Farmall H Fan removal

jcronk

Member
Hi folks. One of the sheaves on the pulleys is cracked right through. I hope to find a replacement part but I need to remove the fan. Is there a trick to removing the bolt/screw shown in these pics. Thanks, Jack
 
okay trying pics again
a230643.jpg

a230644.jpg
 

I believe that to be a tapered lock pin that fastens the pump impeller to the drive lug thingy.
To minimise the damage while driving it out, use a coupler nut to spread the load over as many threads as possible. Hit on the coupler nut and then back the nut off a couple of threads as the taper pin moves out. Penetrating fluid and or heat will be of some assistance. Remember to support the drive lug thingy! Good luck.
 
Thanks. Thingys, doodads, whatchemacalits all have real names I'm sure but who knows what they are. Will try gently drifting it out once I have added a few nuts. Regards, Jack
 
37456.jpg
37457.jpg


So, I won with the removal of the tapered pin without damaging anything. The whole reason to get into here is to repair/replace the broken sheave (?). I think that just threads on and off but I'm stuck at how to remove the part above it. All hints will be gratefully appreciated.
 
(quoted from post at 15:02:00 06/30/16)
37456.jpg
37457.jpg


So, I won with the removal of the tapered pin without damaging anything. The whole reason to get into here is to repair/replace the broken sheave (?). I think that just threads on and off but I'm stuck at how to remove the part above it. All hints will be gratefully appreciated.

I think what you are looking at is an oil seal that keeps the grease in the pump bearings. This is the grease nipple that is closest to the radiator.
The other nipple on the water pump usually has a small cap on it and calls for a water-proof grease on the impeller shaft.
Once the seal is removed, there may be a snap ring and washer in front of the bearings.
(Man, it has been a long time.)
Here is the official parts breakdown for the Farmall H:

http://partstore.caseih.com/us/parts-search.html#epc::mr59088ar233587

Hope that helps!

Once the pulley hub is off of the pump body I think you can thread off the cracked pulley. Clear as mud I know.

On the positive side, you don't have to worry about damaging it!

I have seen these successfully brazed.
 

Okay, thanks. Hadn't thought of a grease seal sitting there. We'll see how it goes but not until next week. Funeral tomorrow - pretty sure it's not my own but getting to have fewer and fewer old friends that's for sure. Jack
 
(quoted from post at 17:23:21 06/30/16)
Okay, thanks. Hadn't thought of a grease seal sitting there. We'll see how it goes but not until next week. Funeral tomorrow - pretty sure it's not my own but getting to have fewer and fewer old friends that's for sure. Jack

I am not sure if you are as cheap as I am, but you can save that seal if you have a slide hammer with a screw type attachment. Puncture the outer edge of the seal with an awl, screw in the slide hammer thingy, remove the seal intact. After cleaning you can reinstall the seal and put a dab of silicone in the hole. Hide the whole thing with the fan, and 'voila', money saved for a little time spent. But, as I said, I am not sure if you are as cheap as I am.

Sorry to hear about the funeral. I guess if we live long enough, we won't have to go to any more...
 
Thanks. Yeah I try to stretch a dollar. Just checked price of the seal. With tax it is about $40. I pretty much sold off all my tools and then found a need to bring a Farmall H back to life to get a grandkid interested in mechanical work since he lives on a farm. I guess you should never get rid of anything 'cause sure as shoot you will need it pretty soon thereafter.
 
(quoted from post at 21:12:14 06/30/16) Thanks. Yeah I try to stretch a dollar. Just checked price of the seal. With tax it is about $40. I pretty much sold off all my tools and then found a need to bring a Farmall H back to life to get a grandkid interested in mechanical work since he lives on a farm. I guess you should never get rid of anything 'cause sure as shoot you will need it pretty soon thereafter.

Awesome! Yea, if we don't get the young ones interested in this old iron, our heritage will be lost. The skills you will teach him will serve him for a lifetime.

If you don't have a slide hammer use a regular screw in the outer edge of the seal and with a block of wood and a claw hammer you will be able to get the seal out intact. Send a note sometime about the history of the tractor... Is it some kind of a family heirloom?
 
Here is a link to my intro post. CLICK Has a bit of the story and a few pics. Only thing left on the tractor now is the rad and the last section of the steering column and the seat. Next visit will see that removed. Not getting into the guts of the tractor as it is running okay. Everything is being stripped down and re-built or repaired. Some of the dismantling is strictly for the boy to see how things work (plus a bit of fun for me). Then it will all be painted and reassembled.Regards, Jack
 
Okay, it was a good sendoff to an old friend. Lots of family and friends made sure of that. His widow is getting a good hand by many to sort out all the paper work and preparations to sell off real estate. Never easy but there is lots of support.

Back to the tractor. Sad but true, the grease seal was never going to come out with various tricks. It did not survive intact. After that, there is a spacer that took a lot of heat, a lot of penetrant and a bit of blue air. No scraped knuckles or blood letting though, so that was good. Pics show where I'm at now. My assumption is that I must drive the threaded shaft through the hub bearing for removal. Any wisdom to pass along before I take the next plunge?? Thanks, Jack
37770.jpg
37772.jpg
37773.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 14:05:39 07/10/16) Okay, it was a good sendoff to an old friend. Lots of family and friends made sure of that. His widow is getting a good hand by many to sort out all the paper work and preparations to sell off real estate. Never easy but there is lots of support.

Back to the tractor. Sad but true, the grease seal was never going to come out with various tricks. It did not survive intact. After that, there is a spacer that took a lot of heat, a lot of penetrant and a bit of blue air. No scraped knuckles or blood letting though, so that was good. Pics show where I'm at now. My assumption is that I must drive the threaded shaft through the hub bearing for removal. Any wisdom to pass along before I take the next plunge?? Thanks, Jack
37770.jpg
37772.jpg
37773.jpg

You are so close! Now you have to push that threaded tube out through the bearings. If you or a friend has a press or some kind of puller you will stand a lot better chance of not damaging the threads than using my personal favorite the hammer.
If you end up changing the bearings with new ones, feel free to pop out the plastic shield on the side of the bearing if needed so that the grease can get into the bearing from the nipple. The existing bearings may have a shield just on one side.
Good luck, hope this is helpful.
 
Getting down to the nitty gritty now. Bearings are out and I'm left with the hub and pulleys. I need to remove the front pulley and then unscrew the other.

Some pics. I believe there is a drift pin that is holding the pulley. Is that true? If so, I will punch it out and hopefully just pull off the pulley. I expect there to be rust issues in removing the other half but nothing a little heat and patience can't handle.

Always interested in opinions and experience of others.

pic 1 - the broken pulley half
pic 2 - the hub at the pump end
pic 3 - the hub at the fan end
pic 4 - the pin holding the pulley - I think

Cheers,
Jack


37853.jpg
37854.jpg
37855.jpg
37856.jpg
 

J: I have a similar pump/pulley/hub that was harvested off of a defunct 350 Wheatland Special... I don't see that drift pin looking thing on this hub yet something has to hold it in place, no?
If it is a drift pin, I don't think you can drive it through... Is it soft metal that you can drill? (I have had these apart in the distant past but can't remember.)
IHC Service Manual '4 Cylinder Carbureted Engines' #ISS-1039-1 states in section 5:
2) Remove the fan and driver assembly. (Fig. 15)
3) Remove the bearing clamp nut (17) and top bearing retainer, (15) with the front oil seal (13) and gasket free of the pulley hub. tap the oil seal out of the bearing retainer.
4) Remove the water pump body cover (1) and gasket (2) (Fig. 18). Push out the shaft with impeller (3) from the shaft end.
5) Remove the pump pulley (11) with flange. Remove the pump oil seal, front (13) ball bearing (26) and spacer (25) from the pulley. Drive the rear bearing (10) and oil seal (9) out of the opposite end of the pulley hub.
6) Remove the water pump packing and shaft bushings from the shaft sleeve (Fig. 19). Do not press or drive the sleeve (5) out unless inspection reveals that the sleeve or the pump body must be replaced.
7) When it is necessary to replace the sleeve or pump body, the sleeve may be pressed from the body with an arbor press as shown in Figure 20.

(Clear as mud since I can't send you the pictures!)
 

:) A bit clearer than mud. I do like the statement "remove" in many manuals. I guess there is an assumption it is obvious how to remove, when it sometimes can be anything but obvious.

I do think it is a drift pin and that it can be punched out. The pin was found quite by accident in cleaning off all the grime and hardened real mud. Having found that, I cleaned out the inside of the hub shaft and poked around for a while in the general vicinity of the pin. Eventually I found a pin-sized hole and dug around with a small pick until hardened grease was removed from the hole. Now at that point the pick bottomed out on the pin, probably about 1/16" into the shaft. The visible pin on the pulley is 1" from the end of the hub shaft. The hole on the inside is 1 7/16" from the end of the hub shaft, so the pin is driven in on a bit of an angle.

I guess I have nothing to lose by trying to punch it through. The inside diameter of the hub shaft provides plenty of room for the pin to fall inside.

I may not get at that today. The honey-do list has a certain priority that needs to be respected for the sake of continued marital bliss.

pic 1 - not so obvious hole inside shaft
pic 2 - small pick inserted into the hole

Cheers,
Jack
37864.jpg
37865.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 05:27:58 07/12/16)
:) A bit clearer than mud. I do like the statement "remove" in many manuals. I guess there is an assumption it is obvious how to remove, when it sometimes can be anything but obvious.

I do think it is a drift pin and that it can be punched out. The pin was found quite by accident in cleaning off all the grime and hardened real mud. Having found that, I cleaned out the inside of the hub shaft and poked around for a while in the general vicinity of the pin. Eventually I found a pin-sized hole and dug around with a small pick until hardened grease was removed from the hole. Now at that point the pick bottomed out on the pin, probably about 1/16" into the shaft. The visible pin on the pulley is 1" from the end of the hub shaft. The hole on the inside is 1 7/16" from the end of the hub shaft, so the pin is driven in on a bit of an angle.

I guess I have nothing to lose by trying to punch it through. The inside diameter of the hub shaft provides plenty of room for the pin to fall inside.

I may not get at that today. The honey-do list has a certain priority that needs to be respected for the sake of continued marital bliss.

pic 1 - not so obvious hole inside shaft
pic 2 - small pick inserted into the hole

Cheers,
Jack
37864.jpg
37865.jpg

Yes, I think you are right... That pin must just drive through. Sorry if I led you astray on that point. I have seen these broken pulleys brazed successfully and the one I have in the shed is welded. Anyway, good luck on the project and keep us posted!
 

Honey-do list done. Made it into the garage and rounded up a hammer and a few punches. Trouble is that all but two punches were too big. The two that could be used were too small. Started with the largest of those two. I could tell that I got some movement but most of that movement was bending the punch. You know what happens next. Couple more smacks and a broken punch. I could see though that the pin had moved into the pulley slightly. Well the next punch was pretty small, so I tapped as lightly as I could to see it I could get any movement. Same story with that punch but the pin moved substantially. So, off to the hardware store tomorrow for some new punches. I don't feel too bad. Those punches have been in use for over 40 years so I suppose it is time for a new set. Here is one pic showing that it is indeed a drift pin that will be holding the pulley onto the hub shaft. Cheers, Jack

37894.jpg
 
Well I now have the broken sheaf removed. The pulley was indeed held in place by a drift pin. Once the pin was removed, I was able to get movement but unable to removed the pulley. As I had said previously, I sold off most of my tools as I was not intending to be in any further need. So I did have to get a puller and improvised with a wooden block cut to the size of the hub shaft to give the puller a surface to work on. That saw the pulley removed. Now I was down to that broken sheaf. I tried tapping for a bit but did not want to break it further when it would not budge. From the look of the break, it was probably an attempt to move it that caused the break in the first place. Rust seized threads was the issue then and now. I heated it and let penetrating oil work over-night. There was a lot of rusty oil sitting underneath this morning. Tapping did not accomplish anything. I ran in two fan bolts onto the hub and then mounted that is the vise. A locking chain wrench spun it off like a charm. So, unless I find a replacement, we'll see if this one can be repaired. Regards to all. Jack

38013.jpg
38014.jpg
38015.jpg
38016.jpg
38018.jpg
38019.jpg
 
Gotta keep learning. I see on the Case IH site the part is called a "flange". Of course, they do not have one. Now the store on this site does have one but they don't deliver to Canada, so I'm stuck for a bit. Need to find an enthusiast somewhere close to the Sasktatchewan border to send stuff to. Could drive down, buy someone a beer and bring my treasure home. A road trip is always a good idea but my real long distance days are behind me. Anyway, I will sort it all out somehow. I see this flange is also cracked on the other side of the punch point. A bit of a design flaw maybe. I suspect there are a lot of these flanges out there that broke from trying to move them once the threads were rusted. Anyway, this old H won't be seeing much real work anymore. Once it is rolling again, a parade or two each year and a display item for the century farm yard will be its retirement role.

Here's how it looks at the moment. The oil filter canister is nice and shiny. That was the first thing done when we changed the oil. Always good to have some fresh oil in there when it hasn't been started for a couple decades. Still have to get the rad off but the steering shaft is being stubborn and that goes right through the rad reservoir to a nut that refuses to turn so far. Will eventually win. Also the valve cover will come off. Will set valve clearances and timing to smooth out how it runs.

Cheers, Jack
38039.jpg
38040.jpg
 

There are US 'mail addresses' that stuff can be sent to near the Canuck border... Such as 'Connie's Depot' South of Winkler Manitoba... I assume there are businesses South of Saskatchewan also.. I have no idea what to goo goo google for that.

Looks like you have your work cut out for you! Keep up the good work.
 

This may be the part that you need:

Yesterday's Tractors water pump pulley flange part # 6598DX

external_link water pump pulley flange part #IHS033.

Please check websites to verify accuracy of part number.
 

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Back
Top