Running a 12 volt hydraulic pump on 6 volts????

wilsonsk

Member
Anyone ever tried running a 12 volt hydraulic pump set-up on 6 volts? I picked up a Western snow plow and want to hang it on my loader, wondering if the it would lift and turn the plow running on 6 volts. This will ultimately push me into converting, but just thinking short term, will it work? I understand that it will basically run at half speed, half power, but will the pump generate enough pressure to work?
 
It may work for a short time but at half the volts the motor will draw more amps and that in turn will cause it to burn it self out so for what it would cost to replace that pump is it worth it??? If nothing else set a 12 volt battery some place on the machine just to run that hyd pump and be on the safe side. A full charged 12 volt battery will last for hours on that set up
 
ohh....i'd add a 12v one wire alternator on either the belt pulley or the pto and he could charge the battery too!!!
 
One wire heck no those things cost twice what a 3 wire does and it would be simple to just add a switch to turn the alternator on but since he did say he might be going to 12 volts why bother with an alternator or do it right
 
thanks for all of the good info, if there is a chance of burning up the pump, I won't try it. I have a Ford alternator just need a voltage regulator, battery, coil and the time to do it. I may just hang the blade on the bucket so I can move some snow. thanks for the help.
 
Shoot for around $50 you can buy an Delco alternator for say a 1980 Chev pick up no power any thing and that is a simple 3 wire hook up and then you do not have to mess with an external V.R which are a pain in the back sides any how
 
Years ago they used to have a small 110volt generator tthat. Mounted to a car or truck engine like an alternator. It was all self contained, it would run a drill or skilsaw. Was a pretty handy deal. Would like to find one of them .
 
Ya no all that common any more. A good many of those where DC so would run a drill etc but not things like a radio etc
 

I agree the GM alternator is probably a better choice, but I have the Ford alternator and a VR is $15. I may as well use it. Need a coil and battery either way.
 
You do not have to replace the coil all you do is add a ballast resister between the ignition switch and the coil O'Reilly's part number VR-1 works well and can be mounted to a thin piece of metal so as to have a heat sink and it cost less then $5
 

I thought I needed a ballast resistor (or coil with an internal resistor) and a 12V coil vs 6V coil. Either way, it's probably a horse apiece, a 12v coil with internal resistor is $9.99, and I should put a new on on anyway.
 
No such thing as a coil with an internal resister. The 12 volt coils are wound different so as to be a true 12 volt coil due to higher resistance in the way they are wound
 
It will overheat it and eventually burn it up. 12 volts to a 6 volt pump is fine. Not the other way around.
 
I buy brand new self-excite "one wire" regulators the same price as conventional. About $11 either way.
 
Sure there is. All coils have internal resistors - i.e. the windings. A coil sold as not needing an external ballast resistor for a 12 volt system simply has the equivalent of the the external ballast resistor windings rolled into the internals.

Outside or inside - it's still a bunch of small wire windings to create resistance.

Regardless if a "6 volt" coil with separate resistor outside, or a "12 volt coil" with no outside coil of wire or carbon resistor wire (like GM and Deere use sometimes) - it will all total somewhere around 3-4 ohms on the primary.
 
That is you and then you have an hour or so labor in it to install so countered productive and you also then do not have the life time warranty on the alternator so why the heck do it that way since in the long run it will cost you a lot more
 
As per electronic terms as taught in such school no. It is wound in such a way so as not to have the need for a resister but the wire is not a resister but is just wound so that there is no need for a resister which it in fact 2 different things. Navy ET and electronics tek for decades as in since 1974. I have forgot man thing when it comes to electronics that few ever learned. If you understand electronics explain this. Bad Boys Rape Our Young Daughters But Violet Give Willing Lee
 
We had a transfer pump out of a B29 airplane that was 24 volts and we ran it on 12 volts at times. It would still pump a lot of gas or diesel fuel. It had 1/1/4" pipe thread on the intake and discharge. One of my co-workers had a leaking 275 gallon fuel tank and we used that pump to pump the fuel oil into another tank until we removed the old tank and installed a new one. Then pumped the fuel back into the new tank. I think that pump is still being used where I retired from. Hal
 
(quoted from post at 12:31:50 12/11/12)f nothing else set a 12 volt battery some place on the machine just to run that hyd pump and be on the safe side. A full charged 12 volt battery will last for hours on that set up

Most older plow pumps draw between 150 and 200 amps so you need to be constantly charging the battery if your going to be really using that pump... A fully charged battery won't last too long if you have to lift and angle the plow more than a couple of times (trust me I've been there and done it).....
 
Ya but still better then burning out the pump which a 6 volt battery would do over time. That said I have had more then one tractor with a bad charging system and I could run them for months on a battery before charging and I figure I got at least 10-15 engine starts before I had to recharge the battery
 
(quoted from post at 08:31:29 12/14/12)That said I have had more then one tractor with a bad charging system and I could run them for months on a battery before charging and I figure I got at least 10-15 engine starts before I had to recharge the battery

Running the tractor and running a 200 amp plow pump are two different things. Drawing that kind of amperage out of a battery without charging it is a sure fire way to destroy a good battery in no time.....
 
Wrong That is what a deep cycle battery is made to do and I have many times used a battery in just such as I said and have yet to destroy one
 
Maybe down south you can get away with that. UP here I would have to stop and charge that battery up about 10X a day when plowing snow. That kind of discharge and recharge would kill even the best of deep cycle batteries in less than a winter.
 
Why keep attacking what I said why not help this guy out like I tried to do in the first place but no instead you keep on attacking me which just makes this down right stupid on your part and does not help this guy and does not make me think your out for much else then to attack what I have said which does not help him and just makes you my enemy
 
He should mount the biggest 12v alternator he can on the tractor and then couple that with the biggest battery he can stuff in the tray and then hook the plow pump up.

I have a 86 chevy with an 85? amp alternator and two good batteries. Even with that setup the lights go dim when the plow is raised or angled. And if I'm plowing in a tight areas with lots of lifting and angling the alternator really starts to whine. Been meaning to pick up another alternator and mount it under the hood somehow.
 
First off this is not an attack at you.
This last statement of yours had got me thinking. You have one of 3 things to think about.
#1 Not all Hydro/electric units are the same and some draw a heck of a lot more amps then others.
#2 your unit has a weak motor so it draws way to many amps.
#3 The hyd oil you use is thicker then the units I have owned over the years
I have owned 3 of these hydro/electric units and none of them had that big an map draw. One was on a toter and was used for hooking up the mobile home and we did not run the engine when doing so and never a starting problem.
Another on on a Dodge 3/4 ton truck and it was used on a dump bed and we would lift that bed all the time with out the engine running and never a high amp draw and an engine start problem.
But these units used ATF as the hyd fluid and that means thin oil so any one of those come into play so what you say maybe right in your case but not in all cases. Understand what I am saying so we both are likely to be right at some point so we both can not know for sure which of use it correct
 
(quoted from post at 09:08:25 12/15/12)#1 Not all Hydro/electric units are the same and some draw a heck of a lot more amps then others.
#2 your unit has a weak motor so it draws way to many amps.
#3 The hyd oil you use is thicker then the units I have owned over the years

#1. He said it is an old Western unit. I happen to have 2 western plow pumps, both an old cable control unit and a newer solenoid control unit. They both draw between 180 and 200 measured amps. Guess what the instruction manuals for both advertise 180-200 amps as their max draw.

#2. One of my units has a new motor and the other is pretty new and still in great working order.

#3. Both units are running the manufacture spec'd ATF fluid.

Your applications are different than continuous snow plowing. The toter you probably lifted up the mobile home and then hauled it someplace thus having the motor running and charging the battery. The dump truck you probably dumped a load and then drove someplace to load it back up. Not sure why anybody would raise a dump bed or lift mobile homes continuously all day without charging a battery, just like nobody who plows snow would/could operate without charging the battery.

Come up north where it really snows and hop in a plow truck with somebody and count how many times they raise or angle the plow over the course of an afternoon. You would be surprised and how much you are using that pump and drawing those kinds of amps. There's a reason that most guys who plow run larger amp alternators and dual batteries. Sure you can raise it and angle it a few times on a full charge but not enough to finish your driveway.

Maybe down in Mo where you get maybe 20 inches of snow over the course of a season you could get away with it as you don't have to plow very much at all.
 
Still again it can in fact depend on the pump unit and the amp draw of said unit. Yes I understand on a plow rig you may or may not run the pump a lot or a little and that all depends on what your plowing and how to plow it. I simple long drive way you may only lift ti a few times but a parking lot you lift ti a lot so unless you know and I know what he is going to do neither one of use can be correct and I did not notice that he said where he was. As for coming up north no thanks BTDT and not any more. Yes I have lived up in MN still have family up there as well as a number of other places up north so yes I know the weather. The whole point is that you and I can not be sure which is correct because we are not hands on and there working his machine so to attack one is wrong but to give an opinion is another thing
 
Digits for resistor values, There is no color starting with "D" but there is "G" for green Bad boys do not rape young daughters but they do rape young girls "G" Green band on resistor. Ok I guess every young girl is some dad's daughter.

I never had any trouble getting students to understand the color bands on resistors since I learned that.

60 Acre Hillside. Technology Teacher Applied Electricity (years ago)
 
I learned that in Navy A school for basic electronics the went to B school for computer maintenance/repair. Learned to hate working on electronics so gave it up and did engines and welding and other hands on such. Boy have the computers changed since I use to fix them
 
12V motor on 6V will only develop 1/4 of it"s rated HP. So if
pump pack was rated for 1000psi, it would max out the motor
at approx 250psi.
 
Most DC Hydraulic pump motors used on a snowplow system or dump box or the like are a series-wound type. They will run just fine on 6 volts DC source. But the speed will be much reduced. They will not overheat any more than when running on 12 Volts, even running a longer time. And that is good because the flow will be very slow.
You cannot predict with certainty how much slower without information on the motor itself.
The maximum pressure developed will probably not change, unless the pump runs so slow that internal leakage takes a large part of the flow.
DC motors are very different than AC motors, and there are different types that further complicate things. If it was a permanent magnet motor, for instance, half the voltage would result in half the speed. But when you throw in a series field you get something different.
All that being said, if you are going to be below zero degrees F; I would suggest using a Synthetic fluid in the system instead of ATF. Lubriplate Low-pour or Shell Aero; or the Fisher Blue stuff is good. Not cheap, though.
 

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