John Deere 3020 Diesel not starting

j3020

New User
We have been working on our John Deere 3020 diesel for a bit now and have come to a dead end.

One question we have is what would make a tractor not run at all, even on ether.

It cranks, we rebuilt the starter, it ether locks a few times but doesn't try to run at all.
 
A little more history will help.

What type repairs were done?

Has the fuel system been apart?

Been sitting for a while?

Typically when cranking on a diesel, if there is no white vapor (atomized diesel fuel) coming out the exhaust, there is no fuel getting ti the cylinders.

Could be air in the fuel lines. Have you bled the system?
 
(quoted from post at 22:25:45 01/13/17) The ether put it to sleep. Pull the injectors and get some oil on the rings.

Pretty inexperienced at these kinds of repairs. Can you give a little more detail on how I would do this?
 
The reason we started the work on the tractor was that one of the connecting rod bearings spun and then we were told that we should really change the connecting rod because it could have damage. When changing bearings we noticed that another connecting rod had discoloring on it, like it had overheated at some point, so we changed that too. It wasn't damaged from this occurrence, but we were in there anyways. When it was all put together it didn't seem to crank fast enough, which was why the starter got serviced. The battery was quite old so we changed that at the same time. A friend of ours is a papered diesel mechanic, so we asked him to do the timing. We used an IT manual which was borrowed to us then had a mechanic explain how to check the valves. Our mechanic friend later removed injector number one and made sure it was blowing at the right time. Then when it still didn't start we took the injection pump in. The man said the retainer had completely worn away inside. We had to remove the oil pump to service some of the bearings, but our friend made sure it was on the proper stroke before putting the pump back in. The injectors all have fuel coming out of them and we think it is bled. There is something puffing out of the exhaust and the blowby.

We changed the fuel filters, dropped the oil pan, replaced all four connecting rod bearings, removed the head, replaced connecting rods 2 and 3. Replaced one middle piston ring because I broke it by accident. Put head gasket on, put head back. put the push rods and rocker arm assembly back in, I put all new injectors, put the oil pump and balancer back in, put the injector pump on, put the oil pan back, put in oil. Connected all the fuel lines.

We have been working at this a few months so I hope I didn't forget anything.
 

How cold is the temperature? Are the valves recessed down into the head from grinding the valves and seats?
Trying to run a diesel on ether causes high detonation in the combustion chambers.With pressure spikes several times higher than experienced at normal wide open full power operation. There pressure spikes can bend connecting rods, break cranks, flatten and spin rod bearings, break piston rings, crush ring lands and crack pistons.
If it's a 24V tractor and only 12V at the starter, cranking will be very slow.
 
Its possible to put the inj. pump on 180* out of time w/the engine on the correct stroke.
IF the pump was serviced w/ the drive shaft still in the engine that might be a starting point.
The pump drive shaft has a dot on the end of it that mates w/ a dot inside the pump.. MAKE SURE they are lined up.
You can verify this by putting the engine at TDC #1 cylinder and removing the window on the side of the pump.
The 2 lines should be visible.. if not, the pump is on backwards. Good luck. TPG
 
The oil pump may be installed 180 degrees out of place too, which will through off the injection pump 1/2 turn also. Have seen it done on other JD engines that the injection pump is driven by the oil pump. One mechanic I know didn't feel like dropping the pan to correct his mistake and just pulled the injection pump drive shaft and turned it 1/2 so the internal dots no longer aligned..
 
(quoted from post at 08:34:18 01/14/17) The oil pump may be installed 180 degrees out of place too, which will through off the injection pump 1/2 turn also. Have seen it done on other JD engines that the injection pump is driven by the oil pump. One mechanic I know didn't feel like dropping the pan to correct his mistake and just pulled the injection pump drive shaft and turned it 1/2 so the internal dots no longer aligned..

When we installed the oil pump, we turned the flywheel till it was TDC on #1, if we did that, then the oil pump should be installed correctly, right?
 

The pump was serviced outside of the tractor. When on #1 TDC the timing marks show through the window.
 

We weren't trying to run it on ether, just trying to start it. Used a small amount. The valves were fine when we reinstalled the head. The tractor was changed to a 12volt system by previous owner, starter also has 12volt solenoid.
 
Fifty percent chance either right or wrong. TDC is for both cylinders 1 and 4 as they rise/fall together. When 1 is on TDC after compression stroke 4 is after exhaust stroke, and vice versa because the CAM turns half crankshaft speed. When at TDC, watch the rocker arms, for 1 on compression both arms will be loose, and exhaust almost closed and intake starting to open on 4. Still could have the oil pump in 1/2 turn off IF the CAM was not in the right spot..
 
(quoted from post at 12:48:14 01/14/17) Fifty percent chance either right or wrong. TDC is for both cylinders 1 and 4 as they rise/fall together. When 1 is on TDC after compression stroke 4 is after exhaust stroke, and vice versa because the CAM turns half crankshaft speed. When at TDC, watch the rocker arms, for 1 on compression both arms will be loose, and exhaust almost closed and intake starting to open on 4. Still could have the oil pump in 1/2 turn off IF the CAM was not in the right spot..

will be reinstalling the starter today and giving it a go.
 
What ALL did you take apart?

I would suspect a timing issue.

A spun rod bearing usually mucks up the crank, was it good?
 
(quoted from post at 10:55:59 01/14/17)
We weren't trying to run it on ether, just trying to start it. Used a small amount. The valves were fine when we reinstalled the head. The tractor was changed to a 12volt system by previous owner, starter also has 12volt solenoid.

Any use of any amount of ether causes pressure spikes above normal operating pressure .
 
If I remember, the slot in the oil pump shaft to drive the inj. pump is offset slightly as is the inj. pump shaft. So actually having the shaft 180 off is not possible.
But if the oil pump gear is 180 off then it is possible. I have seen diesels not want to pop on either and in all cases it was low compression. I think in your case you
have a combination of low compression and improperly timed oil pump gear. Easy way to check is pop rocker cover and make sure inj pump marks line up when #1 is on
compression. Also to get more cranking speed remove the hyd pump coupler.
 
(quoted from post at 15:22:06 01/15/17)
(quoted from post at 10:55:59 01/14/17)
We weren't trying to run it on ether, just trying to start it. Used a small amount. The valves were fine when we reinstalled the head. The tractor was changed to a 12volt system by previous owner, starter also has 12volt solenoid.

Any use of any amount of ether causes pressure spikes above normal operating pressure .

The tractor started. The mechanical issue was a defective brand new Interstate battery. The starter was also reserviced at the same time. It is running beautiful.
 
Was it a side console with electric shut off
on pump? Can see how low voltage could be a
problem. Lots of electric parts are junk
out of box anymore. So much for quslity
control at the Interstate battery supplier.
 

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