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Tractor Pulling Discussion Forum

Open Class update

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Bryan Lively

02-25-2013 23:00:03




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While the thread on the opportunity for new open classes has escaped to page 3, Ive been collecting the feedback here, in person, and on the phone to make this work and I am getting a lot of conflicting ideas, mostly with the development of the 4750# class. The heavy class is already well established.

Here's whats important:
1) Safety--blanket, flywheel, side shields, adequate wheelie bars, kill switch/air shut-off. No exceptions. I said that from the get-go. Spectators demand a show without dodging pieces of cast iron.

2) Quality numbers: 12-15 tractors is a good number to me, any more than that is a big plus!

3) Happy Pullers, Promoters, Sanctioning bodies, and most importantly--fans.

How the gaps are filled in with whatever limitations you put on an Open class is up for debate.

One more thought: Im the messenger, and I have been asked to help out on this, so aiming at me will do you no good though I am hard to miss. The above three things are what's important to me. I don't have an agenda other than to help a sanctioning group and a seemingly willing group of pullers meet in the middle and put on a show for fans. Thats all.

If you have any questions or comments beyond whats been said here previously let me know here or at rblively@hotmail.com. Thanks again for everyone's input.

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bock

02-27-2013 19:20:55




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
what about a turbo class with lets say 6 mph. and 20/ 30 percent over on rpm.s that would be something that could be built to run cheaply and could even run against n.a. tractors . and with a mph. would be fair for all



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H-66

02-28-2013 02:55:45




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to bock, 02-27-2013 19:20:55  
I have a novel idea. Use the same rules as the heavy class and man up an go pull. It"s 4750 "OPEN". No cubic inch limit no rpm limit no speed limit.



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mmgvi

02-28-2013 08:30:50




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to H-66, 02-28-2013 02:55:45  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see that's how it should be with no age limit



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natural puller

02-26-2013 18:47:19




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
We've been doing the N/A class for 25yrs here in eastern IN/west and central OH. TRI STATE N.A.S.S Association.We have 12-15 tractors.This group makes up the COTPA Div.5 N/A class.No personal injuries to date from tractors.We run safety equipment including rollcages.Tech your tractors before they hook the first time for safety requirements.A cube limit not favoring the big engines would be a plus. J.M.H.O.

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VicS

02-26-2013 18:24:35




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
I would kinda be interested in a 4750 V8 class. Small Block,Na, no cu in limit, no rpm limit. But have to use a tractor rear,trans, and hood. I know they already pull tractors like this, but why reinvent the wheel! They can go plenty fast and make a lot of noise!



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Randy Babbitt

02-26-2013 17:14:09




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
Damn Bryan u gotta hell of a fan club started to say the least!!!



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roughcut

02-26-2013 14:40:20




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
I built a llss because of this.Bryan u do great job !! The guys here r spending there wheels in the mud. It would be great class to have. Safety is great to have when needed.so build they will come!!!!!



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buckeyebrierhopper1

02-26-2013 13:00:33




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
great idea, one ? how would you set up rule for example a g john deere? most dont run over 1500rpm,what about steel fly wheel,scatter blankets,4750 wt is make able, wt to spare. i would love to try but those wouldnt let me hook. i have all the required safety equipment an preach it at any pull i go to,kinda restricting to only certain types of tractors.



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jd b puller

02-27-2013 08:12:10




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to buckeyebrierhopper1, 02-26-2013 13:00:33  
Briarhopper,
I don't think this is a class where many G's, including yours, would do well.

If there's no speed limit and no RPM limit, the Farmalls with RD's will be cruizing at 12-20MPH, your 8MPH just won't cut it...

If there was an RPM limit or a speed limit, it would be a different story. With neither, it would be tough, and no, I don't think you need a scatter blanket at 20% RPM's, but the general theme is "open", so most will run it as hard as they can and you need to emphasize safety.

Not saying a JD can't be built to run that class, but it will take a lot more coin to get one to run and stay together than using the "Lego" method of putting a high HP, High RPM motor in like the other brands can do.

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just

02-26-2013 14:07:45




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to buckeyebrierhopper1, 02-26-2013 13:00:33  
its simple, you wouldnt set a G up like that. itd be simpler/safer to build a tube chassis with a 466 n G sheetmetal. this is not antique pulling, its primative ntpa thinking with modern day acceptance. I know rd powered IHs can make 4000lbs, MMs can make 4500 with room to play, Olivers n JDs wouldnt compete well in these classes and they know it. History is trying to repeat itself, and the thought process hasnt changed in 25yrs. you wouldnt put your unexperienced 14yr old on an open rpm tractor would ya? would you let the same kid race flat out in a viper or new corvette would ya?

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Sadowsky

02-26-2013 16:52:17




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to just, 02-26-2013 14:07:45  
i agree on the deeres, but why wouldn't the olivers compete? they'll make that weight easy, can run either big cubes low rpms, or low cubes big rpms. i've seen olivers run 12 mph+ at that weight.



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Dave Saegrove

02-26-2013 11:35:54




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
I've thought about these open classes for a long time now, and there is just something I can't seem to understand. If someone can explain it to me I'd appreciate it. I hear about the thousands and thousands of $ spent to try to get 5000 RPM and 200 HP out of old antique motors. Why wouldn't someone just come up with a class where you could throw in a $500 big block V8...could safely turn 5000 RPM and make 200 HP easy without all the $ and arguing? Not trying to be a downer at all, just wondering.

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Oliver880

02-26-2013 12:08:25




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Dave Saegrove, 02-26-2013 11:35:54  
That class already exists in western PA and eastern OH. And it has great attendance and is growing.



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ohman

02-26-2013 13:14:11




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Oliver880, 02-26-2013 12:08:25  
where do you pull.in western pa



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LCB

02-26-2013 07:36:52




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
As said before my 2 cents worth open RPMs is going to kill us if we have a accdent.I think our insurnce will get so high that we will be out of busness.My idea is let every one run same RPMs 3000 sounds like a good number to me.



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Dieselbear

02-27-2013 16:06:31




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to LCB, 02-26-2013 07:36:52  
I for one don't want to be around any two banger turning 3000 rpm



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Ed Carlsen

02-26-2013 06:53:50




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
This is a great Idea. Limit the rules that don"t apply to an open class OPEN MEANS OPEN. No speed limit, No RPM limit. Don"t like the class don"t pull in it. SAFTEY IS THE MOST IMPORTANT Run what you brung But have your safty equipment. Wheele bars,kill switch / air shut-off, Steel fly wheel, saftey blanket, side shields,Fenders,Dead mans throttle,electric fan or shielded, No curved exhaust pipes 18.4-38 largest tire 1959 or older tractor Naturally aspirated class and turbo class Just a few saftey ideas.To many rules spoil the sport This is about who can pull the furthest with no limitations and do it safely Just my thoughts

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Ehren

02-26-2013 17:44:47




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Ed Carlsen, 02-26-2013 06:53:50  
Look at the IPA Outlaw class. NA unlimited size (carb, fuel injection and diesel) and diesel with a small turbo. It is a fun class with a good set of rules.



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The Inquirer

02-26-2013 16:57:41




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Ed Carlsen, 02-26-2013 06:53:50  
Mr. Ed, You sounded like a real serious puller until you showed your chicken $hit side. What's with this 1959 and older? Tell us all just what you are scared of! 25 years and older is considered an antique. Lets make it fun for all and move year model up to at least 1965 or newer would be better yet. There won't be anything stock about anything in a class like this anyway so why segregate?



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Ed Carlsen

02-27-2013 20:38:55




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to The Inquirer, 02-26-2013 16:57:41  
Antique has been 1959 and older but your right don"t make much difference in a class like this.



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MH49

02-26-2013 06:33:27




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-25-2013 23:00:03  
I should have chimed in last go around but my $0.02 is unless you put a cube limit or a mph of some sort, it will be an all Moline and Case class pretty quick. If you look at COTPA NA class, even with fuel injection the small blocks have trouble keeping up with the big cube guys.



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Results from Friday say

03-03-2013 17:25:50




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to MH49, 02-26-2013 06:33:27  
Shoobridge's small block won at Eaton on Friday in the NA Class. Beiser's Case was 2nd and Gortner's Ford (maybe a small block)was 3rd. Butler's MM was 4th.



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gfs

02-26-2013 07:41:10




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to MH49, 02-26-2013 06:33:27  
4750 will cut alot of the big cube tractors from worry. The 65 is their class let the rest run in the lower class. Personally, don't make a rule that u don't want to spend the time to enforce. I like it just wish it had come a few years back and more in my area.



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smokeshow

02-26-2013 09:49:40




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to gfs, 02-26-2013 07:41:10  
What about the 460/560 +600ci RD501 engines. They can get down to 4750lbs. Id say the 4750 class will be full of them. Unless they limit the ci to 400 or something.



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MH49

02-26-2013 10:55:09




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to smokeshow, 02-26-2013 09:49:40  
What if you used LLSS cube limits for open rpm and then open cubes for say 2800 max rpm? Set the RPM with a MSD chip, easy to check. Little harder for Diesel but would anybody want to run a Diesel in a class like this?



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mmgvi

02-26-2013 10:28:23




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to smokeshow, 02-26-2013 09:49:40  
That's it the crying has already started put a band on RDS and kill the class before it ever starts



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just

02-26-2013 11:19:26




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to mmgvi, 02-26-2013 10:28:23  
just another way to take the antique out of antique pulling. when it comes down to it, a puller would have to spend 8 grand on safety equipment that can fail at any moment just to even show up. thats why theres ATPA/NTPA where the big money lies! Hook was a true antique pulling magazine in the beginning, now its going all go fast high dollar.



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sadowsky

02-26-2013 11:38:50




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to just, 02-26-2013 11:19:26  
Hook went away from antique because antique pulling nationwide is nowhere near as popular as it was 15 years ago. bottom line.



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TROY HEATH

02-26-2013 08:31:56




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to gfs, 02-26-2013 07:41:10  
SOUMDS GOOD BRYAN,THANKS FOR YOUR EFFORT,LOL,YOU HAD TOO KNOW YOU WAS OPENING UP A CAN OF WORMS THOUGH.



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Bryan Lively

02-26-2013 14:39:30




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to TROY HEATH, 02-26-2013 08:31:56  
Seems I have opened up a can of worms Troy.



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just

02-27-2013 08:07:12




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-26-2013 14:39:30  
lol, for what ive said, its just an opinion. you should work with natpa to build this class n rebuild division 5. i think youve got pull to talk to the antique community n work with current organizations that youd be a part of rebuilding something that could bring more to natpa.



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Cody

02-27-2013 07:38:06




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 Re: Open Class update in reply to Bryan Lively, 02-26-2013 14:39:30  
Type,Type,Type,......delete,delete,delete....



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