with standard SAE oil, just like Stihl did at that time.

The reality is - if you've got a good air-cooled rated oil, you can run 20-1, or 25-1, or 32-1 in just about anything and be fine - as long as the saw has an adjustable carb. Many newer saws do not and if you use too much oil, you get a lean mixture. Too much oil can plug up some spart arrestors also.

I've got saws over 50 years old and some only 1 year old. I use 20-1 in all to keep things simple. It's also cheap insurance. Oil lube had not improved as much as some people like to think. Many of the new low-oil mixes have emissions in mind. Not saw durability.

Also beware of the "full synthetic" trap. In the USA, it is legal to call an oil made completely from petro, as "full synthetic." Not done in Europe, however -last I checked.

To me, metal protection and flash point are the key issues. When oil reaches the flash point - it no longer is oil and your engine burns up. Some petro Shell Rotella 30W has a flash point of 428 degrees F, yet some Stihl two-stroke oil has a low flash point of 168 F. Lots of BS floating around. If oil is truly synthetic (tier III) it will have a high flash point.

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ldj

11-06-2011 13:12:00
70.253.229.4



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to LJD, 11-06-2011 09:58:24  
How can full petro oil be sold as a synthetic?



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LJD

11-06-2011 14:27:00
67.142.130.21



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to ldj, 11-06-2011 13:12:00  
Easy. In the USA, oil sellers have been given permission to sell oil as "full synthetic" even when it's made from 100% petroleum.

I suspect it's all about juggling the meaning of words around and fooling an somewhat uninformed public.

I try to read up on oil. But, I got ticked off one day when I wanted some synthetic oil. Went down to NAPA and bought some Castrol Syntec that says on the label "full synthetic." Got home and downloaded the data-sheet and found out it is made from petroleum, right out of the well.

That led me to more research and I then found out about the USA allowing such nonsense, but Europe NOT allowing it.

So, I guess it boils down to why somebody wants synthetic oil and what they think it is supposed to be.

Synthetic oil first came to our notice in the USA when Hitler was making it during WWII from coal derivitives. The two big advantages to true synthetic oil is #1 the high flash point (high heat durability) and #2 the consistent viscosity even at cold temps. That's why the USA military started using it in jet engines during the war. When the war was over, a military guy started Amsoil using military-grade synthetic to sell to the general public.

Now? Lots of BS going around. Oil is allowed to be sold as full synthetic even though it made from petro. Just has to say "tier III" on the data sheet. True synthetic oil will be rated tier IV or tier V. Problem is, this data is rarely on the oil container. You can only get it by reading the full data sheets.

Group III base stocks are considered synthetic motor oil only in the United States. Elsewhere they are not allowed to be marketed as "synthetic". API (category III) base oils are marketed to the general public legally (in the USA) as fully synthetic motor oil. Within the US, there are no official specifications, or standards as to which oils can be marketed as "synthetic" and which cannot.

Group IV API base stock for synthetic oils -synthetic esters, or PAO - polyalphaolefin. Used in Mobil 1, Amsoils, etc. The first synthetic motor oil sold in the USA with an API rated was by Amsoil.

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blindhawg

11-06-2011 18:58:37
184.46.42.193



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to LJD, 11-06-2011 14:27:00  
do you sell Amsoil?



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LJD

11-06-2011 20:43:41
67.142.130.32



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 Re: Homelite 360 Chainsaw Oil to Gas Ratio in reply to blindhawg, 11-06-2011 18:58:37  
No, I rarely sell anything. That's why I've got over 100 old tractors here.

I used to hate Amsoil mainly due to their advertising. Never knew much about the company or their products until I got ticked off about the "synthetic" rip off in the USA, and started researching it.

Amsoil is the first company to market true synthetic oil to the general public. The company was started by a WWII military guy who had experience with the synthetic oil that Hitler gave birth to.

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