Running E85? Compression?

Mopower · Sep 18, 2012

Is anyone using E85 out there? What compression ratio are you using? Compression psi check? Detonation? It's cheap and available. I thought I'd try it in a fairly stock engine with 9.2 to 9.8:1 compression. The government octane rating on this stuff is misleading propoganda, but it's still a step up from premium.

Thanks.

P.S. I'm talking old tractors here, not new cars or hot rods.

H-66 · Sep 18, 2012

I am running E-85 in my 45 farmall H. It"s about 10:1 compression, last time I checked the cylinder pressure was mid 190"s. Seems to run good on it but I have not had a chance to dyno it to see if it"s actually better than 110 octane at $7 a gallon. Only bad thing is it collects moisture when the tractor sits in the shed over the course of a week. It sure doesn"t seem to be any worse than the race gas for performance.

Anonymous-0 · Sep 18, 2012

you can run 10 to 11.1 relatively higher compression with any pump gas if you use motorcycle plugs

Ole Johnny · Sep 18, 2012

E85, if im not mistaken, is supposed to be 85% methanol and 15% gasolene. Since methanol is VERY high octain fuel, when you diloute it with a 15% mixture of gas, it shoudl still be WAY up there in octain. You should be able to run 10 to 1 easily I would think.
As you stated, its a tractor and not a drag car but I used methanol in my supercharged drag car that had static compression of 11 to one and at full boost the compression ratio went up to near 30 to 1. So E85 should handle lots of compression and pressure.

Ole Johnny · Sep 18, 2012

E85 might be made from Ethanol instead of Methanol. But same outcome..

Hittin' Hard · Sep 18, 2012

I'm running it in a decent sized unstyled jd b and it seems to really do pretty good on it.

jd b puller · Sep 18, 2012

(quoted from post at 18:23:00 09/18/12) Is anyone using E85 out there? What compression ratio are you using? Compression psi check? Detonation? It's cheap and available. I thought I'd try it in a fairly stock engine with 9.2 to 9.8:1 compression. The government octane rating on this stuff is misleading propoganda, but it's still a step up from premium.

Thanks.

P.S. I'm talking old tractors here, not new cars or hot rods.

Ethan, I ran my 442CI B with 11:1 compression on it and it seemed to really like it.

Allis Fields · Sep 18, 2012

what are the fuel delivery consers running e85 ? like type of fuel line filter shut off valve carb gaskets. I know that gas with 10% ethonal a chain saw or lawn mower weed waker gets all gumed up and eats away at the fuel system.

39MPuller · Sep 19, 2012

I am running a 50/50 mixture of E85 and 93 in a Farmall Super M with 215 cranking pressure and it works outstanding. I actually gained about 3 horse onthe dyno when switching. My guess would be the gas helps it burn a little slower than the 110 octane racing fuel. I have since converted several other tractor in he pulling club with very similar results.

BL puller · Sep 19, 2012

Would E 85 help or lower performance with lower compression engines? (stock compression) Just looking for something extra in stock classes.

Ole Johnny · Sep 19, 2012

NO, it would most likely hurt performance. High octain is used ONLY to facilitate higher compression so detination wont occur. High compression fuel burns 'slower' and thus would make less power

Ole Johnny · Sep 19, 2012

I was told several times by Top Alcohol Dragster pit crues that Methanon or Ethanol are rated at 140 octain. So using it in any gas formula would raise the octain rating BUT unless you use alot more of it when done so, you are running a lean condition as alcohol is about 8 to 1 ratio as compared to 14 to 1 gas ratio to run properly

Ole Johnny · Sep 19, 2012

442 ci B engine!!! You make me feel like my A is a lawn-mower. LOL
Hey, thanks for all your help Ray.

High Octane · Sep 19, 2012

39M,, try your mix with 87 octane instead of 93. itll give you a bit more power n still be fine. I ran 275psi on 50/50 87 n e85. gained me 10ft! dont run e85 straight. Use it with your pump gas to control detonation n preignition. a lil goes a long way on your checkbook.

Pmer · Sep 19, 2012

Here in Minnesota on the pump it says that E85 is a minmum of 70% Ethanol. They use corn to make it. So at one point in the process it is pure grain alcohol that you can drink. But it's denatured before it is mixed with gas.

They also make some rreeaallyy smooth vodka called Shakers.

I have run it un mixed in a couple fairly stock tractors with no trouble. Just have to open the load circut so you can stall it on the rich side.

David G · Sep 20, 2012

E85 will definitely help with detonation issues, but it also has less BTU's than high octane pure gasoline.

mm585 · Sep 21, 2012

Okay,,,,,so tell me, where is the line then? I can see e-85 helping with detination problems because its a slower burning fuel than pump gas, thus it should work well with a high compresion engine, However, 110VP is also a slow burning fuel that takes care of detination BUT it makes more BTU's that E-85. When we ran methanal not ethanal in a race car it took twice the amount of fuel to make a bit less power than we could have made with race gas(without nitro methane).It wasnt consistant, we had to rejet when the sun went down, or on hot days ect. The benefit was that It burned cold, the car never got hot, we had to cover up the radiator to get it up to temp. Outside of the cost of e-85 vs race gas, or mabie a dry block setup may run cooler, whats the advantage to trying to get a tractor to run on ethanal? You cant just pour it in and go, theres a bunch of tuning and trial and eror involved. Is it work the risk of spending a high dollar motor to save half on your fuel cost? The companys that make race gas spend thousands of dollars on R&D. There job is to make your engine stay together and run hard. E-85 on the outher hand is regulated by the goverment! Im not trying to stir the pot here, this is just my 2 cents worth.If anyone can make it work better than race gas Im hear to listen!!

mm585 · Sep 21, 2012

sorry mopower, I didnt see the p.s. about hot rods. I was talking about the div 4 and 5 tractors with big cubes and high compresion.

Mopower · Sep 21, 2012

No problem. Very good explanation and good points. I'll be running a faily stock and very cheap 220 cube engine at 9.8:1 and 1980rpm. From what I've seen here, I'm not pushing the envelope with detonation issues and cheap gov't fuel ought to run ok. Heck, we've already been forced to pay for its production with our taxes. I might as well get some good out of it. LP is my other option, but the fuel delivery and set-up is not my expertise & is a little pricey. I'll save LP for the stroker. I like working on my my Marvel-Schebler carbs.

DAVE Thompson jr · Sep 21, 2012

Ethan you have been around enough to know what a good engine costs. Why wouldnt you just spend the money and buy some good 112 octane fuel and be done with it. Saving a few dollars isnt worth it considering the damage you can do running E85 gas. What are you really saving?

mm585 · Sep 21, 2012

Aha yes, the lp theory, Im working on that one right now on my hd800 powered massey 95. There again good octaine figures, but less btu's than race gas. Why is it that moline could make more horse power on lp than gasoline when all there competitors made less power? One theroy is that moline had High compresion heads and the others didnt. I guess that guy never saw a 450 farmall propaine head? Im not sure but I beleve most of the other companys used the same heads but high compresion pistons. Question still being why did MM make more power on LP than gasoline when the others couldent?

Mopower · Sep 21, 2012

It was a $750 stock engine with 500 hours on it, not a high performance or high dollar pulling engine. Based on what people have done, there will be no risk of damage or detonation. Especially on this 220 MM power unit (9.8:1). E85 is sold just down the road for even less than 87oct. I can also run a common fuel with my other stock 336 MM power unit (9.1:1). If I were able, everything I have would run on LP, but on these two, this ought to do the trick.

Mopower · Sep 21, 2012

Alcohol also runs less BTU than gas, but can make much more power. You simply use more of it (air:fuel ratio). Other brands can run just as well on LP. I'm not saying high octane gas can't make more horsepower, but in many cases, octane and compression are not the only limiting factors.

Running E85? Compression?

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