1962 John Deere 2010 Ignition

Hi all, i'm new to posting here but have been reading for quite awhile so hopefully this post is in the accepted format. thanks in advance for any feedback from your collective knowledge as well.

So here's the problem that has me and every mechanic in a hundred mile radius baffled. i have a 1962 John Deere 2010 with the four cylinder gasoline engine that hasn't run in about four years because it melted down the ignition system one night. i will also mention that this is a reverse polarity system still with a positive ground. Now everything has been replaced and has a good bluish white but intermittent spark and will not start even with a spray of ether. it has a new coil, condenser, points, cap, rotor, dust cover, spark plugs and wires. the coil is getting proper voltage, the points are gapped at .020" per the john deere manual, the points have a small spark while cranking when they open and the circuit is only grounded while they're closed so no short to ground in that leg of the circuit and everything ohmed out correctly. I tested the coil while cranking and the spark jumps the spark tester with a bright bluish white spark in rapid succession. When checking spark with the tester at the plug end of the plug wire while cranking it produces a strong bluish white spark but it will turn a few revolutions without spark following one or two good sparks regardless of the cylinder wire i test. I appreciate any feedback or ideas. I'd love to get this old thing going again.

Intermittent spark is usually caused by faulty points, or loss of power to the coil.

Connect an incandescent test light from the distributor side coil terminal and ground. Crank the engine
through and watch the light. It should burn brightly when the points are open, go completely off when the
points are closed. Using the light will let you see what is happening when the problem occurs.

If the light stays on when the spark stops, the points are not making contact. They may be corroded or
oily, have a bad connection, broken wire, defective, loose, gap changing from a bad distributor bushing. Be
sure the distributor housing is grounded, clamp tight to the block.

I the light stays off, the points are shorted to ground, the condenser is shorted to ground, the coil is
loosing power from the switch.

That you are seeing a spark at the points, probably indicates a high resistance, arcing, at the points.
They may need cleaning with a business card and brake/choke cleaner. Also try another condenser. Todays
points and condensers are very poor quality, not unusual to get bad out of the box.

Are you sure the coil is the correct ohm resistance? Some require a resistor, some don't. For a 12v system,
there should be about 3 ohms resistance across the coil or coil/resistor combo. Using the wrong coil will
either give a weak spark, or damage the points from too much current.

One of the first things I would check is the insulator where the bolt/stud carries the current through the side of the distributor. The nut on the inside is where the points attach. Take it out and see if it is damaged. I have seen them get melted when the systems gets left on. Then when you try to get it to restart you will get a intermittent short.

Verify direction of distributor rotation (CW or CCW) and be sure wires are in cap, according to firing order, & in that direction of rotation.

Thanks for the quick replies, I will check with the test light on Saturday when I can get back to it. As for the insulator stud I checked that and its not melted or grounded out when the points are open. I also checked the resistance between the ground wire that goes to the distributor and the points arm while the points were open with everything isolated and it was about two ohms and with the points closed I have about five ohmes from the wire through the distributor to ground on the frame or block. I'll write down the exact ohm readings and post them Saturday. The firing order is correct 1342 and the distributor rotates counter ccw.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www....FOS-20 Chapter 6-Ignition Circuits/index.html

This link may explain how a "Kettering" ignition system works and how to troubleshoot it.

FWIW here's my Ignition Troubleshooting Procedure, give it a look. My suspects are condenser, points then coil (iVE SEEN NEW ONES BE BAD OUT OF THE BOX) and/or wiring.

While it still sparks otherwise, DID YOU CONNECT THE COIL AT THE RIGHT POLARITY????????

http://www.ytmag.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=farmall&th=5745

John T
John Ts Ignition Troubleshooting

PS I meant Ive seen new condensors be bad out of the box

John T

Thanks for the links, they helped me understand the "kettering" setup much better. I'll check all my ground paths on the primary side again just to make sure. John T, yes the coil is reversed to match the positive ground system so the primary positive terminal is hooked to the distributor and i have tried two new sets of points and two new condensers right out of the box just to cross those pieces off the list and the secondary coil wire has a bright hot spark that is consistent when its disconnected from the cap and held near the frame.

2010s originally came with an ignition ballast resistor, built into the key switch. If you still have the OEM key switch -
try bypassing it and cranking it over with a jumper wire on the coil.

What exactly was melted before? Also, which ignition system? Wico, Prestolite, or Delco?

If the distributor was replaced, are you sure it is a four-cylinder distributor? I ask because I have had to fix two 2010s
that had 6 cylinder distributors in them with four cylinder caps stuck on. Then ran, but had intermittent problems. Last one
I had to fix had a 4010 distributor with a 2010 cap on it. Did some weird things.

You say everything has been replaced, but did not say with what? Type of coil? Type of ballast resistor system?

JmWrench,Try replacing the rotor,it could be bad out of the box shorting to the distributor shaft, causing your intermittent spark to the plugs.

I switched it back to the original distributor housing so its definitely a four cylinder one as was the spare. The coil and points/condenser are good. I tested them with both a multi meter and test light. no shorts to ground or loss of power either. 12 volts to the coil while cranking and it has a good fast spark from the coil wire when I hold it a 1/2" away from the frame. I hooked the coil wire to the cap and tested it with a screw driver grounded to the frame and held the screw driver a 1/2" away from the cap button and I have a strong fast spark so I tried it another way by holding the rotor inside the cap from the button to the post and I get the same strong fast spark to the end of the plug wire. Now when I install the rotor and cap on the distributor and try everything it still has the intermittent spark and the rotor is not grounded on the distributor. I've tried two new caps and rotors as well and same problem. Maybe John Deere is giving me the wrong cap and rotor? This is the presolite distributor.

I cannot see how you can possibly have 12 volts when cranking. That is near impossible since the battery will drop to 9-10 volts when cranking. Your coil should make all the spark needed when it gets 9 volts.

Find out exactly when the distributor fires -and then take the cap off and see where your rotor is pointing. It has to be in line with the pole in the cap where the power needs to go. If it is off - you have to correct it. If not too far off, points gap will fix that. If you find you have to adjust the points way out of range to make the rotor line up where it should be - you have wrong parts in that distributor. THAT was how I found out I had a 6 cylinder distributor. But duh . . in my case, you'd think I would of noticed the points rubbing block had 6 lobes instead of 4? Thing is - normally, who the heck looks for something like that? I later found out that good used distributors are kind of scarce for 1010s and 2010s, so some wind up with distributors from 3010s. That would be fine IF the rubbing block got changed. I have seen a few where it was not.

I'd get the engine set at TDC for #1 cylinder on the compression-stroke. Loosen the distributor and turn it in the opposite direction of rotation until spark jumps out of the coil. Then check where the rotor is pointing. It ought to be centered on #1 pole in the cap. If rotor timing is way off, you know where your problem is.

Try another new rotor and take the bad ones back.

jmWrench,You can check the rotor for a spark short to the distributor shaft,by removing the cap,center coil wire and holding the coil wire 1/4" above the center of the rotor,crank engine over ignition on and watch for spark. You should have NO Spark If it sparks the rotor is bad/shorted.

Could it be the timing is set wrong? If you have a service manual, it will tell you the distributor and the oil pump must be in proper time. I know,.. It doesn't make since. I am at work now, I can copy a page out of the service manual when I get home and post here or send to you if you think it would help?

"the distributor and the oil pump must be in proper time"

While keeping it arranged just like it was when it left the factory is NICE, the firing order and timing can be set perfectly no matter WHERE the oil pump has been "stabbed" in.

Oil pump timing IS important for the diesel version, tho.

Ditto what this fella suggested. Doesn't sound like you've tested the timing. I have a 1010 (same engine as your 2010) that wouldn't give me anything with good spark and ether because the timing was out. The 1010's and 2010's are notorious for being finicky when it comes to timing. I've got the service manual in my truck and can get a picture of the process when I get back. Here's the advice I got last year on the JD Forum:

"First thing first. Since the engine was swapped out, you must first confirm that the oil pump is timed correctly as if this is not the distributor will never be in time. Turn the engine over by hand and place your thumb over cylinder #1 (are you positive that you know which one is cylinder #1 and which one is cylinder #4?). Once you are on the compression stroke, keep rotating the engine until you can see "DC" in the timing window, line it up with the lines on the torque tube. Remember cylinder #1 can be on an exhaust stroke and the "DC" will be in the timing window. Make sure your on the compression stroke!

Remove the distributor and look down at the oil pump drive shaft. The slot should be parallel with the crank and since the slot is off centered and the narrow side MUST be towards the outside of the block. If neither are correct you will have to remove the oil pump and time it.


Install the distributor and once again rotate the engine by hand until you feel the compression stroke on cylinder #1. At this point, continue to turn the engine over by hand until you see "26" in the timing window of the torque tube and it lines up with the timing lines. DO NOT go past it, if you do, DO NOT turn the engine backwards you must restart the process. The reason being is that when timing the distributor, you want all of the lash out of the gearing.

Now, hold the rotor and turn it CCW as far as it will go. At this point turn the distributor slowly until the point just start to open up and lock the distributor into location. This is your starting point."

You can see the thread this was posted on here: http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/viewtopic.php?t=1297423&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=1010&start=0

May I ask a dumb question after reading all this.. with all the sparks your getting vi plugs dist etc. are you sure its
ignition.. Fuel problem since sitting four years?? fuel pump, carb.. etc..

Just a thought..

Hello JmWrench.... hope you can use this page from the service manual...

A Chrysler 12V resistor is needed in line to cut the voltage to the points after it starts. Very common.

Also very common on 50's McCormick tractors.
This is spelled out explicitly in the old Motors Manuals.